CheesusChrist
Member
Do we have any Character strats anyone can share? I have a real hard time with Koko and Fang
Bass Matchups/Character Strats
- Thread starter CheesusChrist
- Start date
Want to say that I see what you're saying with Fang. Had some offline casuals with Blackula.
Her
and are things to heavily consider.
In addition she's one of the two characters in the game with back-turned parries, which nullifies his guaranteed 6KP from kitchen sink push away. However, I still suggest assuming it won't be parried because 9/10 times it isn't. Then if you know they are going to parry you can just put them in the same kitchen sink push away throw or do some other hold punishment.
Lastly her mid-kick holds are devastating and honestly that's the primary pokes for Bass ( and )
So basically you have to approach the match-up "with caution".
Her
and are things to heavily consider.In addition she's one of the two characters in the game with back-turned parries, which nullifies his guaranteed 6KP from kitchen sink push away. However, I still suggest assuming it won't be parried because 9/10 times it isn't. Then if you know they are going to parry you can just put them in the same kitchen sink push away throw or do some other hold punishment.
Lastly her mid-kick holds are devastating and honestly that's the primary pokes for Bass (
and )So basically you have to approach the match-up "with caution".
CheesusChrist
Member
Want to say that I see what you're saying with Fang. Had some offline casuals with Blackula.
Her
In addition she's one of the two characters in the game with back-turned parries, which nullifies his guaranteed 6KP from kitchen sink push away. However, I still suggest assuming it won't be parried because 9/10 times it isn't. Then if you know they are going to parry you can just put them in the same kitchen sink push away throw or do some other hold punishment.
Lastly her mid-kick holds are devastating and honestly that's the primary pokes for Bass (
So basically you have to approach the match-up "with caution".
it sucks, most times i feel im "with caution" with most characters im up against, sooo fang is.. "extreme caution?"
Keep your throws handy. Also, I'm pretty sure low OHs can do a pretty swell job if you're absolutely positive she in going to crush you (which she will).
Batcommander
Well-Known Member
Dammit i knew there was something about Fang, sigh. Bitch just beats everything i throw at her, and you are right, 1PP and 1P+K are deadly.
The fang i fought this weekend abused this and i felt pretty helpless.
The fang i fought this weekend abused this and i felt pretty helpless.
Feng can be pretty annoying. Most Fang players may go for 4kk, 1K and mix it up with 46p. 4KK on Counter hit can lead to a free 46P as well. It's usually the same mix up and in-between those they'd go for 4P+K parry and 1P+K quite often and you can't try to hit her out of it with your usual pokes like 6K or 3K.
Batcommander
Well-Known Member
3k whiffs on leifang BT charge punch. Yeah, i hate this bitch.
I've been testing some stuff out in practice mode and both 1P+K and 1P count as standing attack, meaning that if you want to beat those in case she tries to crush you, then 66H+P does the job. 6K also can potentially beat out 1P or 1P+K if close.
1P+K is just one of those things you have to deal with and holds and SS are you're only sure tools in these situations. I'm sure there will probably be better ways of handling this situations, but if you try to use 33P, she can easily parry it with 4P+K (only punches). Another very nasty crush in the neutral game is 46P which is 13i and can crush high moves and takes the piss.
But, these crush moves with the exception of 1P+K are punishable:
1PP is -12, -11 with guaranteed 4H+P for Bass
46P is -12 with guaranteed 11i or lower throw punish
Just mash on the throw button, trust me, it'll work.
You need to determine whether she's going to use her high or mid parries or her Ushu in most situations, especially after a ground pickup where she can just completely ignore whatever you're doing and go for her parries. The only move that is not parryable is 3P+K and she can actually throw punish you if she holds it with either a neutral throw or forward throw. Anything slow than that will be beaten out. She can also beat you with anything 17i-18i since she can end up behind you in certain situations.
Another thing is to stagger escape a lot. Leifang player will also abuse 2H+K because they can mix it up with 4K if you try and SS it and your SS moves can be crushed by 1P+K too. Just play Emperor Cow and you'll figure what works and why you need to constantly stagger escape her.
Also, try to deal with not getting yourself caught with her OH when you're back is to the wall because it's a reset.
I think other characters should also be taken into consideration, even low tier ones. I always feel vulnerable in the neutral game with this character and finding new ways of gaining momentum might help dealing with most of these matchups.
1P+K is just one of those things you have to deal with and holds and SS are you're only sure tools in these situations. I'm sure there will probably be better ways of handling this situations, but if you try to use 33P, she can easily parry it with 4P+K (only punches). Another very nasty crush in the neutral game is 46P which is 13i and can crush high moves and takes the piss.
But, these crush moves with the exception of 1P+K are punishable:
1PP is -12, -11 with guaranteed 4H+P for Bass
46P is -12 with guaranteed 11i or lower throw punish
Just mash on the throw button, trust me, it'll work.
You need to determine whether she's going to use her high or mid parries or her Ushu in most situations, especially after a ground pickup where she can just completely ignore whatever you're doing and go for her parries. The only move that is not parryable is 3P+K and she can actually throw punish you if she holds it with either a neutral throw or forward throw. Anything slow than that will be beaten out. She can also beat you with anything 17i-18i since she can end up behind you in certain situations.
Another thing is to stagger escape a lot. Leifang player will also abuse 2H+K because they can mix it up with 4K if you try and SS it and your SS moves can be crushed by 1P+K too. Just play Emperor Cow and you'll figure what works and why you need to constantly stagger escape her.
Also, try to deal with not getting yourself caught with her OH when you're back is to the wall because it's a reset.
I think other characters should also be taken into consideration, even low tier ones. I always feel vulnerable in the neutral game with this character and finding new ways of gaining momentum might help dealing with most of these matchups.
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Batcommander
Well-Known Member
these are really good tips, thank you. I thought Fang was in crouching when using 1PP and shoulder, this is good to know.
Any tips against Helena?
I use 6k alot. It seems like the only mid that Bass has that can't be crushed. Throw in the occasional 6 h+k at mid-range. She is also really unsafe so punish accordingly..
I've found 6h+K work really well since she likes her lows.
Indeed. 6k and 6h+k when at neutral. I'm sure you already know how to go to town when shes stunned
Any tips against Momiji and Christie?
If you step her 6P or 6PP (forget which at the top of my head) you can punish her even if she tries to string afterwards. Also any time she's in the air while you guarded try using 44P+K as it will step you around to her back but the move she uses and how quick she did it will deterimen the disadvantage/advantage.
Christie, you have to just guess on holds. Christie's most practical negative is her throw damage, being thrown while holding shouldn't be a deterrent. She has a lot of mix-up potential if you're in stun both for early-threshold and late-threshold launches. Learn which strings are unsafe and the optimal throw to punish with + your reaction time.
If you're playing them online, only advice I have to you is to just unplug the controller or leave the lobby, it's the only way not to get infuriated.
Christie, you have to just guess on holds. Christie's most practical negative is her throw damage, being thrown while holding shouldn't be a deterrent. She has a lot of mix-up potential if you're in stun both for early-threshold and late-threshold launches. Learn which strings are unsafe and the optimal throw to punish with + your reaction time.
If you're playing them online, only advice I have to you is to just unplug the controller or leave the lobby, it's the only way not to get infuriated.
I've been fighting a lot of matches against loads of different characters lately. Most of these are very common and popular choices. These include Zack, Ein, Jann Lee and Mila.
I've played this MU for the last few years since original DOA5 and I've seen a lot of different play styles with her. Mila mostly tries to bully you into submission and you want to stop mila players from doing that.
This matchup usually revolves around finding holes in her offense and punishing her unsafe moves. These usually end up being her strings, including those cancellable into her takedown feints and transitions where she'd definitely start using her her low kick string from that, starting a stun game and putting you under pressure until you react and punish it. Usually most players immediately do the ... and the weakness of this particular offense is that it's a low-high string and clearly exploitable. It all comes down to familiarization with this match up such as her strings. If she does the low kick from a stance, it can stun you, so keep that in mind.
Another thing to keep in mind is her takedown especially in early round situations such as sidestep into takedown which can be common among Mila players. The best response to this is to wait and low throw punish this attempt to give a clear message to the other player that you cannot be bullied easily.
Another important fact is that all takedown transitions can be punished on block, so next time you feel a mila player might be doing a string into a takedown feint, low throw for punishment.
Another thing to watch out for are situations where a player would stun you and start charging her to fool you into holding so that he/she gets guaranteed damage. It's a fairly effective strategy but it has its downside that if you feel like a player might be trying to go for this, you can visually react and hold this attempt.
Getting into Mila's range might look intimidating at first, but you have to keep in mind that it's actually easier than it look as her range tools like, , and with the exception of and are unsafe and you can either throw punish or freely start pressing buttons to stop any further zoning attempts.
This is probably one of the easiest match ups to manage mainly because Ein is an old relic and relies more on whiff punishment and basic mix ups and having to play the system more.
Unlike Hitomi, Ein has more simplified mix ups and less safety, meaning that most of what he does is clearly punishable.
Ein players can differ in terms of play style. Some are in your face while other hang back and wait for you to make mistakes. However most will use the same tools as Ein can be limited compared to the rest of the cast despite having what he needs to go against any character in the roster.
One of his most used tools include, , and the followups, and his powerful punches like and . These all have safety drawbacks with the exception of which is -4 but still gives you opportunities to press buttons and try to retaliate as Ein players will abuse this if you don't.
Getting used to fighting this character is not difficult so I don't think I need to say too much about this.
This can depend on the player since every zack user employs a different approach since he has many tools to just stun and start bullying you.
Zack's game revolves around stunning and building towards a CB to get max damage from his combos to do big damage.
The things to familiarize are his CBs both his and sway back , because I assure you most zack players would build towards a CB especially against a heavy character. Few would simply just stun into launch for minimal damage as the payoff is not that high. Players do a lot of transition into sway () and duck (), where a lot of mixups come from, especially the duck punches. Zack can easily transition between the two stances and also has another special stance which may look like a crouching sidestep (from Ducking: /), it's actually not (well, not anywhere as potent as Christie or bayman's).
After on block, using can interrupt all of his options as he's in -3 and your knee is guaranteed to interrupt anything he does.
Some Zack players do on your wake up, so if you can time it right, you should it hold it whenever you can.
Also, Zack Beam is punishable on both hit and block with a whooping -89 on block and -81 to -91 on hit, so you are a guaranteed a punish in all situations, so you can pretty much run in and punish for free. People do actually use it.
I need more experience in this matchup, but most of his game revolves around putting an opponent in stun and creating a 50/50 with his and reset when he builds up the stun threshold. Usually, this starts from a regular stun like () on a counter hit or into and continue the stun from there. The reason a JL player would go for in stun is that he can potentially get a CB, unless you escape the stun as fast as possible, which is not that hard to do since you'd have enough time between the kick and the CB to do so.
Other JL players would get more creative and start using other tools and stuns, but most would obviously go for something that could potentially be guaranteed. JL has loads of lift stuns. Another thing is that he has a lot of lift stuns which helps with extending his stuns. That still shouldn't deter you from slow escaping and reacting to his CB.
A big threat from JL is his and the resets he can get from it. Usually, a dash into dragon stance works afterward where you have to make a three way guess between a high, a mid punch and kick if he goes into dragon stance. JL players would try to go into his OH if they try to cause a reset if you hold when in stun or you stay stand for too long. There may be way where you can guess whether he'll be using it or not and that is usually when a player is in close range as the OH hasn't got that much range and it's not very fast for an OH (23i). If you do get caught, keep in mind that the most used tools after the OH are or .
Some JL players use his dragon kick after the OH and the best answer to that would be to just duck because it's not actually guaranteed. It's generally a good idea to also just duck if you're not very good at reacting to the dragon kick. It's good to get used to seeing that kick JL players can abuse it if you're unfamiliar, but once you duck it once and punish it with a TFBB, you can potentially shut down the use of the kick entirely.
Another thing about JL is that he can be very unsafe, so knowing what to punish can be really important to shut down his rush.
It takes a bit of time getting used to JL, but it pays off in the end once you have a potentially annoying matchup familiarized.
I've played this MU for the last few years since original DOA5 and I've seen a lot of different play styles with her. Mila mostly tries to bully you into submission and you want to stop mila players from doing that.
This matchup usually revolves around finding holes in her offense and punishing her unsafe moves. These usually end up being her strings, including those cancellable into her takedown feints and
transitions where she'd definitely start using her her low kick string from that, starting a stun game and putting you under pressure until you react and punish it. Usually most players immediately do the ... and the weakness of this particular offense is that it's a low-high string and clearly exploitable. It all comes down to familiarization with this match up such as her strings. If she does the low kick from a stance, it can stun you, so keep that in mind.Another thing to keep in mind is her takedown especially in early round situations such as sidestep into takedown which can be common among Mila players. The best response to this is to wait and low throw punish this attempt to give a clear message to the other player that you cannot be bullied easily.
Another important fact is that all takedown transitions can be punished on block, so next time you feel a mila player might be doing a string into a takedown feint, low throw for punishment.
Another thing to watch out for are situations where a player would stun you and start charging her
to fool you into holding so that he/she gets guaranteed damage. It's a fairly effective strategy but it has its downside that if you feel like a player might be trying to go for this, you can visually react and hold this attempt.Getting into Mila's range might look intimidating at first, but you have to keep in mind that it's actually easier than it look as her range tools like
, , and with the exception of and are unsafe and you can either throw punish or freely start pressing buttons to stop any further zoning attempts.This is probably one of the easiest match ups to manage mainly because Ein is an old relic and relies more on whiff punishment and basic mix ups and having to play the system more.
Unlike Hitomi, Ein has more simplified mix ups and less safety, meaning that most of what he does is clearly punishable.
Ein players can differ in terms of play style. Some are in your face while other hang back and wait for you to make mistakes. However most will use the same tools as Ein can be limited compared to the rest of the cast despite having what he needs to go against any character in the roster.
One of his most used tools include
, , and the followups, and his powerful punches like and . These all have safety drawbacks with the exception of which is -4 but still gives you opportunities to press buttons and try to retaliate as Ein players will abuse this if you don't.Getting used to fighting this character is not difficult so I don't think I need to say too much about this.
This can depend on the player since every zack user employs a different approach since he has many tools to just stun and start bullying you.
Zack's game revolves around stunning and building towards a CB to get max damage from his combos to do big damage.
The things to familiarize are his CBs both his
and sway back , because I assure you most zack players would build towards a CB especially against a heavy character. Few would simply just stun into launch for minimal damage as the payoff is not that high. Players do a lot of transition into sway () and duck (), where a lot of mixups come from, especially the duck punches. Zack can easily transition between the two stances and also has another special stance which may look like a crouching sidestep (from Ducking: /), it's actually not (well, not anywhere as potent as Christie or bayman's).After
on block, using can interrupt all of his options as he's in -3 and your knee is guaranteed to interrupt anything he does.Some Zack players do
on your wake up, so if you can time it right, you should it hold it whenever you can.Also, Zack Beam is punishable on both hit and block with a whooping -89 on block and -81 to -91 on hit, so you are a guaranteed a punish in all situations, so you can pretty much run in and punish for free. People do actually use it.
I need more experience in this matchup, but most of his game revolves around putting an opponent in stun and creating a 50/50 with his
and reset when he builds up the stun threshold. Usually, this starts from a regular stun like () on a counter hit or into and continue the stun from there. The reason a JL player would go for in stun is that he can potentially get a CB, unless you escape the stun as fast as possible, which is not that hard to do since you'd have enough time between the kick and the CB to do so.Other JL players would get more creative and start using other tools and stuns, but most would obviously go for something that could potentially be guaranteed. JL has loads of lift stuns. Another thing is that he has a lot of lift stuns which helps with extending his stuns. That still shouldn't deter you from slow escaping and reacting to his CB.
A big threat from JL is his
and the resets he can get from it. Usually, a dash into dragon stance works afterward where you have to make a three way guess between a high, a mid punch and kick if he goes into dragon stance. JL players would try to go into his OH if they try to cause a reset if you hold when in stun or you stay stand for too long. There may be way where you can guess whether he'll be using it or not and that is usually when a player is in close range as the OH hasn't got that much range and it's not very fast for an OH (23i). If you do get caught, keep in mind that the most used tools after the OH are or .Some JL players use his dragon kick after the OH and the best answer to that would be to just duck because it's not actually guaranteed. It's generally a good idea to also just duck if you're not very good at reacting to the dragon kick. It's good to get used to seeing that kick JL players can abuse it if you're unfamiliar, but once you duck it once and punish it with a TFBB, you can potentially shut down the use of the kick entirely.
Another thing about JL is that he can be very unsafe, so knowing what to punish can be really important to shut down his rush.
It takes a bit of time getting used to JL, but it pays off in the end once you have a potentially annoying matchup familiarized.
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Christie and Rose has been giving me all sorts of problems as Bass. I may need to improve more with him since I probably do not have a solid approach using him yet. Bass is really fun and using him as a sub, but when playing against Christie or Rose...I am not having fun anymore. (Kidding but it does provide some problems.)
Yeah, unless you're gonna dedicate more time and figure out specific match up tactics against Christie with Bass, don't bother and pick what you feel is most comfortable with. I say just start holding until you recognizer a hold pattern from the other player and press a big button. Big tip is to let
rip after to shut down options for button-happy players and block afterward in case a tries to sneak its way in and punish that again. If you don't throw in this MU, you lose.With MR, just hope your
doesn't get sidestepped (/) since someone in TN thought it'd be a great idea to give a free step move to a character in doa5. It's still one of your most reliable tracking moves with the other being . Don't be afraid to throw her when she's in BT. Doesn't matter if you get hit; the message you send the other player when they get thrown out of their OH is more important. Also, she should be kept out since Bass does actually out range her.