Kronin
Well-Known Member
Yes, she showned it in one of the trailers but for better details you need to get answers from the other players posting on this thread.
Characters Nyotengu changes/gameplay discussion
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Yes, she showned it in one of the trailers but for better details you need to get answers from the other players posting on this thread.
Codemaster92163
Well-Known Member
So, changes I've seen so far.
is a guard break. Frames have yet to be determined.
no longer wall splats and should prove pretty useful for juggles.
can now go into . How this will benefit players, I don't know, mostly because of the issues surrounding on block and on hit. I don't see this being used much unless they changed the properties for it.
is a guard break. Frames have yet to be determined. no longer wall splats and should prove pretty useful for juggles. can now go into . How this will benefit players, I don't know, mostly because of the issues surrounding on block and on hit. I don't see this being used much unless they changed the properties for it.
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I don't see the new being an issue since it's safe and what do we have to lose for having mixup options after a GB.
I mean, it's better than the unsafe followup she had, so yeah.
being an issue since it's safe and what do we have to lose for having mixup options after a GB.I mean, it's better than the unsafe followup she had, so yeah.
Codemaster92163
Well-Known Member
I'm not saying it's an issue, I'm just saying it's a needless buff.
is already rather bad. It's 2 mid kicks (so double the chance to counter) with no variability and a very small launch height. You're better off just going for the launch if you actually want to juggle. As a poke, it's still bad since she just has better options with better safety.
At this point, they're just polishing a move that doesn't really serve a purpose at the moment. It's not useless, but it's outclassed by a lot of other pokes/launches, so giving it some safety at the end (with limited use of the frames provides since it's a forced Hiten transition) isn't too great. That's why I don't see many people using it, mostly because there's still no reason to.
is already rather bad. It's 2 mid kicks (so double the chance to counter) with no variability and a very small launch height. You're better off just going for the launch if you actually want to juggle. As a poke, it's still bad since she just has better options with better safety.At this point, they're just polishing a move that doesn't really serve a purpose at the moment. It's not useless, but it's outclassed by a lot of other pokes/launches, so giving it some safety at the end (with limited use of the frames
provides since it's a forced Hiten transition) isn't too great. That's why I don't see many people using it, mostly because there's still no reason to.NT seems to have a thing for buffing moves that are never used and try to make them useful. Maybe that's their intention.
Codemaster92163
Well-Known Member
I'd be fine with the buff if it actually was useful, but unless had its properties changed, it's still the weaker alternative when it comes to mid kick pokes/launches.
If WAS buffed, then this move will see a lot more use.
had its properties changed, it's still the weaker alternative when it comes to mid kick pokes/launches.If
WAS buffed, then this move will see a lot more use.
It looks like () isn't an alternate finisher after all, they just replaced the second kick with 9K. I have mixed feelings about this, because with the old one you could bounce a stunned opponent high enough for the throw to connect. I quite liked that setup. On the other hand, I like and the forced transition, we have more options from there.
I don't know about you, but I like to use 9K as a force tech after a hard knockdown. I either do a normal throw or a 2T from there, depending on the habits of my opponent.
() isn't an alternate finisher after all, they just replaced the second kick with 9K. I have mixed feelings about this, because with the old one you could bounce a stunned opponent high enough for the throw to connect. I quite liked that setup. On the other hand, I like and the forced transition, we have more options from there. I don't know about you, but I like to use 9K as a force tech after a hard knockdown. I either do a normal throw or a 2T from there, depending on the habits of my opponent.
Codemaster92163
Well-Known Member
I use in certain places. It's not that it doesn't have particular uses, but those uses are limited by the small + frames it gives, the forced transition, and the fact that it always bounds on CH leaving you with a really low-damage followup.
I'm just saying I don't see how adding it to does anyone any good. You'll get a worse launch using the variant than the normal one, so you'll lose damage. This would imply it's only good if you're using on block, where you're still using a second mid kick,s o the opponent would never have to change what they're countering. That, and serves as a mostly superior mid kick poke already, along with since it creates distance on block.
I'm not saying you're wrong for using the move. Like I said, there are situations where I like to throw out, particularly after her wall throw, but I just don't care for TN attaching it to a move that already had a mid-kick followup. It just seems redundant. I'd rather they add...well, something else after it, if anything at all.
in certain places. It's not that it doesn't have particular uses, but those uses are limited by the small + frames it gives, the forced transition, and the fact that it always bounds on CH leaving you with a really low-damage followup.I'm just saying I don't see how adding it to
does anyone any good. You'll get a worse launch using the variant than the normal one, so you'll lose damage. This would imply it's only good if you're using on block, where you're still using a second mid kick,s o the opponent would never have to change what they're countering. That, and serves as a mostly superior mid kick poke already, along with since it creates distance on block.I'm not saying you're wrong for using the move. Like I said, there are situations where I like to throw out
, particularly after her wall throw, but I just don't care for TN attaching it to a move that already had a mid-kick followup. It just seems redundant. I'd rather they add...well, something else after it, if anything at all.
Some changes I noticed while watching Mr. Wah play her on the Shacknews stream earlier today.
K's new GB is +2.
Has a new 2T, that's i5. Deals 68 damage. 110 Hi Counter damage on an electric floor.
Her old 2T has been remapped to 1T (saw it in the move list). It's likely slower now as a result, but the throw was never performed, so I can't confirm the speed decrease. Maybe it deals more damage now too. Can't say.
Has a tag intro with Hayabusa.
Has a tag outro with Hayabusa.
Has Hayabusa>Nyotengu and Nyotengu>Hayabusa tag throws.
K's new GB is +2.
Has a new 2T, that's i5. Deals 68 damage. 110 Hi Counter damage on an electric floor.
Her old 2T has been remapped to 1T (saw it in the move list). It's likely slower now as a result, but the throw was never performed, so I can't confirm the speed decrease. Maybe it deals more damage now too. Can't say.
Has a tag intro with Hayabusa.
Has a tag outro with Hayabusa.
Has Hayabusa>Nyotengu and Nyotengu>Hayabusa tag throws.
I'm watching over the archive of the stream to see the parts that I missed and saw that Mr. Wah checked to see if her PL is properly labeled as a mid kick now instead of retaining the glitch in 5U, which labeled it as a mid punch. The glitch has been fixed and it's now a mid kick.
My guess is that it's i7 now. Similar to how Leon's old 2T was remapped to 1T for 5U and changed to i7, since he got a new i5 2T.
My guess is that it's i7 now. Similar to how Leon's old 2T was remapped to 1T for 5U and changed to i7, since he got a new i5 2T.
They could also buff it up to 80 damage at i12, similar to Ryu's 33T.
Codemaster92163
Well-Known Member
I'm assuming the nerf was to limit ceiling abuse with an i5 punish throw for an insane amount of free damage.
Not that you shouldn't be rewarded for low-throw punishing someone, and Nyo definitely needs every advantage she can have, but I'm just speculating as to their reasoning behind the change.
With all of that said, I like that K is now +2 on block. It's not godly, but enough for a mixup between P+K (for all highs/mids) and 6P (most lows and crouching crushes) to beat out most everything that could follow it.
Also, general commentary here. They really need to fix the distance her GBs push people. Take, for instance, 4P. It's an amazing GB, but you can do a back dash on block to avoid all of her good mixup options. That's one move you don't want to create space considering how short the range is on most of her BT moves, but it does it anyways. I'm hoping they realized this and changed the pushback on it. If I don't see her used on stream, I'll just have to wait to test some things out myself when the game is released in a few weeks.
Not that you shouldn't be rewarded for low-throw punishing someone, and Nyo definitely needs every advantage she can have, but I'm just speculating as to their reasoning behind the change.
With all of that said, I like that K is now +2 on block. It's not godly, but enough for a mixup between P+K (for all highs/mids) and 6P (most lows and crouching crushes) to beat out most everything that could follow it.
Also, general commentary here. They really need to fix the distance her GBs push people. Take, for instance, 4P. It's an amazing GB, but you can do a back dash on block to avoid all of her good mixup options. That's one move you don't want to create space considering how short the range is on most of her BT moves, but it does it anyways. I'm hoping they realized this and changed the pushback on it. If I don't see her used on stream, I'll just have to wait to test some things out myself when the game is released in a few weeks.
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Codemaster92163
Well-Known Member
Also, if you're willing to oblige (or have already checked), could you see if any of her P strings (PPP or PPK) are safe yet?
Codemaster92163
Well-Known Member
After 66T, you can wait a second, use 9PP+K for some great mixup options. Now that 9K no longer tracks, it helps to have another mid tracking wallsplat, so Hiten H+K works well (it counts as a mid here since the initial high hit whiffs). You can use Hiten PP as well for mixup in addition to the more standard moves (canceling Hiten by inaction and doing another 66T, P+K, 6P, etc.) Just note that i9 characters can jab through the OH if you use the Hiten cancel, so keep that in mind.
This works well when mixed with the 4K+K whiff and the 4P+K feint to keep opponents guessing what you may do while making sure you're still + on block if they guess right.
This works well when mixed with the 4K+K whiff and the 4P+K feint to keep opponents guessing what you may do while making sure you're still + on block if they guess right.
Codemaster92163
Well-Known Member
Pretty big improvement over the last bit of throw tech I offered. After 41236T near a wall (for any weight, but likely just mid/heavies since 1P connects on lightweights) use PPP > 6P+K instead of 9K. While you have to kinda time the Hiten transition, though it's easy since you just need a small delay before hitting P, you get more damage and a TON more frames if they tech. I'm talking between +6 and +10 being the average, so expect +8 or 9 if you're consistent. So for a little room for human error, you get more damage and frames from this setup over the others.