I'm no doubt going to review the character, but already I've seen a small handful of people complain that Momiji is pretty much the same as her DOA5 counterpart. I disagree, but feel free to enlighten me.
Excuse me? She is the same. She is more safe imo since she's gotten safe attacks to work with, they simply switched what was unsafe and what wasnt. PPPP and 3PP are gonna be unsafe since its a mid ender that knocks down, while they made 6H+K a defensive pressure attack that gives you advantage. It's 26i but it can still help against faster characters who tech up on the defensive, i don't really see why some people want it as a FSD stun that's unsafe when it's already a safe frame advantage on guard attack, the slow speed can easily be negated if you use it when your opponent is teching up before they can really react, plus it's a hard FT. And she has other safe attacks that logically should be safe, like 66P, 4PKK, 44K, 214P. 214P+K, KK, 8K, H+K at max range and PP6P and 6P+K, and even her double jump options.I do not share this opinion at all. She is REALLY different. Her moves look the same, but that's about it. The ones that say she's the same never really played her beyond casual gameplay.
She is LESS safe, not more safe. The best example is PPPP, her most basic string. That was -3. It is now -10. Huge difference. And that same P finisher is unsafe across the board for all the strings that have that same finisher.
A move that has completely changed is Forward H+K. It used to be -10 but is now +2 (I believe). Not that it's that useful considering the move used to stun and now is a knockdown and is an i26 frame move...
Damaging juggles are harder. It was so easy to do highly damaging juggles in DOA5LR with her. A basic juggle like 3P4P, 3P4PP now won't work because the first punch on the second part whiffs.
Her launchers are less good. In DOA5LR she was one of the characters that didn't need to play the stun game and could play stun-launch really well. Although that hasn't changed in DOA6, her launchers no longer launch equally high as in DOA5, which relates back to the point above of her juggles being less effective.
Her bound doesn't work on all weight classes with a basic launcher like most other characters. This is immediately a negative point for her, because it limits the basic option of doing extended juggles by doing a cancel break blow... It makes getting good damage in a lot harder than it was in DOA5LR.
So no. She's not the same, nor more straightforward, nor safer, nor easier.
But she is tho, not much has really changed about her besides move properties, slight launch changes,shortened stun and switching some moves to be safer and giving ones like 3PP and PPPP unsafer frames. I don't feel like she's much different because even her new moves weren't many besides the new combo throw and 4P enders and such. She's not copy paste but she hasn't changed much to really be seen as really revamped unlike characters like Phase 4 and Eliot with their added improvementsCrazy that people complain about copy/paste movesets in DOA yet never hear that same story brought for Tekken, SF, or literally any other game that has been using the same strings and special moves for decades. All these games have the same character specific strings and/or special move, that's how you keep legacy characters familiar to the player, but DOA and all the rest of these games build on their movelist and add extensions or new normals. Long story short, Momiji is not the same as she was in DOA5LR. Saying she is means the player didn't know her moves all that well in the first place.
And then...not much has really changed about her
That's practically everything that can. What else is there to change, provided you keep the moves list similar?besides move properties, slight launch changes,shortened stun and switching some moves to be safer and giving ones like 3PP and PPPP unsafer frames.
Not really, you're saying that she's not striaghtforward, not easier, and etc. but how? She's basically how she is in LR, which isn't a bad thing! I'm saying that in a good way, I don't think they copypasted her into in 6 and I'm not the part of the people complaining that she's relatively the same as in 5LR, I'm actually happy that TN kept her as a simple to use character since in LR I wasn't able to learn her since her combos and such were somewhat more complex, but in 6 with how the stuns work and how launches are consistent and dont change height unless you use a FR or FSD her combos were more straightforward to learn.And then...
That's practically everything that can. What else is there to change, provided you keep the moves list similar?
keep legacy characters familiar to the player
She's basically how she is in LR, which isn't a bad thing!
I don't think she will be tbh, people use Momiji besides her as a character because she's simple to pick up and learn, if she were reworked that would be learning the character over again when she's only really been in one game, and I don't think TN will overhaul and change something that doesn't really need to be changed since there's not much to change. I don't think even Rachel will be changed much but the people who like her will use her unless they don't like how she plays in 6To be fair, Momiji is not a legacy character though. Not sure why this needs to be repeated lol.
As for Momiji, there has been differences in frame data change, but rather her aesthetic or general outlook as a character is extremely underwhelming. It's literally plain vanilla ice cream that simply looks cute for general eye candy. Some of the characters in DOA6 have a sort of copy and paste from other games, but they have been generally all-around alright.
No, that is a bad thing (for Momiji that is). It is precisely why Momiji has been in constant debates with this. I remember someone asking "well how come people are ok with this character having exact moves to the previous games and not Momiji?"
It's because the character (visually) does not create this spark in the FGC to be a notable character for people to recognize. The character doesn't stick out compared to Hayabusa/Kasumi/Ayane. Same with 80% of the rest of the cast. I suppose she sticks out from a casual perspective, but there's a limit to that sort of thing.
My wish for Momiji is to be rescrapped and reworked entirely while keeping the same concept in mind (how she is now) to where it's inspiring. I requested this character back in DOA5 vanilla but regret it with how she turned out that's shaped like a regular apple. A mistake on my end, but there is still hope (maybe in the next game if TN are going to use household guests again).
Well DOA hasn't really reworked characters since DOA5, the only characters I can think of that have been reworked is maybe Phase with her new teleports and Helena with some of her inputs but I don't think they would rework Momiji since there's not much reason to rework her, I think they're content on keeping her simple to use. I can't say it's blind optimism on my part more or so than just being content with how she is now but I suppose i can see why people would want her to be more like how the other ninjas are in their movesets- Simple and easy pick up characters have been reworked in games before. How is Momiji any different to be excluded? when you are under Hayabusa's training I expected heavy epic shit, not plain ice cream lol.
- People usually relearn characters. It's incompetence or multitude of other reasons. There isn't much to relearn when the game format and approach is the same when it's usually the meta that gets changed (well....usually).
But alas, it is what it is. People actually thought I hate the character when it's more on the fence that I want this character to be similar to the rest of the notable cast members and having a movekit that stick out more (in all forms). Course, i'm sure I'll come across the simple "hey, that's just your opinion! Momiji looks great!" type posts, but if people enjoy the typical blind optimism then sure, it's what they like.
I didn't say that. I said she's not as straightforward as DOA5. She was simpler in DOA5 than in DOA6. And she's not easier either...Not really, you're saying that she's not straightforward, not easier, and etc. but how?
And the main thing we haven't mentioned yet compared to DOA5 is... Critical Burst. That is gone now, and that means that her main tool is gone. She could get a Critical Burst faster than anyone else in DOA5. That is a HUGE advantage she had. The same string currently gives her only a knockdown. So the damage potential here was basically half health gone in DOA5 vs less than a quarter in DOA6. She has to work a lot harder for her damage now.I'm not going back and forth and arguing but I'm just saying that she's not that different in 6, she can still be played like how she was in LR taking the shorter stun and launch and juggle changes into mind, but they had to cut corners to make it so she could be safer and such which is why her juggles seem overall worse(which I don't personally see, she already can do good damage and she has refloats and such which probably explains why her juggle potential seemed to take a hit damage and height wise).
Her damage doesn't come easy since she's relatively predictable, and CB was her main tactic in DOA5 but even then she's pretty linear since alot of her strings have usually two options to guess from besides the throw attempt. And her BTed FR is the way it is since she already has a P+K that causes a must hold or fall situation, the BTed FSD isn't even really useful unless the opponent holds. And the damage can be said about most other characters tbh since there's no CB, it's straight get down stun into launches or throwsI didn't say that. I said she's not as straightforward as DOA5. She was simpler in DOA5 than in DOA6. And she's not easier either...
Using the moves we already discussed... Let's put things in perspective.
PPPP is a brain dead move. Using PPPP in DOA5 has no real negative consequences, other than making it easier for the opponent to hold. If the opponent fails to hold, you're safe.
PPPP in DOA6 while still a brain dead move, has more negative consequences than in DOA5. The opponent can hold just like DOA5, but if they fail to hold, they still get a chance for a free i7 throw.
6H+K even though unsafe in DOA5 was still safe enough considering the pushback. So the change is not as drastic as for PPPP.
And the main thing we haven't mentioned yet compared to DOA5 is... Critical Burst. That is gone now, and that means that her main tool is gone. She could get a Critical Burst faster than anyone else in DOA5. That is a HUGE advantage she had. The same string currently gives her only a knockdown. So the damage potential here was basically half health gone in DOA5 vs less than a quarter in DOA6. She has to work a lot harder for her damage now.
All that does not mean she is not straightforward to use at the basic level. She is the most simple Ninja out there, and arguably one of the easier characters to use. But that's it. To use, and nothing more. Her damage does not come easy, unlike DOA5. And that is what makes her harder to use compared to DOA5, because she actually has to fight for longer to win matches, and she has to work a lot more to get some decent damage in. She is not the hugely damaging stun launch character she used to be since now she has mediocre damage. She CAN do very great damage if the environment is used correctly though, as long as she can get a bound in.
And look at her Fatal Stun option. She has to be back turned to use her main one. She had a few BT options in DOA5 but weren't that important. This time, they are almost vital, which once again raises the risk she has to take, meaning, less simple than DOA5.
Long story short, the main mechanic (Critical Bursts) came easy to Momiji in DOA5, and the main mechanic in DOA6 (Fatal Stun) is hard to get off. I really don't get how people say that she's easier, especially considering that last point.
And yeah, I'm not interested in a back and forth either. I made my point. You're free to reply, most likely I won't reply again for now. Let the rest decide for themselves.