Rachel Guide V.1.03

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vINv

Active Member
alaska
Main Character
Gamertag
vINvSesaro
This will be a game play guide not a a combo thread we already have one of those and lets face Rachel combos are not rocket science.. Any ways I will begin this guide with a explanation of frames and terminology. So that even people who have just bought the game and have no prior experience will be able to understand and apply what I'm talking about. So lets begin......
: Rachel:


Section 1: Dead or Alive terminology. Directions are defined by the numbers that line up with a computer key board.
5: Neutral or standing still
1:The left corner of your controller
4:Back on your controllers D pad
7:Top left corner of your D pad
8:Top of your D pad
9:Top right corner of your D pad
6:Right on your D pad
3:Right corner of your D pad
2:Down on your D pad
P:punch K:kick T:throw H:hold for all other inquires of DOA terms you can take the in game tutorial. And read the Doa general Discussion forums

Section:2 Frames on block Frame trap pressure options
Frames are how fast your character moves they also determine if you character can be punished or keep attacking (general explanation).( Rachel's Frames on Block)(- means your at disadvantage)(+means your on advantage)(SU:Start up frames)
(H)5 p: -1(can be free canceled for a neutral throw because of pk option)(11FPS)
(HH)5 pp: -6
(HHM)5 ppp: -1
(HHH)(last hit tracks)5: ppk: -7
(HHOVER HEAD)5: pp 4p: -8
(HM)5: pk: -2 (This is is a great move^_^)(poking tool)
(HHH)5: ppt:+9(great move leads to throw set ups and pressure options)
(M)6 p:-11(13FPS)
(MM)6: pk:-5
(MMH)6:pkk:-5
(MH)6pp:-12
(MHM)6ppk:-12
(HHL)5 pp 2k:- 12(Block) (on hit+5)
(m)4p: -10(16FPS)
(mm)4pp: -13
(mmm)4ppp: -6
(mmmm)4pppp:-2
(mmm)3ppp(every vartion of this string is un safe(-11,-7,-12)
(mmm)3ppp+k:-3
(M)7p: -11(16fps)
(overhead)8p: -8(18fps)
(overhead)8k:-11(20FPS)
(M)9k: -12(18FPS)
(M)4k: -3(great move can be used for spacing and poking)
(M)7k:-12(25FPS)
(M)6k: -5(13FPS)
(MH)6kk:-5
(M)66k:+1(some what useful i use this 2 set up 66throw or pk)
(M)3k :-2(16FPS)
(L)2H+K -12(17FPS)
(L)2p:-4(14FPS)
(L)1P:-10(16FPS)(High Crush)
(LM)1pp:-15
(L)2k:-8(15FPS)
(MMM)6pkp : -2
(MM)6kp: -2
(M)4p-10(Tracking)
(MM)4pp-13(Tracking)
(MMM)4ppp-6(Tracking)
(MMMM)4pppp-2(Tracking)
(MMMM)4pppP+K-1(first parts of the string track p+k can be ss'd)
(MMM)4pppP+KP-3(First or 2nd part can be ss'd)
(M)SSp : -10
(H)H+K: -7(13FPS)(tracking)
(M)SSk: -5
(WHILE GROUNDED THE STOMP): +15 ON HIT( -3 TO -20 ON WHIFF)(AND IT CAN BE REACTED TO OFFLINE)
(H)9p:-6 (13fps)(Great Tool this move is reasonable safe and +27on hit WOOT)
Sorry if i missed anything let me know and i will double check and make corrections.
Alright Next section 2:2
Frame advantage on hit set ups. And strategies:


Rachel: as character is not the greatest on the roster limited tools and a limited move set.
That being said this character (DEMANDS A HIGH UNDERSTANDING OF DOA. AS WELL AS CHARACTER MATCH UPS.)(MY Opinion from this point on take or leave it :) )
As as Rachel you must not only know your Frames but you must know your opponents (SU frames on there Bread and butters) Mainly what there plus on what there negative etc. Because Rachel needs every ounce she can get. Once you know your opponents mids from the highs this is where Rachel players need to take it a step further. (8p+k,2p+K) is a great tool takes practice to apply. Also Rachel players must gain the ability to judge when to use the regular Side step Vs. her unique Side step) This may sound dumb to some people but trust me it serves a purpose. The unique SS can b used to SS liner moves during strings just like a regular SS but the difference is. The unique SS(K) depending on the situation can lead to knock down (STOMP SET UP) or can lead just simple frame advantage(+16 on hit -15 block) or you can opt for the unique SS (P) (-12 on block) which launches for a air throw combo. The Unique SS can also b used to escape certain setups from various characters on the roster. Her normal SS p+7 no stun less its on counter hit. SS K +4 with these options you can follow up with 3p or 4k i opt for these because against button mashers its a guaranteed follow up. How ever the trade off is SSp is -10 and SSK - 5 on block so option select wisely.

Moving on to her poke game P,K is great with poking and can be used to annoy your opponent. Being at +7 its a good option its also sets you up for tick throws because her 5p is easy to free cancel 7 throw(7FPS) best option its fast and it annoys your opponent. 4k is a great spacing/poking unfortunately its her only decent poking tool that's not gimmicky. On counter hit it opens the stun game. On normal hit(+7) it allows you some follow up options i opt for 6k,6pk,6p,3p,2H+K.(If people have more ideas please comment)

The STUN GAME Rachel's stun is comprised of a flurry of mids/launchers/throw punishes. My recommendation for Rachel players is to learn how to extend the stun don't be overly concerned with launching right away. Rachel can get some deep stuns which allows her to scare her opponent into countering. Rachel players then opt like every grapple char to throw or launch the differnce with Rachel though. If you like combos and want to annoy your opponent. Set up 9p then launch w/7p you can get 73 dmg out this.(Set up various quick launch combos which discourages random low counters) You can add 2H+K into your stun game and quick launch w/7p or 9k. Be careful about that set up a good Stagger Escaper. is gonna get out of it in which case return to poking and tick throws. Here's on of my Favorite set ups (mid weights,light and super light) (9p,H+K,4H+K,1pp,air throw,9p,6kp). Heres another.(UniqueSS(K),3p,9p,5p,8k,@ this point you can opt for throw punish(if the counter) or launch or cb or 8k or 8p. Her sit downs are what make her scary because of the amount of options your have. This in (MY OPINION) is the best way to gain dmg on you opponent and scare them to pt where u can set tick launch throw set ups.

Rachel's Defense not much to say here theirs nothing that great about it. Learn when to SS with unique and regular SS. Also get extremely good punishing other characters negative strings/moves. And universal rule more so for grappelers get better at holding during stun and on block to intmadate your openent. And a general rule of thumb if you oppenent is a button masher opt for a strike punish to start your stun game(6p) is great for this as well as (5pk) and (1pp).

Now for the part you all are probably gonna give me grief over but this is purely based on frames and tools and my opinion Rachel's Match ups:
Rachel Vs. Kasumi:6-4(Kas):Kas is faster and better at spacing. She can also pressure Rachel into a corner if you are not good at holding. Forcing the Rachel player to play a hold based defense combined with her SS and be on point with throw punishes.
Rachel Vs. Brad:6-4(Rac)Rac is faster then brad and most of brads bnb's rely on mid kick/back turn throw set ups. Because of Rachel's 1pp crushes the throw. And her mid kick hold launches. This limits brads options.(and if the Rachel's good @ Holding she can shut brad down and punish the negative strings) the only thing brads has in is favor is spacing.)
I will add more to this at a later date right now still researching but thanks for reading my how 2 Rachel guide i appreciate feed back this is for the purpose of making better Rachel players.


 
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vINv

Active Member
alaska
Main Character
Gamertag
vINvSesaro
Rachel Vs. Janlee:7-3(Jan)This m-u is a real nightmare for Rac because jan is a far better at the spacing game. Which forces Rac to (dash block 3,3,4,h(movement tool which is something Rac exccels at). as well as dashing in with a counter which is risky because of dragon gunner. Lets also remeber that jans 6p(m) is 12(FPS) vs Racs 6p13(m)(FPS) and we also loose out on 5ps jans 10(FPS) Ours is 11(fps). So how does Rach when this match very carefully. My recomindation is you start by discouraging jans 6p. You start of with your 5pk or distance your self. this dependent on if your playing a agressive or defensive player so feel them out with Racs poke game.One other thing you can do is crush jans high pressure with 1p but do not over abbuse for risk of counter hit from jans mid game. Also the first time your stunned general rule of thumb against jan lee. Stagger escape 4 YOUR LIFE. So you duck dragon gunner setups forcing the midkick option which we can launch counter. Then punish the negative ds stance gimmics. And you can pick up a win avoid doing liner 5pp2k mix with pp4p
 
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vINv

Active Member
alaska
Main Character
Gamertag
vINvSesaro
Rachel Vs. Ein:5-5(Even)This match is even for a few reasons one Ein's spacing(2H+K) can be crushed by Rachel's 3throw(10FPS) That throw puts Rachel on +10. The Flip side of that is Rachel's spacing is bad you gotta have good reaction to crush that low on reaction. Which means Ein once he connects with (2H+K) can litterally sit and wait you out because Rachel can space. This match is decided in the fist ten seconds. it can be played defensively and offensively on both sides. There mid Pressure is at the same (FPS) (Ein's 3p 13FPS) (Ein's 6k is 13) (Rach's 6p 13FPS and her 6K is 13FPS). Basically if Rachel wants the win. She needs to get on the offense in a hurry. I recommend some a couple of Tick throw set ups mixed with some poking) Nothing really that scary to be worried about from Ein other than his spacing so stay close to him the whole match.
 

vINv

Active Member
alaska
Main Character
Gamertag
vINvSesaro
Rachel Vs. Momji(6-4) (MO)This match is like a few of rachels m-u`s. rachel looses out. Rachel has to dash in and keep the pressure on momiji. The trouble begins when momji scores with a counter hit. because were giving up a frame on the high and mid game.(MO`s 5p 10(FPS) 6p 12(FPS) and lets not forget 2h+k at a distance is a partial mid crush(MO`s 2h+k crusehs mids with a high hit box) (Also Momji`s spacing is on par with ayane so stun launch game gives rachel a big headache because of her lack of spacing tools) So this makes for a bad day for rachel. What has to happen is patience on the rachels players part. so we have 2 avoid getting launched and allowing her to escape.
so bring your best pressure game to the table for this fight.(side bar me and itz king beebop have played this match up a few times it plays as ive written in most of our matches)
 
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Itz King Beebop

Active Member
Kansas City, MO
Main Character
Rachel
Gamertag
Hey itz Bebop
Rachel is Going to the Circus
Rachel vs Lisa (4-6... possibly 5-5)

Rachel CAN struggle immensely when it comes to fighting Lisa; 12i mids, great spacing and getaway tools, and a shitload of offensive holds that are able to crush Rachel's abundance of mids and highs. One weird occurrence, however, I grabbed a Lisa's 9T in midair for the air grab (sadly I haven't tested it yet, but I will today; this will change how I fight Lisa players with my Tina if it's an effective strat)
Back to the MU, the match up does find light for Rachel if the player's dash blocking is on par. Rachel doesn't really have to worry much when it comes to being in CQC with Lisa; when you follow up correctly and flood Lisa with mids, you defeat the purpose of her 4H+K and 1PP bull. Also, her 1K2K doesn't work against Rachel because you can actually 3T the second low of the string on NH. All of the things I have stated above are MUCH easier said than done (that's why I can't wholeheartedly say the MU is even)
On Rachel;s side however, Lisa throws out a lot of mid kicks so this means that you're getting a fair amount of launch holds. The only thing you really have to watch (that most people don't watch) is Lisa's hold damage. Lisa actually is the grappler in second place for Hi-Counter hold damage (Rachel being the first), and if you throw out too many mid punches, you can easily be eating a good 84 damage via Lisa's mid punch hold on Hi-Counter...
I see this MU the same way that I see the Rachel vs Ein MU (just harder for Rachel) Lisa just has better spacing and keep out tools than Rachel, Lisa also has a faster mid than Rachel so that's something else to look out for. I should also add that Lisa has better all around frames than Rachel too (P+K +5i, 66K6 +2i, 2H+K +1i, 6H+K +2i)

Match Up notes:
  • PK ,6P and 6K very often so you don't have to worry about crushing
  • Not too many mid punches due to LIsa's mid punch hold damage
  • Dash block (3K range) because if you give up space, you're at risk of being OH'd
  • Punish 1PP
  • If a Lisa tries Carrera follow ups that don't work, 7P for a quick launch
  • CHASE DOWN 4H+K, if you block a 4H+K start offense immediately
  • Try to avoid getting caught up in BT mix-ups because they got insanely buffed this game
  • Try to play slightly safer than usual because Lisa has a wider range of punishing capabilities
  • Highly varying mix-ups from the tick throw set-ups that I gave out earlier to avoid getting crushed or counter grabbed (because Lisa has faster grabs than Rachel)
  • If you're going to throw out a hold, make sure it is accurate; Lisa can stun you deep enough to the point at which you have to hold, and if you fall for a grab set-up, the range game can easily be reset.
 
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Itz King Beebop

Active Member
Kansas City, MO
Main Character
Rachel
Gamertag
Hey itz Bebop
Battle for DOUBLE D Tier
Rachel vs Tina 5-5
This is actually one of Rachel's better MUs, so these games are usually even in playstyles, accurate punish-hold trade-off, and they're always pretty fun to boot. They have very similar frames ('cause Rachel was assumed to be a blend if Tina and Spartan) 13i mids, evasive stances (Rachel's 8P+K and Tina's 3P+K,) and tick throw setups galore. Rachel definitely doesn't need to worry about getting beat out by Tina, instead she needs to worry about getting crushed. Tina has four high crushes, and four low crushes, throw in a plethora of OHs and if you from habits, Tina can give you a headache.You kind of need to be wary of Tina's OHs because if you're safe, slightly negative, and you follow up, Tina can 66T or 46T>426T for a little bit of damage (even 8T crushes wake-up and a bunch of other shit)... but more importantly it will break your pressure.
If the Tina player can effectively SS Rachel's strings, the CQC game in the MU is even because Tina is usually working some pretty dirty stun game while Rachel is poking away at your health. Tina does however have the option of spacing, but not as well as Lisa can, so she might as well play the CQC game with Rachel. Where Rachel will struggle, is if she gets caught in deep stun; Tina's stun game can usually run so deep that you have to to run the risk of holding... Tina likes people who hold, so makes sure you're holds are accurate. Other than trying to spot her lows (so you can 3T them) you'll be fine.

Match Up notes:
  • You're pretty even in frames so don't worry about getting beat out on mad shit
  • Avoid abusing highs or lows, because you WILL GET CRUSHED
  • Be careful if put in deep stun because your holding will have to be precise if you don't want to eat 100+ damage for every stun encounter
  • If the Tina you're playing has a tendency of using lows, get your low OH game up
  • In CQC with Tina, avoid using super linear strings (you should be doing this anyway)
  • Stuff SS attempts with plenty of 4P>FC>PKs, PPKs, and H+Ks
  • This is one of the MUs where Rachel can be Rachel, sniff for CHs and tick throws (Shark in the Water)
  • Play a little bit safer (as you would Lisa) because she has better punishing capabilities
  • Tina actually has some pretty good tracking so really know something is linear before yo throw out a SS or 8/2P+K
  • Work your 6T set-ups often (if you have them, if you don't, I will post some up in this thread when I get them together)
 
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RiBu

Active Member
Main Character
Lisa
I don't think Rachel vs Jann Lee is that bad lol...Jann Lee is pretty lackluster this game imo. I'd really think her only match-ups that are pretty bad are Kasumi,Christie, Busa, and Coco Rice Krispies. But I don't really have the first hand knowledge to defend this, save for theory fighting...
 

Itz King Beebop

Active Member
Kansas City, MO
Main Character
Rachel
Gamertag
Hey itz Bebop
I don't think Rachel vs Jann Lee is that bad lol...Jann Lee is pretty lackluster this game imo. I'd really think her only match-ups that are pretty bad are Kasumi,Christie, Busa, and Coco Rice Krispies. But I don't really have the first hand knowledge to defend this, save for theory fighting...
I dont think its that bad either... but also her busa MU isnt that bad and her kokoro mu definitely isnt that bad... I'll be posting my opinion on those MUs later
 

Itz King Beebop

Active Member
Kansas City, MO
Main Character
Rachel
Gamertag
Hey itz Bebop
GRRR!
Rachel vs Hitomi 5-5
'Tomi can be a very even MU for Rachel, or a very annoying struggle...
The key to fighting Hitomi is more precise punishing and parrying; you can't possibly low OH anything because majority of 'Tomi's lows are in standing animation, and Rachel's low OH only grabs crouching lows. But the matchup isn't as bad as some of us originally thought... Hitomi and Rachel are generally similar in frames on start up (13i mid punches and kicks.) In Rachel's convenience, Hitomi is as linear as Ein, so you can play the MUs the same in CQC (it may even get better because the Hitomi player may begin to rely on 4PP and slow her offense, thus allowing you to hold her more effectively.) I'd advise that you get the hang of countering 6PK so that the Hitomi player feels more of a need to single poke; this will result in easier interrupts on Rachel's end. Your only worry is Hitomi's 9H because it counters all high and mid punches (too bad
Rachel has like a kick variant to most of her punches) but yeah, she can eat a few more tick throws for doing that i guess, because that hold last longer. Htiomi can't even string you a lot because more than half of her strings end in either highs or lows, so to avoid get crushed, ducked, and fucked by Rachel, her offense will be slower and easier to interrupt (as long as you instill your presence in evading.)
Hitomi can decide to space at some point if she wants to, but fortunately for Rachel, most of those spacing tools are either mid kicks or 46P... so punish accordingly. Hitomi's stun game doesn't go as heavily as it did in vanilla IMO so if you slow escape well, you don't have to worry about hefty combos or super deep stun holding (another plus for Rachel.) If your holding and blocking aren't the best, this is where your Rachel (and mine too) come to the struggle; you're susceptible to more lows and some 6T shenanigans (we all know how Rachel does on frame disadvantage.) For this MU to go good for the weakly-defended Rachel players, you're going to have to be really solid on SSs and interrupts, also working in deep stun situations in which Hitomi can either get launched or stun reset which can be quite annoying. Rachel's offense is stronger than Hitomi so when she gives any type of relief, you punish her with an avalanche of pressure...

Match Up notes:

  • Make evasion presence known (SS and duck moves properly)
  • Slow escape regularly to keep any damage you take at a minimum
  • Hold Hitomi's key strings often to encourage single hit poking (allowing for easier interrupt opportunities)
  • Even if holding Hitomi's strings don't deter her from throwing them, continue to take your free damage and crushing
  • Watch for Hitomi's special punch hold, and if they try to incorporate the strikes from 9H, punish accordingly because both options are punishable from that move
  • Be patient at zoning situations because in accuality 'Tomi's spacing options aren't as vast as one would think
  • In situations where Hitomi starts working frame advantage and 6T set-ups be patient, and be sure to use the basic anti-Tomi defensive options
  • This match up can be very, very even but if you aren't patient, it can go bad quickly... PATIENCE AND PRESSURE




Next:
Rachel vs Hayate...
 

Pictured Mind

Well-Known Member
GRRR!
Rachel vs Hitomi 5-5
'Tomi can be a very even MU for Rachel, or a very annoying struggle...
The key to fighting Hitomi is more precise punishing and parrying; you can't possibly low OH anything because majority of 'Tomi's lows are in standing animation, and Rachel's low OH only grabs crouching lows. But the matchup isn't as bad as some of us originally thought... Hitomi and Rachel are generally similar in frames on start up (13i mid punches and kicks.) In Rachel's convenience, Hitomi is as linear as Ein, so you can play the MUs the same in CQC (it may even get better because the Hitomi player may begin to rely on 4PP and slow her offense, thus allowing you to hold her more effectively.) I'd advise that you get the hang of countering 6PK so that the Hitomi player feels more of a need to single poke; this will result in easier interrupts on Rachel's end. Your only worry is Hitomi's 9H because it counters all high and mid punches (too bad Rachel has like a kick variant to most of her punches) but yeah, she can eat a few more tick throws for doing that i guess, because that hold last longer. Htiomi can't even string you a lot because more than half of her strings end in either highs or lows, so to avoid get crushed, ducked, and fucked by Rachel, her offense will be slower and easier to interrupt (as long as you instill your presence in evading.)
Hitomi can decide to space at some point if she wants to, but fortunately for Rachel, most of those spacing tools are either mid kicks or 46P... so punish accordingly. Hitomi's stun game doesn't go as heavily as it did in vanilla IMO so if you slow escape well, you don't have to worry about hefty combos or super deep stun holding (another plus for Rachel.) If your holding and blocking aren't the best, this is where your Rachel (and mine too) come to the struggle; you're susceptible to more lows and some 6T shenanigans (we all know how Rachel does on frame disadvantage.) For this MU to go good for the weakly-defended Rachel players, you're going to have to be really solid on SSs and interrupts, also working in deep stun situations in which Hitomi can either get launched or stun reset which can be quite annoying. Rachel's offense is stronger than Hitomi so when she gives any type of relief, you punish her with an avalanche of pressure...

Match Up notes:

  • Make evasion presence known (SS and duck moves properly)
  • Slow escape regularly to keep any damage you take at a minimum
  • Hold Hitomi's key strings often to encourage single hit poking (allowing for easier interrupt opportunities)
  • Even if holding Hitomi's strings don't deter her from throwing them, continue to take your free damage and crushing
  • Watch for Hitomi's special punch hold, and if they try to incorporate the strikes from 9H, punish accordingly because both options are punishable from that move
  • Be patient at zoning situations because in accuality 'Tomi's spacing options aren't as vast as one would think
  • In situations where Hitomi starts working frame advantage and 6T set-ups be patient, and be sure to use the basic anti-Tomi defensive options
  • This match up can be very, very even but if you aren't patient, it can go bad quickly... PATIENCE AND PRESSURE


Next:
Rachel vs Hayate...
Other than the fact that I had to change the forum skin in order to read this, good post. :|
 
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vINv

Active Member
alaska
Main Character
Gamertag
vINvSesaro
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upload_2013-11-9_18-52-53.png

Rachel Goes to the Strip Club 7-3(Chris)

This fight is defiantly a struggle Rachel will be working 4 every
DOLLAR in this Match up XD:
This fight will put your defense to the test let makes some observations starting with.
Christie is a nightmare in general but Rachel it can be a bigger headache if your reaction time is slow.
Christie's key points are as follows
The threats to Rachel:
1:The Jahiko side step forces Rachel to commit to strings if she doesn't she will get launched on counter hit or put into a trip stun. How ever on block you can react to the mix up if she goes low use your OH(HOLD). If they opt mid watch there next follow up if its the double mid(-10)throw punish. If its the mid high mid throw punish. mid high low throw punish it. Christie only has the 2K,K which the guard break puts her on +5 so avoid that from happening and crush it with 1p or 2p.(Key note if you can react quick enough during block just simply 4p her in the face)
2: Christie's 6p(11fps) which can be turned into a 4piece string or set up into a tick throw at any given point during the 6pppp also she can side step on during the string by using her stance this. Basically puts Rachel in a sticky situation which
DEMANDS that Rachel READS her opponent and use a regular SS to get away from the mid punch pressure. You can opt for a mid punch counter or block.
3:Christie's 5H+K(14fps) this move tracks and can be used as a pressure tool because it has follow up options however. If a Christie opts for this move there's Rachel's chance. every follow up of this move is negative
(5H+K(-8)5H+K,K(-8)5H+K,K,K(-7) not to mention this string is mhm. So the moment the high comes out its 1p time of 2p your choice.
4:Another tool to be careful of Christie's is her 4throw (10FPS) its puts her at +4 it can be used to punish your hold attempts during stun and it can be used to an attempt to open op your defense becareful of ducking this throw for obvious reasons however if you detect this throws about to happen 1p or p+k.
5:Christie Guard breaks don't allow her to force to block any of them. Because at that time that means they have you conditioned to respect her speed we dont want to that happen seeing how all of them are plus on block counter them there all mid punch except the one from her jahiko learn the animations and counter them to discourage there use.6: The roll don't allow that to start you can use Rachel's OH(HOLD) to shut that down plus 3 throw puts you on frame advantage+10 even Christie will have to respect that.
7: The stun game Christie has lot of options here over because Rachel is heavy this works in our favor. Christie will have to get a deeper stun to try to compete with Rachel in the damage game which at some point there going to mid kick or mid punch i would recommend studying her mid kick and mid punch animations as best you can. Especially her mid kick so you can get your combo dmg in. Christie does have a high launcher so learn the animations of those as well. Theres 3,3p 4H+K and here jahiko p+k
8: At Range there is not much concern here just be patient and space with 4k and 4p. 4p is only to discourage the jahiko
9: Rachel if she can manage to get offense going will want to end this match as quickly as possible the longer it goes on the more Christie will chip away at your health. So were playing the stun game here no pokes but take the opportunity do max dmg combos and if they counter opt for the 4throw for max dmg.
10:
LASTLY STUDY RACHELS FRAMES IN AND OUT AND KEEP CALM DURING THIS FIGHT DONT ALLOW CHRISTIE TO FRUSTRATE YOU AND TAKE NOTICE OF ANY PATTERNS THE OPPENENT MIGHT BE DISPLAYING. STUDY CHRISTIES FRAMES SO YOU KNOW WHERE YOU CAN GET YOU HITS IN AND PUNISH HER IF THE CHANCE ARRISES.
upload_2013-11-9_18-49-47.png
Remember study hard and we can help put a end to this OP hoe (jp:)
 

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Itz King Beebop

Active Member
Kansas City, MO
Main Character
Rachel
Gamertag
Hey itz Bebop
Does a Raijin count as a DEMON?
Rachel vs Hayate 7-3
Hot damn, this match is hell on earth... Hayate vs Rachel (if the Hayate is good) is very hard to win for Rachel; it's not as bad as Ayane vs Rachel, but it's better than the Momiji vs Rachel. Hayate has faster moves, more crushes, and a really good spacing game. Your best friends in this match-up are 6T,4K/3K, 4PP, and 6H (mid kick hold.)
In this MU Rachel needs to watch for Hayate's 6PK, that's one of his better keep-out tools... luckily it's punishable (-7i), so if you block one, that's a 6T and a start to your offense, if your holding is on point, you can simply hold the K and get a free 80 damage. You also have to be wary of his 2/8P+KP because it's very evasive, it SSs and it high crushes so watch out for what strings you choose to throw out. Fortunately 2/8P+KP is punishable as well (-9i), so if you block that move 6T to get your offense going. Make sure that your holding on Hayate's 3H+K is good as well because if it's not, you're goiing to have to deal with the mixup that comes from the string. Rachel's jumping mid kick counter is a launcher as well so be prepared to combo when it connects) Like most of her other bad MU situations, Hayate can space Rachel out with his 2H+K. Low countering this move is ill-advised because how low kick hold knocks the opponent across screen; thus, resetting the spacing scenario. When Hayate puts you into stun, yo also have to be vary cautious; he's got the Raijin and Baby Raijin combo throws that can be used as launch combos, and back-turn set-ups as well. If Hayate gets you into a deep stun scenario (though you should be doing this in general,) be patient, his CB animation is very easy to watch for and many of his high damage launchers are easy to spot as well. Hayate's regular combo damage takes a big blow from Rachel's weight, and this is why I said that you really have to be wary of BT combos and Raijin set-ups, most Hayate players will do this rather than regular combos to make up for the damage they lose. If you see that these set-ups are coming far too frequently, punish them for their greed; you can slow escape a lot of Hayate's BT setups and counter accordingly, and for grab set-ups, you start your offense when you see a grab set-up on the way.
In this MU, a lot of your damage can definitely come from punishing and interrupts. Hayate is not only pretty unsafe on block, but IMO his free-canceling isn't too much to scream about. If you instill a worry of getting interrupted, the opponent will either commit to more strings rather than free-canceling, or single poking and blocking. Depending on which option the Hayate player favors, your approach will either open up more grab opportunities, or more holding opportunities. The reason that I stated 4k/3K as one of Rachel's key moves in tis MU, was because they are some of her better come-in tools, they also offer tick throw set-ps on NH and deep stun mix-ups on CH. 6T is there as a prominent anti-Hayate tool because it will be your main source of punishing, and one of your key offense starters (+3-4i on tech roll and allows for stomp set-ups.) Your 4PP is of course used to nullify any evasive move attempts... and her mid kick hold is to nullify a lot of the launchers, spacing moves, and stun/crush moves in Hayate's arsenal.

Match Up notes:

  • Avoid being too linear to prevent getting crushed by 2/8P+KP
  • Be wary of your followups in CQC; Hayate's 12i 6PK can be easily used to interrupt your offense and create space.
  • Hold or 6T punish any blocked 6PKs
  • Watch out for any "greedy" attempts to go for massive damage (BT combos, Hi-Counter Raijin)
  • Try not to hold any low kicks because they reset spacing scenarios, instead block and punish accordingly
  • Patience in dash blocking and mid kick holding during spacing scenarios will make it much easier to get back into CQC
  • Finish combos with enders that keep Hayate close to you (6KP, 6PKP)
  • Be wary of SS-ing Hayate because he has a mild amount of tracking options; one of which can lead to BT combos or grab set-ups
  • Punish most of his unsafe pokes (1K for example) and interrupt during most of his free-cancels
  • Most importantly, take full advantage of CQC scenarios because Hayate can easily interrupt or evade some of your offense to reset the spacing scenarios... otherwise you'll be okay... HEY at least it ain't Ayane lol
Next MU(s):Rachel vs Leon, and Rachel vs Bayman
 
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Itz King Beebop

Active Member
Kansas City, MO
Main Character
Rachel
Gamertag
Hey itz Bebop
6T vs 426T: To Launch or not to Launch... nah. I just want okizeme lol

I have truly been getting a little bit of feedback from several Rachel players about my views of Rachel's 6T being Rachel's best throw, so I will give my reasoning behind why it is more essential of a move than many of her other ones.
66T and PPT:
  • Pros are that its is frame advantage and can allow for a free back throw.
  • Allows for reset gimmicks and shenanigans
  • Cons are that its an OH and therefore can be grabbed
  • If you don't throw on the right frame of recovery, it will either whiff, or the grab set-up can be mashed out of
  • Zero damage that doesn't really open up the opponent; it's kind of a gimmicky option/throw rather than a pressure throw/tool (IMO)
426T:
  • Pros to this move is that it launches for a combo, and can be mixed up with her strikes due to the slow satrt up and animation
  • If the follow-up combo is performed correctly, safe stomp set-ups and okizeme MAY be possible
  • Cons to this throw is that it's slow, and in terms of damage can be easily matched by 4T on Hi-Counter
  • Due to it's speed, an opponent can easily duck the throw or spot the throw animation more easily if not blended into offense correctly
4T:
  • Pros to this this throw is it's damage and it's possible okizeme
  • Character positioning makes it easier to spot wakeup kicks
  • 102 damage on Hi-Counter and comes out 2i faster than 426T
  • Cons are that the okizeme from the throw was heavily nerf in the 1.03 patch and therefore must be done on reaction
  • Like 426T it is a slower low and can be ducked and more easily spotted when set up
6T:
  • Pros to this move, are that it serves as her best throw punish at 7i, and is also her best throw to use in tick throw set-ups due to its speed compared to 4T and 426T
  • Offers reasonable damage on NH (59 dmg) and HCH (88 dmg)
  • Gives consistent okizeme, stomp set-up possibilities and keeps the opponent in Rachel's preferred attack range on knockdown
  • If tech rolled 6T can give anywhere from +3i on wake up
  • 6T also leaves the opponent face down with head towards; making it easier to spot wake up kicks than from the positioning of 4T
  • Cons of most throws but to a lesser extent than all of Rachel's other throws
  • If improper spacing is done while the opponent is grounded, special wake ups can be very hard to deal with at their max range potential
This is my opinion, and whether you agree or not, is just you. Use this information wisely however because this is basically a breakdown of her grabs.
 

Pictured Mind

Well-Known Member
6T vs 426T: To Launch or not to Launch... nah. I just want okizeme lol

I have truly been getting a little bit of feedback from several Rachel players about my views of Rachel's 6T being Rachel's best throw, so I will give my reasoning behind why it is more essential of a move than many of her other ones.
66T and PPT:
  • Pros are that its is frame advantage and can allow for a free back throw.
  • Allows for reset gimmicks and shenanigans
  • Cons are that its an OH and therefore can be grabbed
  • If you don't throw on the right frame of recovery, it will either whiff, or the grab set-up can be mashed out of
  • Zero damage that doesn't really open up the opponent; it's kind of a gimmicky option/throw rather than a pressure throw/tool (IMO)
426T:
  • Pros to this move is that it launches for a combo, and can be mixed up with her strikes due to the slow satrt up and animation
  • If the follow-up combo is performed correctly, safe stomp set-ups and okizeme MAY be possible
  • Cons to this throw is that it's slow, and in terms of damage can be easily matched by 4T on Hi-Counter
  • Due to it's speed, an opponent can easily duck the throw or spot the throw animation more easily if not blended into offense correctly
4T:
  • Pros to this this throw is it's damage and it's possible okizeme
  • Character positioning makes it easier to spot wakeup kicks
  • 102 damage on Hi-Counter and comes out 2i faster than 426T
  • Cons are that the okizeme from the throw was heavily nerf in the 1.03 patch and therefore must be done on reaction
  • Like 426T it is a slower low and can be ducked and more easily spotted when set up
6T:
  • Pros to this move, are that it serves as her best throw punish at 7i, and is also her best throw to use in tick throw set-ups due to its speed compared to 4T and 426T
  • Offers reasonable damage on NH (59 dmg) and HCH (88 dmg)
  • Gives consistent okizeme, stomp set-up possibilities and keeps the opponent in Rachel's preferred attack range on knockdown
  • If tech rolled 6T can give anywhere from +3i on wake up
  • 6T also leaves the opponent face down with head towards; making it easier to spot wake up kicks than from the positioning of 4T
  • Cons of most throws but to a lesser extent than all of Rachel's other throws
  • If improper spacing is done while the opponent is grounded, special wake ups can be very hard to deal with at their max range potential
This is my opinion, and whether you agree or not, is just you. Use this information wisely however because this is basically a breakdown of her grabs.
Thanks, man. I mostly go for 426 just for the combo. Guess I have to practice some new things.

Also, thank you vINv for the Christie match up. I always thought Rachel looked a lot better in her black costume. That's just me being casual as balls tho. :)
 

Viper Excess

Member
Bronx, NY
3DS Friend Code
2062-9146-6044
PSN ID
Viper_Excess
In terms of Christie's 6p string, IDK if this will be helpful or not, but her third P in the string (at least in DOA4) gives +0 on all hits (NH/CH/HCH). Her first two P's in the string are definitely dangerous when they stun you, but the third P left both ppl in neutral, and the last P is always a knockdown, which I don't actually consider that dangerous against Christie. If I am wrong in any of this, I will edit this post.

I'd like to offer some input on Rachel's throws too. 6T is a must for Rachel, whether punishing or tick throwing. 5 forward grabs and a low jab will end the round just on damage alone. Rachel players should be looking to punish always, because it offers her good damage and the pressure opportunity from knockdown.

4T offers great damage on HiC, but it can definitely be fuzzy guarded if you try to use it as a tick throw. I would not recommend using it for offense.

426T at least is much harder to fuzzy guard when you mix in 6P/6K (1 frame difference between attack and throw, so opponent's fuzzy must be airtight). 426T also allows for environment interaction when compared to 4T, and if you are worried about being pinned to the wall; the opponent must be mindful of 66T position switching.

66T, I feel, is not a gimmick. It is frame advantage that must be respected (on NH) and that grants free damage on CH/HCH. Free damage is gained from 3P launch to air grab stuff, which works even on other Rachels for ~62 damage. People can high crush PPT, but 66T has its place, definitely. Actually it has at least three places: whatever 3T cannot catch grab, 66T mostly will (barring low crushes). I've had some success using 66T against moves that are not true high crushes (i.e., Leon's 33P), where the opponent rises back up at the end of the move. This makes sense because 3T catches true high crushes (AKA people that stay crouching throughout their crushes like Helena) and 66T can catch those moves that do high crush but do not stay crouching throughout the whole move. 66T and 3T compliment each other pretty well.

Unlike 3T tho, 66T can catch people who do not crush at all. As long as you have at least +7 (from either stuns or opponent's disadvantage from free cancelling), the opponent must respect that you can 66T him for free damage if his/her offense goes wrong/predictable. Of course, the opponent may try to crush you, so this is where her other tools come in (twirl, 3T, all of her mids, etc.)

I'll come back to post about NH 66T, but +9 and BT status is pretty dangerous already. If the opponent makes one sudden move, he will eat at least 62 damage. But sometimes you may just have to show the opponent that blocking is a wrong move too.
 
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vINv

Active Member
alaska
Main Character
Gamertag
vINvSesaro
An extra about Christie don't allow her to push you to the wall she has a sit down throw which can put her on(+16)
and 6p on normal hit is-5 6pp-14 6ppp+21 6ppppKD. Also i like what your saying but 3p isnt guaranteed I've tested that set up its only guaranteed if they challenge 66T but if they don't your stuck with -11 and her free canceling took a big nerf in the last patch a good Christie is not gonna let that slide. Next one i write will b the MOST CONTRAVERSIAL OF RACHELS MATCH UPS
AND IN MY OPINION OFFLINE HER WORST ONE

8:2
 
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Tenryuga

Well-Known Member
Bronx, NY
Main Character
Hayate
3DS Friend Code
2535-4658-1818
PSN ID
Tenryuga
Somebody stated that Hitomi is as linear as Ein. I just came in here to say that is incorrect and that SS vs Hitomi is one of the worst things you could do.

Also I didn't know Rachels 6T was 6 frames. If that's the case I should prolly lay off 6PK as Hayate then.
 

Itz King Beebop

Active Member
Kansas City, MO
Main Character
Rachel
Gamertag
Hey itz Bebop
Somebody stated that Hitomi is as linear as Ein. I just came in here to say that is incorrect and that SS vs Hitomi is one of the worst things you could do.

Also I didn't know Rachels 6T was 6 frames. If that's the case I should prolly lay off 6PK as Hayate then.
6T isn't 6i, it's 7i, and it says it in the grab breakdown above. I went to practice and did Hayate's 6PK and mashed out jab strings immediately after, I was able to punish 6PK consistently with 6T so if the move is -7i (I can review again) it is truly punishable by 6T (just not online)

Hitomi SS-ing on the other hand, should be done in reaction to her string tendencies; SS-ing and interrupting strings before they get to the tracking part of the animation, which for 'Tomi, is the tracking high kick, and 19i mid punches... I do admit the claim that she is as linear as Ein was a little far fetched, but she isn't the "Queen of Tracking" either... agreed?
I guess you could take into account the fact that there are Hitomis that are 6T whores that can make SS-ing hell, but if you play Rachel, read the guide, and use the guide with some sense, you wouldn't really have to worry about that too much...
 
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