Stuff Hayate Lost from DOA5 Ver. 0.50 (E3)

Should Hayate get his tools back from E3?

  • Yes

    Votes: 4 80.0%
  • No

    Votes: 1 20.0%

  • Total voters
    5

crapoZK

Well-Known Member
Standard Donor
See, I don't know much about Hayate, but something bad must have happened to him to give him such a bad reputation in 1.03A. So I've observing stuff, and here's what I've found.
:hayate:
  • His :3::P::P: gave off a stun and SDS on regular hit, but did not guarantee a CB.
  • If you still own the Alpha Demo, play that and that is EXACTLY how Hayate played in E3.
  • His holds did quite a bit of damage, which is pretty good, I would have thought.
  • :2::5::8::P+K: sidestepped at least 2 (Non-tracking) attacks and went under highs. That is MUCH better than his current version.
  • I dunno if this is in 1.03A, but his :6::K: gave off a reasonable launch for a :P::P::P: > :9::K::K: combo afterwards and did a relaunch if the opponent was in the air.
  • Oh, that's where I get on to relaunches. In the Alpha Demo, I "believe" that Hayate could do :P::P:(:P:) and then :9::K::K: without forced tech setup. I think this was because the relaunch brought you higher up than before.
  • :9::K::K: had a relaunch, but it was pretty much useless because it only guaranteed the second :K:. Same with :3::3::K::K::K:.
That's all I know. This was for @Zeo since he had requested it and he wondered what Hayate had lost.

images

"Go hayateki nashi!"​
 
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Zeo

Well-Known Member
Much thanks. Turns out he didn't lose too much, his 8/2P+K nerf was huge but that ended up being the only really good tool he had and they took it away.
 

Gultigargar

Well-Known Member
Much thanks. Turns out he didn't lose too much, his 8/2P+K nerf was huge but that ended up being the only really good tool he had and they took it away.
Hey now, :236::H+P: and his sidestep :P: are pretty good too.
But then again, looks like they're nerfing both of those in 5U. So, uh, nevermind I guess.
 

Allan Paris

Well-Known Member
Turns out he didn't lose too much, his 8/2P+K nerf was huge but that ended up being the only really good tool he had and they took it away.

Nahh, he lost a bit. I can't find the conversation I had with Carl where we listed the stuff, sorry. Off the top of my head his Wind Dash was better than it is now. He had an tracking attack out of it which held up people from SS'ing it. All he has now is that slow as shit throw from it to track, which doesn't stop people from SS'ing it or whacking buttons when he does it. He also had tech throw setups, they were still in the game when it released and if IIRC they are gone now (several patches later). I haven't played around with them in months, they may still be there.
 

TakedaZX

Well-Known Member
I can understand the 3PP nerf... somewhat... and I can understand the hold damage nerf. 9KK wasn't really ever an important relaunch outside of tag anyway since the recovery is way too slow to follow up on by himself.

Also the sidestep nerf was dumb. It's the worst of the special tech crouching sidesteps since it doesn't actually go into crouching status and the tech crouch frames are also over before he goes into the recovery.

The wind dash nerfs (while stupid) weren't any worse than taking out his DOA4 Wind Dash anyway. It would've been better if they kept the old one in and also kept the new one in to be used as a cancel.

I say it a lot (probably 5th time on this forum), but the wind dashes both excelled at one thing or the other.

The first one worked as good [means to an entry]. It had an elbow, mid kick, low kick, throw, and teleport.
  • 236F~P - Mid elbow that worked as a NH stunning 6p. It cut so much distance and was very good for coming in with a stun. It was unsafe and had no follow ups but that didn't matter because of the other options.
  • 236F~K - Mid kick knockdown + wall splat. This kick was a mobile version of his 1K that worked as a hold mix-up for the elbow while still catching ducks. Also in DOA4.0, it was a sit-down stun on all hits. Crazy if you ask me but then again sit down stuns weren't all that great in DOA4.
  • 236F~2K - Low slide kick. Very iconic move. Ended with a knockdown that left you right in their face to play Hayate's wake up game or if you teched, just put it into a reset situation basically. This was your safer option for blockers. Damage was sufficient since it was for getting in while getting chip damage.
  • 236F~T - They needed a place for this grab and I don't think it fit better anywhere else than here. It was his alternative to the low slide kick to beat standing guard while getting better damage for a hi counter blow risk.
  • 236F~66 - Teleport. Gets you in behind them. nothing more nothing less.
The secondary wind dash seems to serve more so as [means to an end]. The options were two unsafe mid launchers that had to be blocked with a frame advantage high punch and grab to cover people blocking correctly.
  • 6P+K~P+K and 6P+K~K - They were the launchers, and these launchers created a great 50/50 to rely on in many cases. The uppercut was self explanatory but the Wind Dash Kick was what stood out. Here was an extremely unsafe 2 in 1 launcher that gave a good pay off no matter what circumstances it hit on. These were the most important moves because implemented correctly, it could push him farther ahead as the king of launchers.
  • 6P+K~P - The frame advantage (+7) to cover his ass if his launchers were being blocked correctly. It also served as a 3rd option to wall splat in combos as an alternative to the other two launchers.
  • 6P+K~T - Same case as the above, but for the damage instead of the frame advantage. Basically the equivalent of Kasumi's 33T/3P+K~T
As opposed to the original dash (DOA4), this dash only led to knockdowns or juggles (which would lead to nothing but knockdowns). This was not way to enter outside of randomly putting the high punch on the map for a ranged splat or to get in at advantage.

Mixing this stance with certain moves (like PPK/H+K, 3K if made slightly unsafe again, 214P, and BT 7K (on hit only) would give him a real integration of his stance overall and let him use it to its full potential...
 
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