"Do you like Pain?" DOA5U changes

[CtrlAltThe1337]

So with the rolling ground throw's damage nerfed from 40 to 35, and lots of stuff can end in 3K 2T22T, I wonder what are Bayman's best options if they break 2T22T. He is at +3, but it leaves them at a Kokoro distance that most stuff Bayman has just doesnt have the reach for. Only thing I can think of is 46P, but that is more of a +13 move.

He has some new options out of the front roll now, but when I was tried to use it from a distance, I still got beat by just about everything. And boy does it hurt like an SoB when you get hit while rolling. Is it once again doomed to be useless as a ranged tool, and only good for using after P+K, 9P, and 3K to screw with their minds? I managed to steal a couple of close matches using 9P3P+KT at the very end, they were waiting for me to whiff 9PP complete and finish me off, but the new roll caught them by surprise lol.

His T and 4T grabs got a 25% damage buff, loving it.


Edit: after a little testing, it seems both 8P and 236P has the reach to hit the opponent after they break 2T22T ground throw. But they are both fairly slow, so any fast highs or mids from the opponent can beat them, even with the +3 frame advange.

 

[Rikuto]

The front roll actually has some limited use I have found.

If you put yourself in a situation where 9P is useful, condition your opponent to anticipate the followup as being slightly delayed. It is a super-high/mid crush so most matchups will respect it even when it is delayed. It's also unsafe, so they will want to block it.

When they see bayman jump they will think about the followup being delayed, and when a front roll comes out instead their reaction timing will become messed up because it was not what their eyes were looking for. In that situation, most intelligent players will lock up into a block and allow you to use your front roll options on them.

It's the same primary concept as the false pressure that is applied by a character like Nightmare with his Grim Stride.

 

[CtrlAltThe1337]

Hmm... P+K, on NH at least, no longer garentees 3K, even without slow escaping, you have just enough time to pull out a hi counter hold... This is a nerf right?

 

[Rikuto]

Hmm... P+K, on NH at least, no longer garentees 3K, even without slow escaping, you have just enough time to pull out a hi counter hold... This is a nerf right?

Yes. It wasn't actually intended for Bayman I believe, but it is a system nerf to those particular kind of sitdown stuns.

You can still launch immediately with 33P however.

Next time I get the opportunity I will field my concerns over it as it feels unnecessary when they already boosted the overall HP, making that damage trap less relevant.

 

[CtrlAltThe1337]

Yes. It wasn't actually intended for Bayman I believe, but it is a system nerf to those particular kind of sitdown stuns.

You can still launch immediately with 33P however.

Next time I get the opportunity I will field my concerns over it as it feels unnecessary when they already boosted the overall HP, making that damage trap less relevant.

P+K3P+KP almost garrentees a launch as well, almost as in it works with fast slow escape setting in training mode, but not fastest. And it can be followed with 3K rolling thunder, as I like to call it, as long as there is absolutely no delay in inputs. It is fun to have Bayman do two rolls within the same combo. Like the old Undertaker's intro says, keep rollin' rollin' rollin'...

 

[Cylith]

Am I the only one not liking Bayman in Ultimate? I've mained him since 3 and my favorite version of him is DOA5(patch1.03). I'm having a hard time adjusting to him. Not having FT's is REALLY annoying since that is muscle memory for me.. And the rolls, although interesting, don't seem anymore useful. I'm experimenting with the backwards roll, but so far against my training partners, it gets stuffed if I go in for a n attack.

Would greatly appreciate any advice players may have.

 

[KidArk]

Am I the only one not liking Bayman in Ultimate? I've mained him since 3 and my favorite version of him is DOA5(patch1.03). I'm having a hard time adjusting to him. Not having FT's is REALLY annoying since that is muscle memory for me.. And the rolls, although interesting, don't seem anymore useful. I'm experimenting with the backwards roll, but so far against my training partners, it gets stuffed if I go in for a n attack.

Would greatly appreciate any advice players may have.

You're not the only one im really having a tough time adjusting aswell, I've been using 3k a lot more and 8p, back roll is nice if they like pressing buttons, stun, backroll out and open them up again. The gravity just feels so weird. In other news leon is awesome.

 

[Rikuto]

Am I the only one not liking Bayman in Ultimate? I've mained him since 3 and my favorite version of him is DOA5(patch1.03). I'm having a hard time adjusting to him. Not having FT's is REALLY annoying since that is muscle memory for me.. And the rolls, although interesting, don't seem anymore useful. I'm experimenting with the backwards roll, but so far against my training partners, it gets stuffed if I go in for a n attack.

Would greatly appreciate any advice players may have.

In every single different version of DOA 5 I have played, including pre-release builds, Bayman has been a completely different character. My favorite version of Bayman was E3 2012.

But after playing DOA 4 for so many years, there is literally nothing they can do to the guy to make him unplayable for me.

He is different now then 1.03, you have to take a more technical approach to his damage dealing and be smart about how you apply pressure with 6P+K. He still has all of his stance related tools, but most of you guys never use them. You should.

 

[Cylith]

In every single different version of DOA 5 I have played, including pre-release builds, Bayman has been a completely different character. My favorite version of Bayman was E3 2012.

But after playing DOA 4 for so many years, there is literally nothing they can do to the guy to make him unplayable for me.

He is different now then 1.03, you have to take a more technical approach to his damage dealing and be smart about how you apply pressure with 6P+K. He still has all of his stance related tools, but most of you guys never use them. You should.

This is info I will definitely take this advice to the lab and try my best to apply. I've been trying to use more and experimenting more with the rolls. I normally don't have a lot of patience(usually I play rushdown) so I think I need to slow down my play with him in this version.

 

[Rikuto]

Bayman is as defensive as they come. You can go HAM, but you need to wait for the right moment and then go HAM.

 

[FightersLegend]

 

[Hikari-Senca]

Don't know if this has been discovered already, but I just found an awesome trick that'll definitely annoy people. >:3

After a wall smash, if you do 3PP6K and then execute a well-timed 2T, you'll be able to option select your opponent's wake up options based on how they'll react. If they tech (which they always do) your 2T, you'll be at enough advantage on whiff to interrupt your opponent with a move up to i14 (or a high crush if you know they'll attack with a high) thanks to them recovering from the tech. And if they do tech, then they'll be eating a 2T,

To make this work, you have to slightly delay 2T to the point where it'll connect and keep you at advantage on whiff at the same time. The best part about this is that you don't have to worry if they'll tech or not because the throw animation helps to give you time to prepare the 22T follow up, so all you really need to focus on is the tech option and what they'll do afterwards.

I hope this helps out some people who miss his old wall FT juggle.

 

[KidArk]

In order to FT I've been experimenting with 8p, so far after 8p, all I got is 2kk, 8p