"Do you like Pain?" DOA5U changes

[Rikuto]

So basically as you theorized, is a thing now.

I'm not convinced he's lost his guaranteed ground throws exactly, but the timing is certainly a lot more strict now. Force techs off of ground slams are out of the question, though he still has them from his wall setups. I wasn't reacting anywhere near as fast as I could have been. The Knee is a While Rising attack, and his old one has been changed to . His old punt kick of death has been given back to Leon, as is fitting.

 

[RoboJoe]

What are all of Bayman's options out of back roll? I know about the low kick and the leaping punch. Is there more?

 

[Rikuto]

If there are more, I didn't find them in time. I only hopped on with bayman like twice. Took me a while just to figure out the notation for his back roll was

 

[Russian-chiropractic19]

So basically as you theorized, is a thing now.
The Knee is a While Rising attack, and his old one has been changed to . His old punt kick of death has been given back to Leon, as is fitting.

he can have it,never used the thing anyhow. sounds like the break shot will be easier to use now,ive always liked that move for some reason. a bit disappointing to learn his knee is rising attack im not to comfortable with those.

im afraid to ask but does his still cause a limbo stun?

 

[Rikuto]

I didn't really examine H+K.

I can tell you that his knee is a mid, so that already makes it less stressful to do than his DOA 5 breakshot. The launch height is actually really good too for how fast it comes out. You gota remember that Leon is a fatass.

 

[Russian-chiropractic19]

really? im surprised thats one of his most powerful tools to me,oh well

thats right i forgot Leon was a heavy weight,i hardly ever run into them so i forgot

 

[Rikuto]

Well yea, his limbo IS good but I already determined that jumping into it was going to be a big deal. The old was his best deal launcher from backturned and being aware that it was missing I decided to save all limbo concerns for when I had more time in the lab to play.

 

[Russian-chiropractic19]

wait they took away that supper awkward,slow,leaves you in a back turn state,kick?.... dammit! i loved that thing mainly because i could just do PP 2T(i thought for the longest time that was guaranteed)

 

[Rikuto]

No, you're thinking of the wrong direction.

That kick is still in and it has a different kind of launch animation now. It's similar to the one from the knee.

 

[Russian-chiropractic19]

wait the one i was talking about cant launch from BT so which one are we talking about now?

also the only move im seeing from BT that can launch is that is the punt which does nothing out of stun

 

[Rikuto]

You are profoundly confused. I'm not sure I possess the ability to unconfuse you.

You are too deep in the rabbit hole now. TURN BACK

 

[Forlorn Penguin]

Would you be able to explain the reasoning behind the different stuns after P+K that we can see in this video?

At 1:28, it lands on Hi Counter Strike and slams Leon to the ground.
At 1:31, it lands on Normal Hit and puts Leon in the bound state (Leon appears to be crouching when hit).
At 5:22, it lands on Normal Hit, and slams Leon to the ground (Leon is doing a low hold).
At 6:28, it lands on Normal Hit again, but this time, it causes a sitdown stun like it does in vanilla DOA5.

 

[Rikuto]

1:28 it has always done that, even in vanilla DOA 5. You will never get a high-counter sit down from that attack.

1:31 I don't know for certain. That is the first time it has ever achieved that effect for me. It may be because he is crouching, but more likely it is because it was because he couldnt be stunned as he was going into KO from the hit.

5:22 He is still technically in critical as far as the threshold is concerned, even though he is holding out of it. As long as you are inside of the critical threshold, the slam will result in hitting the ground. The only time the slam results in sit down is if it is the very first hit leading into critical, and if it is NH or CH.

6:28 it is the very first hit, and it is NH, thus meeting the criteria for a sit down.


In case you are wondering, there is a political reason that you can't get a sitdown on HCB from that attack. If you could, you would be getting around 60-70% lifebar every time it landed without a critical burst. The amount of crying would ensure that it got removed completely. This is Shimbori giving you a good tool and watching your backs at the same time.

 

[Forlorn Penguin]

1:28 it has always done that, even in vanilla DOA 5. You will never get a high-counter sit down from that attack.

Right. Just making note of all the hits in the video.

1:31 I don't know for certain. That is the first time it has ever achieved that effect for me. It may be because he is crouching, but more likely it is because it was because he couldnt be stunned as he was going into KO from the hit.

Makes sense.

5:22 He is still technically in critical as far as the threshold is concerned, even though he is holding out of it. As long as you are inside of the critical threshold, the slam will result in hitting the ground. The only time the slam results in sit down is if it is the very first hit leading into critical, and if it is NH or CH.

Okay. Gotcha.

6:28 it is the very first hit, and it is NH, thus meeting the criteria for a sit down.

Yeah. Figured as much on that one.

In case you are wondering, there is a political reason that you can't get a sitdown on HCB from that attack. If you could, you would be getting around 60-70% lifebar every time it landed without a critical burst. The amount of crying would ensure that it got removed completely. This is Shimbori giving you a good tool and watching your backs at the same time.

Understood. Thanks for the reply.

 

[Rikuto]

That said, I'm not sure yet how to apply correctly. There definitely isn't enough time to connect a rolling ground throw after you smash a standing opponent, and the one time I managed to launch someone and try it that way they were going uphill so that corrupted the results completely.

I noticed that the slam now keeps the persons head oriented away from you, unlike before. The purpose of the new knee launching animation may be to prevent that from happening, as the head launches in a different direction. Normal strikes still seem to reverse orientation on that float, so this is pure speculation. I know for a fact that he has a new neck snap from rolling though.

 

[Russian-chiropractic19]

I would imagine it would be like if the initial hit connects go for the launcher if they block you can attempt to go for a leg throw,but because the roll happens so quick prematurely reacting like going for a low throw when you do P+K only would put them in danger. and because rolling P is a mid so just guard crouching wouldn't keep them safe.

thats assuming your talking bout what i think you are though

I know for a fact that he has a new neck snap from rolling though.

is it a new animation or does he just do his standard one from a roll

 

[KidArk]

That said, I'm not sure yet how to apply correctly.

Perhaps it can be used to punish them if they try to throw punish p+k . There may also be new moves out of rolling or depending on what state the opponent is in after p+k you might be able to capitalize on them with the rolling moves to juggle better perhaps? I'm still not sure what i'll be juggling with on bound with most characters anyway.

 

[Rikuto]

Right, so basically its like this.

He's a completely different character now. Don't look shocked, in EVERY version of DOA 5 he has been a totally different beast. Virtually everything solid he had has taken a nerf in some way shape or form. Even his force tech off of the wall sweep is gone.

But, it's not doom and gloom. He got some pretty cool tricks at the same time.

The four big things that are useful now.

1. has become , and now has a wicked stun on any kind of hit. This makes it an even better pressure tool than it was.

2. can be canceled into front roll upon landing instead of finishing the string. This gives us some interesting, if not situational mixup opportunities.

3. has additional range attached to it now, making it easier to end consistently in juggles.

4. Back Roll is king at long range engagements, and deceptively useful after you've hit someone into a wall. His followup closes distance fast and guard breaks, and his followup grants a NH low stun. Ideal scenario is to pummel someone into the environment, roll back in anticipation of a wakeup kick, then use the follow attack to apply pressure.

 

[Russian-chiropractic19]

Very happy to hear his gaurd break was changed to two inputs,it was very akward for me to use it at the right time now that shouldn't be a problem. So what type of stun does it cause no?

 

[Rikuto]

Very happy to hear his gaurd break was changed to two inputs,it was very akward for me to use it at the right time now that shouldn't be a problem. So what type of stun does it cause no?

Same type as a high jab does inside of critical where they stagger backwards briefly.