Mila's 1.0.3 Changes

DrDogg

Well-Known Member
Full List:

6P: changed recovery from 16 to 19F.
66P: changed advantage on guard from GB(+12) to GB(+7F).
9P: changed to bounce on Counter hit or higher.
4K: changed disadvantage on normal hit from +2 to -6F, and disadvantage on guard from -3 to -6F.
K, PK, PPK, back turned K: changed hit reaction on Counter hit to be the same as Hi Counter hit.
2KPPP: fixed an issue that made it harder to hit with some foot positions.
H+K: changed damage from 30 to 32.
1P: change to have no stun with +2F advantage on normal hit, and be in squatting status right when the move ends.
Tackle cancel P: changed to be in squatting status right when the move ends.
Changed total frames for tackle to 50F, and changed to be in squatting status at the beginning and end.
Triple Pound (Mount P・P・P): changed damage from 10+15+20 to 10+10+30.
Mounted Position T: changed damage from 30 to 35.
KKK in Side Position or in Sprawl: changed damage from 15+15+15 to 15+15+20.
T in Side Position or Sprawl: changed damage from 30 to 35.
Sidestep P: changed startup from 26 to 27, changed disadvantage on guard from -7 to -13F, changed damage from 20 to 18.
Sidestep K: changed disadvantage on guard from -12 to -7F, change hit reaction on Counter hit to a bigger stagger.
Sidestep T: changed startup from 28 to 33F.

6P has more recovery - Big fail! No reason to make this change.

66P now only +7 - Big fail! If it was mid, I might be okay with this, but as a high attack that doesn't track... and now with tackle being slower (and less of a mix-up option)... yeah big fail here!

9P now bounces - Big fail! Seems like this means you don't get a guaranteed mount now.

4K has more recovery - Big fail! Goodbye tackle loop setups.

K now has a bigger stun on CH - This is actually bad because it's your go to attack after 6T. The way it was before, you could loop 6T due to the short stun on CH K. Now you can't do that unless the opponent counters. So instead of a relatively safe 6T throw loop, you now have to deal with a normal stun and the opponent trying to counter randomly. Pretty big fail here!

H+K does more damage - Great...? Not really significant at all.

1P no longer stuns and only gives +2 advantage on normal hit - Big Fail! At least make it tech crouch faster if you're going to make this kind of change.

Tackle is slower by 9 frames now - I need to see the full frame data on this. If the active window is larger, I'll be happy, but I doubt that's the change. More than likely it has more execution frames and possibly more recovery. Both of which would be a big fail!

Damage on mount punches/kickss shifts so that the last hit is the big damage and the second hit is less damage - This means you lose damage now if you let the opponent escape to take your frame advantage. I don't like this change and definitely don't feel it was necessary. Big nerf IMO!

Damage was buffed on the ground throw "throw" option - Okay... I guess. Nice for near the end of the round.

Sidestep P is now unsafe - Big Fail! This wasn't at all broken and yet they change it.

Sidestep K is now safe - nice, but it's high so not that great, especially when a good opponent will duck or low throw to avoid SS tackle

Sidestep tackle is slower - Fail
 

Yaguar

Well-Known Member
I was on the DOA 5 site on lunch at work and all I read was "nerf, nerf, nerf".

So many of these seem like changes for the sake of changes, the :6::P: change is possibly the most retarded thing I've ever seen. Couple that with :4::K: changes and are we looking at her having no poke game at all near enough?
 

Doa_Eater

Well-Known Member
I was on the DOA 5 site on lunch at work and all I read was "nerf, nerf, nerf".

So many of these seem like changes for the sake of changes, the :6::P: change is possibly the most retarded thing I've ever seen. Couple that with :4::K: changes and are we looking at her having no poke game at all near enough?

And now i even have tracking, LOL.
 

DR2K

Well-Known Member
She retain all her advantage from Tackle breaks, 3 H+K is still full of shenanigans, she's a little more unsafe in some areas and safer in others and generally does more damage. Girlfriend is fine.
 

mcpeanuts

Member
Big fail!

Big fail!

Big fail!
Noticing a trend here.

I'll at least try Mila after this patch but yeah this all looks pretty bad. I'm thinking of putting more work into my Rig. I'm excited about the buff to his BND T, among other things.
 

Yaguar

Well-Known Member
I wont be dropping her. I've spent a week training on a few new things and setups and none of these will take a hit from the changes. What I'm not sure how I'll handle now is getting into combo's.

The tackle changes I'm not hugely fussed about... I really know I should be but eventually we will see how it goes. Honestly it looks like a change for online more than offline which does annoy me. Especially with the buff to ducking already.

66P only being +7 does sounds like 6T could be aimed to land on it. You could only land :P: on it against a wall anyway, I know it was a big factor in wall games but I think we could see some other setups leading from this, I'd be amazed if there is no throw follow up.

:K: stun... I have of agree with Dogg here but there could be something to salvage there...

:4::h: :2::T: :K: :K: :K: is now going to be nice. At least that is something, right?
(Pre-bed time ramble over, but I'll be sticking with her even if she drops to the bottom of a tier list).
 

Yaguar

Well-Known Member
She retain all her advantage from Tackle breaks

1P: change to have no stun with +2F advantage on normal hit, and be in squatting status right when the move ends.

Advantage yes but :P: is unsafe and :1::P: (The low punch she uses from tackle breaks) has had a serious nerf.

she's a little more unsafe in some areas

4K: changed disadvantage on normal hit from +2 to -6F, and disadvantage on guard from -3 to -6F.
Sidestep T: changed startup from 28 to 33F

Unsafe in area's that really did matter to her.

generally does more damage

Triple Pound (Mount P・P・P): changed damage from 10+15+20 to 10+10+30.

That damage movement is an overall a loss considering you want the third strike to break.
The damage was added to places that didn't need it. With the exclusion of mount KKK which is the only damage buff I can notice.

I am thankful they left :4::P::P: and :2::K::P: alone though.
 

Yaguar

Well-Known Member
As a final note before I hit the hay. Though they've said tackle is 50 frames and as Dogg noted it will depend on where those frames go... a 3/3/3 split might be okay (I'd rather see more of it at the end than start tbh) but it may not effect tackle hugely as far as cancels and :6::6::T: go.

Might be time to look more into cancels than letting it ride though. If the SS T change is anything to go by we could be seeing 5 of those frames at start up.
 

XZero264

FSD | Nichol
Premium Donor
That's
Come on who didn't see this coming? This is one of the reasons I moved on from her, she was ripe for nerfs lol
It's something to always expect for new series characters, they are either really good or bad and developers can't tell until thousands of people play them. I've seen Mila as fairly balanced (a little weak on the strikes but she more than made up for that with her throws and her mount break recovery attacks, surprised those weren't nerfed tbh).

I'm really glad they are fixing her 2KPPP, drove me up the wall missing two of those hits seemingly every time I used it.
I wonder just how badly the new "squatting" status of tackle will affect gameplay, on tackle whiff I use throws as follow ups. As for the frame change to tackle, not terribly distressed but that is probably because I don't play Mila as a Tacklewhore (but it is my second most used throw). Most of these nerfs don't really affect the way I play her but let's see where this goes.
 

Kakita

Member
My 2 cents:

1- 6P: it''s now 19f recovery, that's on whiff not on block right? Wasn't it 9f recovery on block? She still has the followup knee to keep opponents honest, but I do agree it will affect her poking game and fishing for CH.
2- Takedown (TD): it's not clear how badly TD has been affected and how TD cancel moves will be affected by the TD nerf. Still, this is what scares me the most out of the whole patch. This is what makes her a grappler. TD to Mila is like Izuna Otoshi to Hayabusa...
3- 4K and 4K TD cancel variants (P/K/2P): Nerfing 4K by itself is no big deal (speed and range remains unchanged), but how will the recovery from the kick now effect the TD cancel options? Once more depending on how TD was corrected cancels may still be good. If they no longer are, then my play style will need major adjustments. This is my second greatest concern...
4- 1P and TD cancel 2P: They nerfed this punch on NH but what about CH what will it be? +2 frame advantage isn't great but it's still advantage I guess. It won't be too bad considering followups like P and 6P. Still they could've made it crush faster to compensate for the loss f advantage (honestly this move was fine, why touch it? if it was a problem learn to stagger escape, the stun wasn't broken).
5- 9P: It now bounces on CH or HCH. What does it do on NH? Ain't too bad since this move was mainly used for forcetech loops and besides 3F+K is still there to pick up the mantle. Furthermore, 9P had issues mainly because it was a high mid so it was succeptible to certain high crushes. It's advantages were mostly its hold resistant properties and how safe it was. This being said, a question still remains. Will a juggle be possible off the new bounce this moves offers on CH?I'm hoping it does. Provided the bounce is good enough, we could very well see 3F+K forcetech into pseudo which would be sexy (too good to be true)...
6- 5K, PPK, Pk, BT K: The only real issue with this kick is how is now changes our options after using 6T. The kick is still guaranteed but now just stuns better. Since the stun is different, I'm guessin we'll simply have to either launch or push for CB off of it, possibly leading to into pseudo juggles. Before, the stun was too short to continue stun, rather we had to mixup TD and 66K after it or loop 6T again (which is a loss). Nontheless, KP shenanigans will still be possible too, so i thinks her 6T won't have lost too much.
7- Damage modifications to mount/side/sprawl kicks and punches: This is another thing that bothers me. I mean if you're going to do this, at least make the throw harder to break or allow the use of the throw versions instead of a punch/kick. I mean the alreadt nerfed TD, why needlessly nerf options once it connects? This is like beating a dead horse!
8- Loss of her special backsdash: Although it was awesome, it was weird, felt wrong to use (glitchy), and all other characters who had similar movement lost theirs as well. I mainly used her special backdash to escape get up kicks, but then again they nerfed get up kicks, so I'm ok with it.
9- Loss her throw setups that could beat out trikes on getup: For those who didn't know, After a CB Mila had a pseudo for lightweights and midweights that changed properties of two of her throws. Basically, when used on the first two frames of the opponents teching animation, these throws would beat out any staning attack beside croushing attacks of jumping attacks. These throws were 6T for lightweights (OP!!!) and 5T for midwights (OK). This shit was awesome, but kind of felt wrong since it went against the basic rock/paper/scissor concept central to DOA. I'm not surprised this was removed. The pseudo is still good after CB, however, now we'll have to use TD instead which could be bad depending on how TD turns out...
10- 66P: Nerfing her high power punch means she won't get the natural jab followup near the wall anymore which hurts her wall game somewhat. It will still be good near a wall but now the opponent will be able to block any followup attack. This will basically force us to switch between a good mid and 6T for her wall game (somewhat lackluster)...
11- SSP/SST/SSK: Her sidestep has been nerfed, but not too much. SS T is slower but if used to evade attacks and not just throw out there (as it should) it should still do the job. I never was a big fan of SS P but it sucks SS K will be the good one now since it's a high. Still if the stun is like 5K on CH, might have something to salvage.

So basically, I feel that how Mila will be from now on depends mostly on two things:

First: How bad they nerfed TD. Having it 50 frames total is no big deal, but as pointed out previously, startup/active/recovery frames distribution will tell us how bad the damage is. Don't get me wrong, I'm all for having a lot of time to properly throw punish TD, but make it worth the risk for Mila! I mean, she is a grappler for Christ sake and the throw is easily escapable! If TD is badly nerfed, then she'll be stuck using 214 T in situations where she would use TD which makes her look like a pseudo grappler

Second: How bad the 4K nerfs and TD nerfs will change her TD cancel variants: If these are too slow, then she looses a lot of her setups that lead to pseudo force tech juggles. Mila doesn't need many stuns to launch, this is common knowledge. Usually one stun (ex: 6P) followed by either 4K~TD cancel~K for example is enough to go into a pseudo juggle and her pressuring. Another example after the initial stun is to follow with 4K~TD cancel~P and then CB (or launch) into a pseudo juggle. For me, this is the way to go with her. The faster you go into pseudo juggles, the better. Making 4K into TD/TD cancel variants too slow forces her to use her crappier stuns (2KP, 3KK, PPP, 4PP, 4PK, 4P2K, 6K, 6PK, etc) and rather limited launchers (6F+K/33P are too slow and 9K is a high). Outside 3P/3PP (Ok maybe 4PP), her stuns offer little chance to go for CB or launch (because of stagger escape). This is why she had TD cancel variants like the punch and K, stagger escape couldn't help against those. Futhermore, add all this to her now more punishable pokes and it will be riskier up close to fish for CH which will make her pseudos hard to use outside of whiff punishing with 4F+K.

Funny because I know some people will say: At least she'll still have 3F+K...

Time will tell.
 

synce

Well-Known Member
There's a good bit of nerfs but to get an idea of the new Mila I think you just need to focus on these 4 changes. I put them in the order you're likely to see them in an actual match..

4K: changed disadvantage on normal hit from +2 to -6F, and disadvantage on guard from -3 to -6F.

(Okay, let's go for TD!)

Changed total frames for tackle to 50F, and changed to be in squatting status at the beginning and end.

(By this time you're probably knocked out of TD. No? Okay. You tackle and get broken out of it, so..)

1P: change to have no stun with +2F advantage on normal hit, and be in squatting status right when the move ends.

(Whoop, that didn't do much. Let's try...)

Sidestep T: changed startup from 28 to 33F.

(Bah! This time you got low throw punished.)

I don't think Mila is completely destroyed with these changes, but if you just spammed TD and didn't bother mixing it up you're going to have to rethink your strategy. She's probably mid tier now too.
 

Kakita

Member
There's a good bit of nerfs but to get an idea of the new Mila I think you just need to focus on these 4 changes. I put them in the order you're likely to see them in an actual match..

4K: changed disadvantage on normal hit from +2 to -6F, and disadvantage on guard from -3 to -6F.

(Okay, let's go for TD!)

Changed total frames for tackle to 50F, and changed to be in squatting status at the beginning and end.

(By this time you're probably knocked out of TD. No? Okay. You tackle and get broken out of it, so..)

1P: change to have no stun with +2F advantage on normal hit, and be in squatting status right when the move ends.

(Whoop, that didn't do much. Let's try...)

Sidestep T: changed startup from 28 to 33F.

(Bah! This time you got low throw punished.)

I don't think Mila is completely destroyed with these changes, but if you just spammed TD and didn't bother mixing it up you're going to have to rethink your strategy. She's probably mid tier now too.

I understand what was written about 4K, but how will this change moves such as 4K~TD cancel~P for example in terms of speed? I think to answer this, updated frame data is needed. As of now, telling me TD is 50 frames, doesn't say much, especially in regards to TD cancel moves.

You are right, the idea is to never simply spam TD. Setups are important. But if the frame ratio (active frames vs starting frames vs recovery frames) is bad, well no matter how well TD is used, it might no longer be worth the risk, especially if on top of that, the damage is nerfed and escaping is easy. I might as well risk using something like 214T or simply stick with 6T, wouldn't you agree? There's nerfing and then there's rendering something useless. Kind of like what they did to Hayabusa's 8K. Why use that launcher with his current 4K? Pointless move.

Again 1P can't just be analyzed in a vacuum. Its TD cancel variant needs to be judged based on how well it will work in conjunction with her other TD cancel moves. Therefore, we need to know how TD cancels will be modified by the changes to TD.

Just like TD needs setup like you mentioned, SS T needs to be used correctly, that is to respond to an attack and not just thrown out there. That nerf isn't too harsh actually.
 

rximmortal

Active Member
From far long time i must disagree with the audience here. Because These so called nerfs are not so big and some of them are not even nerfs at all.
1 - They nerfed the side step in general and the moves in side step for all characters so basicly it is still the same.
2 - 6p nerf is so meaningless that i even cant understand why it is comment . They change recovery on whiff . Plus you have kick as follow up so even if they side step you mid punch and he whiffs you will hit him with knee on counter.
3 - 66p - was OP move , but they discard it thisway so yes it is big nerf here.
4 - K - make Hi counter hit AMAZINGLY BIG BUFF here. ( This is so big that it denies all nerfs. You have guaranteed combo starter with high frame stun after a comand grab what you need more.) On this version now you have only 1 follow up after kick and this 6t loop is not so great because if the oponent just let you finish you combo he will not take so much damage at all. But on 1.03 when i have guaranteed combo u have at least 4-5 follow ups after K so let him guess.
5 - The changes on takedowns and damages are insignificant too (nor buff or nerf there)
6 - Many of moves that dont have crouch before have now which is pretty nice.
7- 1P ( Big nerf i agree).
8 - 4k is nerfed but dont affect my game at all cuz it dosnt matter when you cancel it in takkle.
So thats are the most significant part of the changes
 

Kakita

Member
From far long time i must disagree with the audience here. Because These so called nerfs are not so big and some of them are not even nerfs at all.
1 - They nerfed the side step in general and the moves in side step for all characters so basicly it is still the same.
2 - 6p nerf is so meaningless that i even cant understand why it is comment . They change recovery on whiff . Plus you have kick as follow up so even if they side step you mid punch and he whiffs you will hit him with knee on counter.
3 - 66p - was OP move , but they discard it thisway so yes it is big nerf here.
4 - K - make Hi counter hit AMAZINGLY BIG BUFF here. ( This is so big that it denies all nerfs. You have guaranteed combo starter with high frame stun after a comand grab what you need more.) On this version now you have only 1 follow up after kick and this 6t loop is not so great because if the oponent just let you finish you combo he will not take so much damage at all. But on 1.03 when i have guaranteed combo u have at least 4-5 follow ups after K so let him guess.
5 - The changes on takedowns and damages are insignificant too (nor buff or nerf there)
6 - Many of moves that dont have crouch before have now which is pretty nice.
7- 1P ( Big nerf i agree).
8 - 4k is nerfed but dont affect my game at all cuz it dosnt matter when you cancel it in takkle.
So thats are the most significant part of the changes

Why would they nerf sidestep in general? The tracking was already still pretty tight IMO. This is just silly. From what I recently read, Akira got a a buff to sidestep (not sure what). So not everyone lost in this department it seems.

That's what I understood from reading changes to 6P. I also believe it's on whiff, so yeah no big deal there you're right.

Yes 66P is a loss, I guess people were abusing it. Her wall game is still good. Just not insane. Before +12 meant following up with her 18 frames 66K (coming out in 6f, woah). Now using 66k will be 11f, so you could jab out of it. you could use 66P again since it high crushes in the first frames. Mixing that with 66K you make it viable.

Damage reduction to her ground and pound and knees in ground throw position isn't a big deal you're right, but seeing as they nerfed TD, I would've liked to see the mount position harder to escape out of (especially for the first two hits).

Adding crouching before and afer TD to mee isn't a real issue.

1P nerf sucks but the change is only to NH you can still counter hit with it which might happen when the mixing it up with her other TD cancel attacks.

You say 4K changes don't matter because you go into TD cancels, are you sure about that? I mean they lenghtened the recovery on hit and block for this move. Wouldn't that mean her TD cancels would come out slower after the kick (this is my primary beef with the changes now)?
 

rximmortal

Active Member
You say 4K changes don't matter because you go into TD cancels, are you sure about that? I mean they lenghtened the recovery on hit and block for this move. Wouldn't that mean her TD cancels would come out slower after the kick (this is my primary beef with the changes now)?

You dont go in recovery because it is same like combo. Which means you dont have recovery between the hits only start up and active frames.
And besides all i still thing the "k" counters like HI counter is beyond good buff anyway.
You can do something like that. Because it is a set up: 6T. than crouch dash (in which time u see if the oponent make counter hold) than if he not you normal punch and go in 33 frames stun. If he do than you grab him again.
Or you can just continue "k" with 4 or 5 different type of hits so the guess game is in your advantage.
 

Raansu

Well-Known Member
You dont go in recovery because it is same like combo. Which means you dont have recovery between the hits only start up and active frames.
And besides all i still thing the "k" counters like HI counter is beyond good buff anyway.
You can do something like that. Because it is a set up: 6T. than crouch dash (in which time u see if the oponent make counter hold) than if he not you normal punch and go in 33 frames stun. If he do than you grab him again.
Or you can just continue "k" with 4 or 5 different type of hits so the guess game is in your advantage.

No, there is a recovery between the two animations.
 

SilverKhaos

Active Member
Keep in mind. These are just CHANGES. its not like shes switching to an entirely different moveset.

Its just gonna require slight tweaking to your playstyle, is all.
 
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