DOA5U NanhouDrops says Hi to you Kokoro Players (New Tech)

[HoodsXx]

I haven't fully delved into her yet, as I've only labbed her seriously for like 20 mins today other than playing online with her. (Still gettin used to her). But this is some stuff I found with her, that Ik none of you Koko players have thought of yet.

1. 6KP 9PP2K off of this she has a FT option, being 2H+KK. Now ofc they can tech after the 9PP2K but here's where the fun comes into play. If you condition them to tech your 2H+KK, she's got 9PP2KP+K leaving her at +8. If they back tech she's got these options for coming in. 33PP/33PT, 46PP, 66P+K, 66P. If they side tech, you got another option to your disposal. This being 236P+KP/236P+KT. PS: I haven't tested 3PT/1PT on side rolls yet, I'll do that later and update this.

2. The second setup is this: 6KP 8P 6PP (At threshold), this puts them at a distance in a weird kind of stun reset that puts Kokoro at +7. From there she's got P+K which crushes all highs (even sumi's highs) and will launch her if they mash P or use a mid string. Now ofc the person has lows to combat this, and if you get them into using lows to stop your P+K, you still got some luck left in this setup. As she's got 33P. 33P beats Sumi's P but doesn't stun on NH. Which sounds bad Ik, but this is where it gets good. She's still got her followups being 33PP which tracks, so if they SS that's trackin dere ass. And then she's got 33PT to stop hold heavy ppl + SSer's. And from this point if she gets 33PT P+K she's at +2 if they block and it's a crumble stun if they hit a button. Also, if you're worried about them mashing, 33P launches on CH. Giving you at least 60+ dmg.

3. Last setup I found today (will find more soon, TO BE CONTINUED): 6KP 33P (non SE-able) From here 33P is already putting you at Critical 3 threshold giving her option for CB, launch. So that's already a +. Secondly though, this is where it gets interesting. She's got 33PT, which if you let that whiff, she's at +5. From there she's still got her followups obviously, but sadly they aren't much use unless the person SE's fully. If they do 33PTP will hit them out giving her +5 as well if they SE fully then it's +1 (No one will ever SE that sht perfectly). Now, I haven't tested if they hold low to try and get away from the 33PT, but since it's so fast as is, since it's not like a regular grab, so it's recovery is a bit faster. She probably ( don't quote me on this yet). Probably, could get a guaranteed down throw from this setup if they low hold. Though she's also got her followups still again so I mean she's got mad options from this one setup alone.

 

[RoboJoe]

This thread has no posts, likes or even views and it's been up here for a few days. As of this post, the thread's view counter is at one. Are there truly no Kokoro players anymore?

 

[StrikerSashi]

Nah, it just doesn't update properly.

 

[Thanapon Buamongkol]

I personally prefer 2P+K2K (force tech) instead of 9PP2K then 2H+KK from item no.1). The rest you have already mentioned.

I think the last P+K from no.2 is too easy to be countered even with +6. I personally feel that this set up is too weak compared to her other setup.


Letting item no.3) to be completed before I share opinion.

 

[HoodsXx]

I'll go into the lab with 2P+K2K but I personally don't feel that 2P+K2K is viable (maybe online) but I'm looking at this from an offline perspective. As for what you were saying it sounded a bit confusing... but yeah. The P+K at the range your at for these setups is not close range you are at a certain distance apart that no one will be able to beat you out by mashing that's why the P+K and 33P work in those situations. In the neutral game P+K is terrible up close obviously. But for these setups is quite viable. As for 7PKT its one her CB 2 fairly slow and b) can ne grabbed on reaction because remember its a sabaki. So technically a hold. So any player knowing that info can throw her CB and there those your 7PKT setup. Also most people don't respect the 7PK since the K on its own is for one bad unless delayed a decent amount and can be SS' d as well. Which sucks. 6PP is actually a really good move in the stun game and in neutral because even though they can high crush the P they still have to deal with 6P6P if you condition them to try and crush 6PP. As for the neutral game I don't know if you looked at the sidestep video where it shows people how to deal with side step but. 6PP will stop any SS that doesn't high crush. Which for the majority of the cast. They don't. And as for PK that stops any SS that will normally crush 6PP. So 6PP is definitely a good move to pull out. As for your setup could you elaborate on that more? I didn't quite understand what you mean by using 6PP at the end of threshold to reset the stun and using P or something you said :S to setup for your CB.

 

[Thanapon Buamongkol]

1.) Stun ==> P ==> 2P+K2K (force tech) ==> the rest as you already mentioned : This is what I mentioned about 2P+K2K, my prefer setup.

2.) 6KP==>8P==>6PP ==>(now opponent stay at mid range)==> P+K : I just have verified my assumption a moment ago in training mode, any Kokoro's punch, kick (P,6P,6K,3K) can counter her own P+K. As I suspect earlier, it is just too easy to be countered even +6. However, 33P (replace P+K) is more difficult to be countered.Not sure we are at the same understanding about this or do I miss some of your context.

3.) [Skipped]

4) No doubt about the effectiveness of 6PP, it is also one of my loadout obviously.

Sorry for that I can not discuss on the offline perspective as I have no chance for such experience.

 

[Commmanda Panda]

For your second set-up, the opponent can SE easily and just block any options Kokoro has at that range. 33P and either of its follow-ups are probably best

 

[HoodsXx]

For your second setup the opponent can SE easily and just block any options Kokoro has at that range. 33P and either of its follow-ups are probably best

Are ypu referring to my setup or thanapon's. If you mean the 6KP 8P 6PP I test all of my stuff on fastest SE doing this setup works and she's at +6.

 

[HoodsXx]

1.) Stun ==> P ==> 2P+K2K (force tech) ==> the rest as you already mentioned : This is what I mentioned about 2P+K2K, my prefer setup. It is not easy to hold 2P+K online because hold attempt was interrupted by P and making use of Lag as I explained before and again on no.3) below.

2.) 6KP==>8P==>6PP ==>(now opponent stay at mid range)==> P+K : I just have verified my assumption a moment ago in training mode, any Kokoro's punch, kick (P,6P,6K,3K) can counter her own P+K. As I suspect earlier, it is just too easy to be countered even +6. However, 33P (replace P+K) is more difficult to be countered. I may need to verified how effective of 33P against people to see how they will fall into this trap. Not sure we are at the same understanding about this or do I miss some of your context.

3.) It is a trick when playing online to use jab (P) just before CB as it will interrupt CB hold attempt and lag will make very difficulty for the right timing to hold properly unless you/opponent are fully prepare for that (that means opponent might know you or fought you before). At this point, her set up is:

Stun ==> P ==> CB
for example
6P6P (counter hit) ==> P ==>7P (now CB) ==> Launch or Power Blow

the problem for this setup if opponent pull low hold whiff on P, what you have to do is instead of pull launch or power blow, you pull KTP+K

now the full version for low hold whiff is

6P6P (counter hit) ==> P (got whiffed by low hold) ==>7P (opponent guard or got hit) ==> KTP+K ==> CB ==>Launch or Power Blow

This set up has been proven that user is able to react even with 1 bar connection (with some practice and a little bit of muscle memory).

With lag involved, I barely seen anyone who could react during KTP+K properly. You can try in the training mode and see how difficult to counter during KTP+K (in the above setup). The only right timing to counter is either just after 7P and before K or just after K. You could also try to throw or side step and see how strict of timing is. According to my 1000+hrs playing Kokoro online, I would say less than 5% who could counter by react based on his/her own habbit. By recognizing opponent's PSN, I just replace KTP+K with KP. If there is still less than 1% who could react properly, I would just let it go as he/she is much better than me.

To me , it's effectiveness online is more than sufficient to include this set up into my arsenal.


4) No doubt about the effectiveness of 6PP, it is also one of my loadout obviously.

Sorry for that I can not discuss on the offline perspective as I have no chance for such experience.

For deeper discussion, it is good to spar together to see how effectiveness of each proposed setup and probably increase the depth of further discussion.

For the second setup you gave me talking about the threshold 6PP the reason P+K works at that range is because it high crushes anyones P even Kasumi's. If you go for a mid. The opponent won't beat you out because they're not fast enough to do so. As is for mashing that also doesn't work. I'll test your 2P+K2K combo in a few. For the setup you use. You can't expect them to hold right after the P to always get your CB yes, most PSN players are bad so we can abuse these tactics. But if you're playing someone kmowledable it won't work on them therefore its best to not rely on these tactics so often. Also the reason I use 9PP2K over 2P+K is that 2P+K is a singular move on top of that its fairly slow and you have to have a relatively deep stun in order to get it off w/o being blocked. But unlike 9PP2K you also still have to respect the 9PPP which is high high mid. As well as 9PPT. She has a lot of mixups out of it. So its imo better utility wise than a singular hit move that's fairly slow and easy to react to. A 3 bar connection and you can react to anything that's at least 20i easily if you're experienced.

 

[Commmanda Panda]

Are ypu referring to my setup or thanapon's. If you mean the 6KP 8P 6PP I test all of my stuff on fastest SE doing this setup works and she's at +6.

i should have made it more clear in my op lol, but in your set-up after she does the reset she is at +6 but the opponent can block any follow up from that range.

 

[HoodsXx]

Oh yeah I stated that in my op. They can do that, with P+K she's at +1 not much of a difference when facing sumi/other faster players. So obviously 33P would be your go to option. Its just even though they can block it they can't hit a button since they'll be CH''d and if you bring the throw into the mix then they have to see deal with that when on defense as well. Ofc they can fuzzy. But yeah so it's still a plus for koko since they have to guess.

 

[Thanapon Buamongkol]

For the second setup you gave me talking about the threshold 6PP the reason P+K works at that range is because it high crushes anyones P even Kasumi's. ......

It won't even against Kokoro's own P. As I mentioned before, I have tested it in training mode, any Kokoro's punch, kick (P,6P,6K,3K) can counter P+K from 6KP==>8P==>6PP ==>(now opponent stay at mid range)==> P+K setup.

.. 'll test your 2P+K2K combo in a few. For the setup you use.....

Actually your setup that begin with 6KP is also good because it has the potential of being long combo.

6KP==>8P==>6PP ==>(now opponent stay at mid range)==> 33P (replace the proposed P+K) ==> and so on.. you have already mentioned.

I have come to think about including it into my combo set in order to raise the complexity of my play style. I need trial & error with some practice of how will I smoothly mix it up into my current habbit.

.. You can't expect them to hold right after the P to always get your CB .....

Nope. And sure we know the way to deal with whoever show the sign of being accurate hold timing. I ever have this issue long ago but not after I have practiced Kokoro's 236T2P. It will stun all opponent's Hold level, all High- Mid-Low hold won't work against this setup. If you curious why low hold won't work against 2P, try it in the training mode and you will see why the right timing is unusual. The only way for opponent to counter Kokoro's 236T2P is to attack (or just crouch guard) which is supper unlikely for opponent who aim to timing for CB/low hold.

 

[iHajinShinobi]

My comments for online play

STOP!!!

Do not ever base anything from online play, ever. You're just explaining online tactics, and I will not want to read something influenced from latency.

@Bushido @Tenryuga @Commmanda Panda @HoodsXx

Please save the Kokoro sub-forums and try to ensure the information it'll contain is legitimate and not based from laggy online tactics. x_x

 

[Thanapon Buamongkol]

STOP!!! ...

I feel apologize for my misunderstanding of the intention of the forum as I'm quite new here. I thought the forum is where the information are shared and reader can choose to exploit what they feel interest. The information I shared is fact, but what might bother reader is its efficiency might be altered depend on latency. If this place is intended for offline play interest group, I admit that I'm not belong here because I have no chance for offline play in my real life.

 

[Bushido]

I feel apologize for my misunderstanding of the intention of the forum as I'm quite new here. I thought the forum is where the information are shared and reader can choose what they feel interest. If this place is intended for offline play interest group, I admit that I'm not belong here because I have no chance for offline play in my real life.

It's not that it's intended for offline players. FSD is for DoA players to discuss a game we all enjoy. It's just that when dealing with the technical stuff, offline play is where we base it. You don't have to actually go to offline events to talk about tech, since there is an offline training mode of course. It's just that, since the lag can be heavily abused (sometimes without you even realizing it) we just refer to offline. Online DoA seems to be entirely different from offline DoA.

 

[Thanapon Buamongkol]

It's not that it's intended for offline players. FSD is for DoA players to discuss a game we all enjoy. It's just that when dealing with the technical stuff, offline play is where we base it. You don't have to actually go to offline events to talk about tech, since there is an offline training mode of course. It's just that, since the lag can be heavily abused (sometimes without you even realizing it) we just refer to offline. Online DoA seems to be entirely different from offline DoA.

Acknowledge and thanks for explanation.

 

[Thanapon Buamongkol]

... Online DoA seems to be entirely different from offline DoA.

Yes. Sometime I even feel guilty when I saw opponent try to counter or throw with the "Theoretically Correct" move but with wrong timing. Sometime I got hate message like "Laggy bitch" or "Do not put Lag in the equation to WIN". And I always reply to apologize to them for causing bad feeling rather than fun.

 

[iHajinShinobi]

I feel apologize for my misunderstanding of the intention of the forum as I'm quite new here. I thought the forum is where the information are shared and reader can choose to exploit what they feel interest. The information I shared is fact, but what might bother reader is its efficiency might be altered depend on latency. If this place is intended for offline play interest group, I admit that I'm not belong here because I have no chance for offline play in my real life.

No, the basic point when sharing and discussing tech or information is that it's "supposed" to work in an environment where nothing can possibly skew it's results. No online latency, not monitor latency, etc. You're more than welcome to post here, but try to post information that does not involve using online lag.

That only proves that you're abusing online tactics, when such a strat is just a bad habit and misinformation for those that are trying to learn or further educate themselves with different strategies (for and against them).

 

[Thanapon Buamongkol]

.. when such a strat is just a bad habit and misinformation for those that are trying to learn or further educate themselves with different strategies (for and against them).

That make sense, thanks.

 

[QueenJakheiho]

Geez...calm down.
Lol first time i watching this thread and Thana is the only Kokoro Player that posted here somethin, useful or not.
He is posting and gives some inputs compares to the other supposedly Kokoro Player on this holy place from DOA.
But its nothing new here on FSD that the Character Topics overall besides (the Ryu, Ayane, Tina topics) are completely dead.