NightAntilli
Well-Known Member
This is a simple video worth watching that discusses the reason why the fighting game audience is so small and what can be done to make the fighting game experience better to newcomers.
Oh, come on now. Casual gamers aren't that black-and-white. Otherwise, someone like me - a Type X - wouldn't exist. What is a Type X? For one, the "X" being represented in this scenario is a variable of endless possibilities. As such, a Type X is a type of casual gamer who has endless potential to be competitive, and refuses to be bound by the limited shortcomings of what other competitive gamers label him/her. Some would even call them "Casual-Competitive".I personally don't think that's gonna matter much in the long run.
The average casual gamer can be broken down into two categories:
1. The gamer who realizes the level of skill required in high level play, and respects those who reach those levels.
2. The gamer who thinks people who know combos are hackers, and use a false "Honor" system which consists of rules they made up themselves that are varying levels of stupidity like "No counters, no hitting an opponent on the ground, no anti-airs" etc.
You think it to be impossible because you've stereotyped us to a point where you believe we're incapable of learning, when that isn't true for everyone. We may have not been given spoon-fed natural talent since birth like some competitive players, but if a Type X casual gamer has enough heart and the smarts to play the part, you can bet your ass he/she will prove you wrong.The proposed refined single player experience would do nothing to change either of these players. Player type 1 could very well end up becoming someone who eventually reaches that level, but is usually held back by any number of reasons, like: "Not enough time, I can't really get into it, I'm terrible at doing 236 motions" etc. This type of player is normally aware of the "Brick wall of info" needed to be good at a game, and regardless if that's the reason they're turned off or not, a simple change in how the info is presented, isn't gonna change the fact that the info is still there, and is still required to be truly good at the game.
I personally don't think that's gonna matter much in the long run.
The average casual gamer can be broken down into two categories:
1. The gamer who realizes the level of skill required in high level play, and respects those who reach those levels.
2. The gamer who thinks people who know combos are hackers, and use a false "Honor" system which consists of rules they made up themselves that are varying levels of stupidity like "No counters, no hitting an opponent on the ground, no anti-airs" etc.
The proposed refined single player experience would do nothing to change either of these players. Player type 1 could very well end up becoming someone who eventually reaches that level, but is usually held back by any number of reasons, like: "Not enough time, I can't really get into it, I'm terrible at doing 236 motions" etc. This type of player is normally aware of the "Brick wall of info" needed to be good at a game, and regardless if that's the reason they're turned off or not, a simple change in how the info is presented, isn't gonna change the fact that the info is still there, and is still required to be truly good at the game.
Player type 2 is usually dead in the water, the only way to change the minds of these people is to wait until they are older than 12, and if they still think like this then there's pretty much nothing that can help them.
Thank you! Perfect! Id say I'm type x as well.Oh, come on now. Casual gamers aren't that black-and-white. Otherwise, someone like me - a Type X - wouldn't exist. What is a Type X? For one, the "X" being represented in this scenario is a variable of endless possibilities. As such, a Type X is a type of casual gamer who has endless potential to be competitive, and refuses to be bound by the limited shortcomings of what other competitive gamers label him/her. Some would even call them "Casual-Competitive".
I'm the type of casual gamer who is motivated to become better with the character(s) I enjoy using through unconventional means. And by unconventional, I mean not in the typical "I want to be the best character/low-tier hero/Evo Moment player out there" kind of deal. No, sir. I'm motivated by finding a character that I can relate to (or in a way, look up to) from a better part of my past life, and that is the bare minimum, gospel truth. As long as I have that, I have enough drive to keep playing. If it weren't the case, I would've broken down and dropped this game completely years ago (hell, maybe even months ago), and yet I still stand here playing Christie the best I possibly can after so many years.
This other stuff you're labeling me under mostly has nothing to do with how I think, save for respecting other players, should they give it in return. Learning the game on a competitive level may or may not be a priority for a Type X, but if he/she is driven far enough, they can shock and surprise even the most smug of competitive players offline, where it counts.
You think it to be impossible because you've stereotyped us to a point where you believe we're incapable of learning, when that isn't true for everyone. We may have not been given spoon-fed natural talent since birth like some competitive players, but if a Type X casual gamer has enough heart and the smarts to play the part, you can bet your ass he/she will prove you wrong.
The single player experience is not even being proposed to be the end-all be-all of learning fighting games to a high level, and it sure as hell isn't giving the message that you'll be a god overnight if you play it. It is intended to serve as a barrier of entry to applying basic skills, and nothing more. By the time they grasped the basics taught in a decent single player mode like, say, Virtua Fighter 4 Evolution (and a damn good one, might I add), the brick wall of info would in theory be easier to grasp than they initially believed.
They don't necessarily have to take it all in at once, but even learning it piece-by-piece after what they learned and applied in the well-executed single player mode to test their mettle against real, seasoned human opponents is a good start. At this time, they should be willing to listen to the more experienced players and the process of understanding the terminology little-by-little would go a lot smoother.
Again, spot on. Lot of people don't understand that when a learning curve is too steep, most peoples reactions isn't to go "hmm this game is deep, I'm gonna sit here and study for days on end till I understand and master it". Nope, most go "fuck it I'll go play something else."@CyberEvil
Yeah. Maybe. But the video is still right regarding the fighting game community being a lot smaller than the shooter community, both on a large scale and game specific. The best fighting games have trouble attracting the same consistent fan base as a less than average shooter, let alone the popular ones. And the genre is indeed VERY crappy regarding tutorials. Fighting games are arguably the most complicated genre besides RTS, and the more complicated it is, the better your tutorial should be.
A few weeks ago I introduced someone new that ever heard of DOA to the game, with DOA5U. He found the story dull, and when he tried the tutorial, he simply skipped the text, and started mashing buttons until he passed them, not understanding what he was doing. You can say that this is his own fault, but that's arrogant and isn't going to help our community. They are not forced to like this game. It has to be made appealing to them. This is your average new player, and it's evidence that the current methods are not working. If we really wish to grow our community, we need to stop looking down on other people, and stop making up excuses not to better the introduction to fighting games in general. There IS a huge problem here. The first step to solving a problem is admitting that there is one.
@LunaKage
Your type 1 is generally overwhelmed and doesn't know where to start, where he ends up giving up. It shouldn't be that way.
Your type 2 is generally the typical person who does not understand anything about the game. This is the part in the video where people are failing to understand that they didn't reach the game that the gameplay was actually designed for. It might be a problem with the player. In shooters we also have the newbies that cry 'hacker' every time they die from a sniper shot or from something they don't understand. But most of the time, it's the bad introduction to the game that allows them to have those tainted views. We both know that if they understood the game they wouldn't be saying those things. And if the motivation for them to learn it was not given to them from the beginning by the game, the chances are small that their view on it will change.
General note to no one specifically;
Watch your egos.
The top/high-level players possess natural skill and always get immediate results when they pick up a fighting game and play it, becoming gods at day one.I actually disagree with this video in some ways. I feel like he's asking games to be come easier to play or "noob friendly" which isn't exactly a bad thing, but that won't solve the problem. To get good, these games, it takes practice, and patience. You can't just walk into a fighter and expect immediate results.
That's a good question. I cant .I'm not someone who has that natural talent. However the few that can play and learn multiple games have amazing fundamentals and just know how these games work. Take Justin for example. He's amazing in every game he plays. He also gets paid to play games and has been doing it for many years. I would also add that there are very few players like Justin compare to theFGC as a whole.The top/high-level players possess natural skill and always get immediate results when they pick up a fighting game and play it, becoming gods at day one.
How do you explain them?
The top/high-level players possess natural skill and always get immediate results when they pick up a fighting game and play it, becoming gods at day one.
How do you explain them?
Play a lot of fighting games and develop fundamentals. Apply those to other fighters. Master the games mechanics. Profit.