Tempest
Well-Known Member
Which moves are giving you trouble? Though in general with Lisa you want to get right up on her so she can't use most of her options without risking a counter hit.
DOA5U Hitomi Match-up Rating Discussion
- Thread starter Crext
- Start date
Which moves are giving you trouble? Though in general with Lisa you want to get right up on her so she can't use most of her options without risking a counter hit.
angelkait
New Member
sorry for the late reply!
the getting on her and staying on her is what I'm having trouble with. one knock down and she's across the map again. also, a lot of hitomis combo finishers blow them away so it's like i'm helping her sometimes
was just wondering how other people deal with her / close in on her with hitomi
Tempest
Well-Known Member
Well it depends on the particular player, but in general with Lisa at a distance you'll want to watch out for the following tools. If you have a response to each of them it'll make things easier on you. The most important thing is patience. Lisa does not have many good tools for opening up a patient player, so once you've got a life lead, don't worry too much about chasing her down.
This is a jumping OH that can catch you if you do strings in the neutral game. If you can bait it out, you can crouch it and throw her for high counter damage. You can also throw her if she whiffs the OH, so be watchful and catch her if the player doesn't space it right.
This is the cartwheel flip you will see a lot of Lisa's doing, it can transition into her carrera stance. However, it leaves her very negative on block, so if she tries anything aggressive after doing this, you can stuff it with a fast mid (46P for Hitomi would work well).
this is a mid drop kick that has a slow startup, but provides a guard break. After this move, Lisa can transition into Carrera and do a high punch, another drop kick, a very unsafe mid punch, or a jumping offensive hold. If you are hit by this move, just be patient and see what the Lisa player does next. If she does the drop kick or offensive hold, you can interrupt them with a quick poke. Or you can just block and the only thing she can do is try to OH (which you can crouch, it is very slow), or do another drop kick. Both the mid and high punch are throw punishable.
BT+ this is the backwards belly flop. If it hits you it will guard break you for enough frames for Lisa to get a guaranteed followup. However it is very slow and linear, so if you wait for it and sidestep it you can low throw her once she lands. Be careful because it does retrack a bit.
this is the flying chop, it covers a long distance, but it is very negative. If you can bait it out, you can low throw punish it.
Once you start shutting down these tools, you'll have an easier time walking up to Lisa. If you need more help try to save a replay so I can give you specific advice.
This is a jumping OH that can catch you if you do strings in the neutral game. If you can bait it out, you can crouch it and throw her for high counter damage. You can also throw her if she whiffs the OH, so be watchful and catch her if the player doesn't space it right.
This is the cartwheel flip you will see a lot of Lisa's doing, it can transition into her carrera stance. However, it leaves her very negative on block, so if she tries anything aggressive after doing this, you can stuff it with a fast mid (46P for Hitomi would work well).
this is a mid drop kick that has a slow startup, but provides a guard break. After this move, Lisa can transition into Carrera and do a high punch, another drop kick, a very unsafe mid punch, or a jumping offensive hold. If you are hit by this move, just be patient and see what the Lisa player does next. If she does the drop kick or offensive hold, you can interrupt them with a quick poke. Or you can just block and the only thing she can do is try to OH (which you can crouch, it is very slow), or do another drop kick. Both the mid and high punch are throw punishable.BT
+ this is the backwards belly flop. If it hits you it will guard break you for enough frames for Lisa to get a guaranteed followup. However it is very slow and linear, so if you wait for it and sidestep it you can low throw her once she lands. Be careful because it does retrack a bit. this is the flying chop, it covers a long distance, but it is very negative. If you can bait it out, you can low throw punish it.Once you start shutting down these tools, you'll have an easier time walking up to Lisa. If you need more help try to save a replay so I can give you specific advice.
Also, another point worth mentioning is that Lisa vs Hitomi in regards to spacing is 50/50, as Hitomi got a lot of good GTFO moves as well. This means that if you ever get close you'd be at an advantage, and if you are kept at a distant you still got a pretty good fighting chance. Also like the last guy mentioned, if you run in, stop, and block, you'd most likely lure out some very unsafe move which you can punish.
UncleBiscuits79
Active Member
Hello All. What does everyone think about the matchups for the Raidou and Honoka against Hitomi? I had a buddy ask me that, and IMO I don't see any problems for Hitomi against those characters. Raidou seems to be really unsafe, so I just throw punish him alot. Honoka is fast up close, but has NO reach, so I just try to space her out and poke her to death. I figured I would put the question to the community at large though to get thoughts.
Saber
Well-Known Member
As far as Honoka goes, Hitomi has little problems dealing with her. The good thing for this match up is that both characters' main juggle enders knock them away from each other, and that's what Hitomi wants here. Besides having better reach, Hitomi also has better single strike damage so even when Hitomi whiffs she doesn't suffer nearly as much as Honoka will. Hitomi can just 46P and 236P the entire match and still be left unscathed, though has to take some caution to Honoka's fast map movement speed. Hitomi's much better at midrange and long range and Honoka since 3K can pretty much deal with whatever Honoka throws out (since her moves, while fast, will whiff even at midrange). Hitomi probably only has to watch out for Honoka's 4K since it + on hit and -1 on hit which will make Honoka the same speed as Hitomi, if not slightly faster since her 11i mid punch is now 12i, which can still beat out all of Hitomi's mids. Not too much of an issue for Hitomi though since every other move will either out prioritize or match Honoka's due to her higher damage output. It's only during CQC Hitomi will have issues since Honoka's speed will beat out a lot of Hitomi's delay strings, but it probably won't be too much of an issue for Hitomi if she can zone her and avoid CQC altogether. Overall the match up is quite a bit in favor of Hitomi.
Not so sure about Raidou since I didn't buy him.
Not so sure about Raidou since I didn't buy him.
Last edited:
ChainCombo
Well-Known Member
Any tips on how to deal with Rig? I have trouble trying to deal with all those kicks and get pushed hard on defense, it seems even when i see an opening to interrupt a move with 2p or pp I still get beat out everytime. Is it online bs or am i approaching this wrong?
Lulu
Well-Known Member
I haven't been able to test it but I heard Rig is another one of those safe Characters and is pretty safe on alot of strings.... or at the very least safe on a few of them making you too scared to punish on the rest.
Sadly I have no solution to the problem, only a few ideas.... You could turtle him and Jab (he maybe safe but he's not as fast as he looks) I don't how fast Hitomi's Jab is but if Hayate can do it then it should be viable.... there is, however, the variable of Reach.
And thats all I got, sorry man, I don't know Hitomi and Rig is a giant pain in my ass.
You could try playing as Rig to learn his String, I find that his Turn Leg Cutter has alot of Mid Kicks, thats where I got some of my successful holds. The Bending Stance however can go anywhere from Highs mids and the occasional low.
Rig can be a pain as he uses more kicks, taking punch parry out of the game. However, he is very unsafe upon string completion, always opening up for a 6T punish. Once he is at frame disadvantage he basically has no comeback. The most important thing about Rig is to know his move sets in and out. If you know this he is actually a very easy opponent if he choses to get into the close combat game (his spacing is still pretty good). Watch out for low kicks "approach moves". Usually he only has 2 options, or even just one, to continue a string. Here you can hold. If you got advanced mid-kick holds you can punish a lot where many of the "guaranteed kicks" are either mid kick or fly kick (basically countered by the same hold).
Lulu
Well-Known Member
And thats pretty much it.....
One last thing.... Rig is similar to Sarah, they get they're safety from Entering their special stances, if you can spot the ins and outs of these stances then you will know when to hold your guard and when to go for the punish.
Rig's TLC (Turn Leg Cutter) shouldn't give you any trouble once you learn to spott it, it only consists of High Kicks which Hitomi can jab in between assuming Rig decides to go for the High Kicks..... and Faster Mid Kicks which you can wait out and punish at the end.
Beware of the Bending Stance..... Rig has charging Guard Break from this stance which gives him +12 on a full charge and theres also probably a low kick in there some where, and lastly He also has an Advantage Throw from the bending stance as well.... if Hitomi has any Pressure Tools and Pseudo Force Techs then you want to break them out nice and quick before your opponent catches on to your plan, going back and forth with Rig is not reccomended
One last thing.... Rig is similar to Sarah, they get they're safety from Entering their special stances, if you can spot the ins and outs of these stances then you will know when to hold your guard and when to go for the punish.
Rig's TLC (Turn Leg Cutter) shouldn't give you any trouble once you learn to spott it, it only consists of High Kicks which Hitomi can jab in between assuming Rig decides to go for the High Kicks..... and Faster Mid Kicks which you can wait out and punish at the end.
Beware of the Bending Stance..... Rig has charging Guard Break from this stance which gives him +12 on a full charge and theres also probably a low kick in there some where, and lastly He also has an Advantage Throw from the bending stance as well.... if Hitomi has any Pressure Tools and Pseudo Force Techs then you want to break them out nice and quick before your opponent catches on to your plan, going back and forth with Rig is not reccomended
ChainCombo
Well-Known Member
Yooo, thanks you two. I'll hit the lab and try out different scenarios to better my MU exp with this shit kicking skin head.
Remember (general tip this), there are some moves where his follow ups are only high/low kick and throw. In these cases you can always try to hold the low kick upon movement reaction (but you usually have to block the first move in order to do so). You'll then take close to zero risk until he picks up on pattern (it is basically a reset if you miss) and start to cancel into low throws, which can be reacted upon and punished for a trained eye.
This is true for most characters though, even if the moves are linked upon hit, if you block first you can get almost "guaranteed holds".
Alternatively you can low punch him if you are "almost certain" he either tries high kicks or the throw.
Reason for why I mention this here is because Rig has a lot of those scenarios in his moves.
This is true for most characters though, even if the moves are linked upon hit, if you block first you can get almost "guaranteed holds".
Alternatively you can low punch him if you are "almost certain" he either tries high kicks or the throw.
Reason for why I mention this here is because Rig has a lot of those scenarios in his moves.
it gives +1 on normal hit, that is something you can play with, and heavily so against Rig. At 14 frames it is hardly a beat out move, but are meant to crush highs (and throws). Alternatively you can go for 1p which gives much more frames at counter-hit, and guaranteed follow up on high-counter (don't remember the frames on the go, but it is "enough").
LordXav1er
Well-Known Member
It's been awhile... wondering if anyone's opinions have changed for match ups given with all the patches and new characters out.
LordXav1er
Well-Known Member
Well, you should probably take any updated knowledge here: http://www.freestepdodge.com/threads/the-official-tier-list-with-discussion-thread.3817/
So long after release I don't think getting a heated Hitomi exclusive discussion is possible
So long after release I don't think getting a heated Hitomi exclusive discussion is possible