La Mariposa's Needed Improvements

[Kodachi]

The Infamous Luchadora makes her way into DOA5 only to be stuck in the same position as previous Dead or Alive games, Here are some improvements that will benefit La Mariposa's Gameplay:

-More guard breaks and guaranteed followups like Tina, Bass, Christie, Bayman, etc.

-Better attack speed and lessen the recovery of some of her more useful attacks.

-Make the last punch to P, P, P a guard break so the back flip at the end of can be a guaranteed hit if they don't duck or interrupt the last high punch.

-Counters that leave her at an advantage for a followed up attack.

-Being able to grab grounded opponents like Bayman, Bass, Leon, and Tina aka the other grapplers like her.

-Her into should knock the opponent to a sit down stun down on normal hit so you can follow up with the Kick afterwards or the grab since that setups was way to easy for most people to see in DOA4.

"- Allow her to CB in 3 hits.
- Give her a BT Critical Burst in addition to her normal one.
- Make it so that she's safer transitioning into BT.
- Give her a low throw from BT (preferably an offensive hold).
- Make her 1K grant frame advantage instead of a knock down. Something along the lines of Hitomi's 2H+K. It's advantage, but not a traditional critical stun.
- Either speed up her run stance attacks so they can't be easily interrupted, or give her more advantage going into run stance and better options from the stance." -DrDogg

Please feel free to share your thoughts!

Credit to Arnell Long & DrDogg

 

[DR2K]

Hey it;s better to be better than someone than no one at all.

 

[MaxwellMouse]

Good on you for this thread. I'm glad someone is championing La Mariposa.

 

[ScattereDreams]

I'll agree with that ppp guard crush. P,K,K. Instead of the last hit knocking down like in DOA4, I'd prefer it to put them in a sit down stun. She has a new mid kick launcher that came from Tina. Booty bump on CH should put opponent in sit down stun as well. On NH just a regular stun

 

[DrDogg]

I don't really agree with any of those changes.

All she needs is a bit more safety, a CB from BT and the ability to use her run options without fear of interruption. A faster jab would be nice as well, but give her a bit more frame advantage and that's taken care of.

As for her 1K, just make it similar to Hitomi's 2H+K and you're good. 1KK is useless, so it doesn't matter if it's a sit-down stun or not. It's not hard to counter on reaction.

 

[Batcommander]

I agree about the ground throws. She's a wrestler after all, it'd be nice to have them. I also wish there was a way to sidestep in BT stance.

I agree with Dogg in that 1kk is shit, i can't believe they kept that move in game as is.

I hope her jumping throws track, i noticed they were dodged in that Ayane vid, and i hope her mixups from handspring are actually useful now.

 

[Knowxscape]

I would also like if Lisa's 33p launcher were a high attack instead of a mid. In DOA 4 her 33p launcher was pretty useless because of slow frame execution and it being a mid attack. I found myself relying more on her 4p launcher (from BT position) and even more from her 8k launcher. In DOA dimensions her 33p was faster but was still easily countered. I'm assuming in DOA 5 since you can't hold from a sit down stun her 33p may be more viable, but I would still like to see it changed from a mid to a high attack.

Or Maybe I'm just being nitpicky

 

[PhoenixVFIRE]

I would also like if Lisa's 33p launcher were a high attack instead of a mid. In DOA 4 her 33p launcher was pretty useless because of slow frame execution and it being a mid attack. I found myself relying more on her 4p launcher (from BT position) and even more from her 8k launcher. In DOA dimensions her 33p was faster but was still easily countered. I'm assuming in DOA 5 since you can't hold from a sit down stun her 33p may be more viable, but I would still like to see it changed from a mid to a high attack.

Or Maybe I'm just being nitpicky

It being a high attack would make things worse IMO, highs can still be easily dodged for the most part. Imagine going for the 33P launch and they counter low for some reason, dodged by a low counter.

 

[Knowxscape]

I agree with Dogg in that 1kk is shit, i can't believe they kept that move in game as is.

I know right!!! I would always have to free cancel out of 1k before going into another kick move.

 

[Doug Nguyen]

I dont think she needs ground grapples since she's also a tricky and technical fighter compared to the ground grapplers.

 

[Allan Paris]

She needs to go back to her DOA4 skin complexion.

 

[Knowxscape]

It being a high attack would make things worse IMO, highs can still be easily dodged for the most part. Imagine going for the 33P launch and they counter low for some reason, dodged by a low counter.

Most Def. I see your point. I guess it would be more about timing rather than hit range.

 

[Paulina]

I don't really agree with any of those changes.

All she needs is a bit more safety, a CB from BT and the ability to use her run options without fear of interruption. A faster jab would be nice as well, but give her a bit more frame advantage and that's taken care of.

As for her 1K, just make it similar to Hitomi's 2H+K and you're good. 1KK is useless, so it doesn't matter if it's a sit-down stun or not. It's not hard to counter on reaction.

I support buffing Lisa out too, although I'm more in line with DrDogg's ideas. Anyway, every character in DOA needs solid fundamentals. Can someone make a topic like this for Brad? I would, but I'm not sure exactly how to make him more well-rounded.

 

[PhoenixVFIRE]

I support buffing Lisa out too, although I'm more in line with DrDogg's ideas. Anyway, every character in DOA needs solid fundamentals. Can someone make a topic like this for Brad? I would, but I'm not sure exactly how to make him more well-rounded.

First, we gotta know something about Brad lol, we know hardly anything. I posted this on DOAWorld about him considering this is all I know about him in DOA5.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
"I would like to post my thoughts on Brad.

Brad Wong: Honestly, when it comes to DOA5 we actually don't know much about him other than a few things.
1. He can Critical Burst in 3 hits(which already helps him out overall as a character).
2. He has a new handstand stance that can transition into his laying down stance. We don't know the full potential or even know how effective this stance is and this stance has an airthrow(at least I think it's this stance that has it, but either way, he DOES have an airthrow, it remains unseen so far and we don't know it's effectiveness). Also, he has many transitions into this stance, whether they're safe or not, again we don't know.
3. In one of the videos I noticed him transition into his Drunken Flamingo from

for a slight moment, so I think he may have other moves that transition into this stance as well, which may increase it's(Drunken Flamingo) overall effectiveness

Unfortunately, he has always been in a tier of his own. IMHO, I don't think Brad is in his own tier anymore.

When it comes to characters who have stance's(especially Brad, Helena, and Lisa), they've got to have safe and frame advantage transitions, otherwise what good is the stance that doesn't have a safe and advantageous transition? You'll just be punished for trying to keep the pressure on your opponent. ALSO, what good are the moves in your stance if they can all be sidestepped? LOL I believe every option in Kokoro's mini stance can be sidestepped(on block)"
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I haven't heard anything about Brad other than what I've seen in videos or in a description box.

 

[Arnell Long]

I appreciate those who agreed with those changes, even if you did not agree with all of them.

Thanks Kodachi for trying to get the word out.

 

[TRI Mike]

I think it'd be better if we keep Lisa in this thread and create a new one for Brad. Maybe asking Sebastian (Chosen1) might help with making a list of the things he needs.

Regarding Lisa, I agree with Bryan in that she should be good to go with a bit more safety and a solid option to CB in BT.

 

[MasterHavik]

Yeah Lisa sucks because she has been too busy jobbing to WWE Divas. Cruse you Kelly! Anyways, needs buffs so she can become a TNA/IW Knockout. Enough with all the wrestling jokes and shit. Anyways, I think needs to be with thought of the new changes. All they did to her in 5 was just give her more gimmicks. THAT may sound fun on a casual if you're messing around with some of your friends. But on a high level, it's,"LOL Lisa so free and easy to read."

 

[Batcommander]

From that article, i'm really not digging how it said she had to interrupt her run to anticipate a sidestep move. Does that mean she doesn't have any tracking moves during run stance? Because that sucks ass.

 

[Arnell Long]

Also, a low grab from her BT stance would definitely be beneficial to her as well.

TRI Mike, I stated "-Better attack speed and lessen the recovery of some of her more useful attacks". Which is basically what you and Dr Dogg were talking about in the speed/safety department.

You may not agree with 90% of the changes, but at the very least, any logical player can agree to one of those changes.

Batcommander, her running stance from what I see is useful when you're in a comfortable offensive position because her tools are quite varied, however, it's quite easily stuffed from those with respectable reactions. If you check out those videos from 12 days of DOA, her 2 fights with Ayane proves that point a bit more.

Doesn't matter how Lisa turns out though, I'm still going to rock dooms.

 

[OSTCarmine]

i dont know what the stun is called, but its the one where your character stumbles backwards from a high K, it also turns them around momentarily. does Lisa have one of these? it would do wonders for her running stance since its the stun that pushes the opponent back the most... im not a lisa player so pardon me if this seems like a silly idea