Why do so many people dislike the VF cast?

[Lando41]

I dont know how an exact match up would be in seriousness. Cause it could swing multiple ways. Some have fluid strikes, styles vs styles , wrestling vs wrestling and ground game for ground game And holds.
How i had them a year ago were like:

Wolf vs Bass or Tina
sarah vs rig ( basing that on kicking appeal)
Pai vs lie fang ( kung fu vs kung fu )
Eileen vs Marie Rose
Aoi vs Helena ( battle of fluidity of style)
Brad burns vs Zack ( orthodox vs the unorthodox of same style ) or mila ( strikes combat)
Lei Fei vs Genfu/ elliot or helena
Kage vs either Ryu or Hayate
Jeffery vs Bass
el Blaze vs Lisa
shun di vs brad wong ( battle of the drunken fist )
Vanessa vs Bayman/Leon/Mila
Lion vs Christie ( style battle)
Jacky vs Jann lee
Jean Kujo vs Ein/Hitomi
Akira vs Kokoro
Goh vs ??? ( Tina maybe idk )
Taka arashi vs ?????
Dural vs Alpha 152
Raidou vs Nyo tengu

Kasumi, ayane, the kasumi clone chick, and Honoka chick i cant really seriousky place on odds or even nature of skills. Thats like any ninja in doa vs Kage. Lol . Honoka is pretty much a clone as well but since she is so varied mix she could fight anyone in vf side. Didnt include Lau chan but he would pretty much fight any style martial artist in kung fu, christie has a great poke system in her snake that could rival his speedy pokes he has. But he has more power.

But ehhh this is my own personal rival matchups and others will differ based on their own valid reasons. Well marie rose and honoka, ny tengu amd raidou are new added so i tossed them in with those others cause they made sense to me. Eileen was originally against helena.

 

[Lulu]

All right so believe it or not..... instead of another VF character... DoA could benefit a whole lot more if they borrowed the "Yellow Flash".
For those of you unfamiliar with The Yellow Flash, its how VF5 lets you know you've successfully landed a counter hit, DoA actually needs this mechanic a whole lot more than VF does because in DoA you need to be in a constate state of situational awareness, you don't want to be the poor sap who gets knock into one of those Breakable Objects that guarantee one free hit because he was too busy checking for the CH Status instead of watching his opponent freestepping to line you up with a Danger Zone..... I think I've seen a Momiji player deliberately not throw punish a hold, instead they that advantage to freestep and start over again and then BOOM !!! Danger Zone !!!
So uhm.... Yeah... screw the other VF Characters, give me the Yellow Flash for Counter Hit and Red Flash for Critical Threshold - and if theres time you can top that off with some Goh Hinogami.

 

[Argentus]

All right so believe it or not..... instead of another VF character... DoA could benefit a whole lot more if they borrowed the "Yellow Flash".
For those of you unfamiliar with The Yellow Flash, its how VF5 lets you know you've successfully landed a counter hit, DoA actually needs this mechanic a whole lot more than VF does because in DoA you need to be in a constate state of situational awareness, you don't want to be the poor sap who gets knock into one of those Breakable Objects that guarantee one free hit because he was too busy checking for the CH Status instead of watching his opponent freestepping to line you up with a Danger Zone..... I think I've seen a Momiji player deliberately not throw punish a hold, instead they that advantage to freestep and start over again and then BOOM !!! Danger Zone !!!
So uhm.... Yeah... screw the other VF Characters, give me the Yellow Flash for Counter Hit and Red Flash for Critical Threshold - and if theres time you can top that off with some Goh Hinogami.

oh god no I already turn off what little hit effects DOA5 has.

HATE hit effects so much. It causes a strobe light effect for me, plus its really distracting on its own.

 

[Lulu]

oh god no I already turn off what little hit effects DOA5 has.

HATE hit effects so much. It causes a strobe light effect for me, plus its really distracting on its own.

How do you know when you counter hit ? are you a wizard ?

 

[Force_of_Nature]

How do you know when you counter hit ? are you a wizard ?

There are different hit properties and a different sound effect if you connect an attack on CH. If you connect an attack on HCH, there will be a small flash on top of a different sound effect and hit properties. From a visual standpoint, hit effects don't suit DOA because of its more realistic looking visuals. In Tekken or SoulCalibur it's fine because those games look kinda cartoonish.

 

[SantaJessicaBr]

I use sarah too and i think it's because of the damage and how fast they are (i use phase 4 too and when someone comes with sarah it's the nightmare ! )

 

[Lulu]

There are different hit properties and a different sound effect if you connect an attack on CH. If you connect an attack on HCH, there will be a small flash on top of a different sound effect and hit properties. From a visual standpoint, hit effects don't suit DOA because of its more realistic looking visuals. In Tekken or SoulCalibur it's fine because those games look kinda cartoonish.

Sorry but in VF when you land a counter hit theres clear but not distracting yellow spark.... you can't mistake this effect for anything else other than a counter hit. a concept so easy to grasp that it wouldn't confuse an animal.
Turn the hit status off in DoA and you are essentially fighting blind.... the difference between normal hit and counter hit are easily mistaken, how long do I have to play the game to tell one tiny impact effect from a slightly larger tiny impact effect ?
The realism argument simply doesn't apply because they are all sorts of other unrealistic elements that wouldn't negatively impact the game if you made them realistic.... so now here we are with a legitimate intuitive problem that already has a solution that hasn't been applied yet for some reason and the number reason why is because of realism ? You don't think theres something wrong with that ?

FYI Theres a massive difference between VF's Yellow Flash and Tekken's Sparks and Electricity and wind and what have you..... the Yellow Flash only works on counter hit.... its not as bright as The Hit Effects on Tekken nor will you see it as Frequently.... actually you'l see it even less in DoA because you get longer stuns and Recovery.

 

[Force_of_Nature]

The thing about VF, is whether something connects on NH or CH can be the difference between a guaranteed launcher and something getting blocked. In DOA if something connects on CH, you'll get a different hit property such as a stun of some sort or a knockdown for instance. If you hit someone on NH, you'll generally barely phase them, unless it's a move that stuns, or knockdowns on NH. I.e, it's generally very obvious when you've hit someone on NH or CH. And like I said, there is generally a different sound if something connects on CH (and if you're paying attention to the match, you can also generally tell if you'll likely CH someone).

The reason why there aren't really hit effects in DOA5LR is because they look ugly as hell and detract from the visual experience.

 

[Lulu]

The thing about VF, is whether something connects on NH or CH can be the difference between a guaranteed launcher and something getting blocked. In DOA if something connects on CH, you'll get a different hit property such as a stun of some sort or a knockdown for instance. If you hit someone on NH, you'll generally barely phase them, unless it's a move that stuns, or knockdowns on NH. I.e, it's generally very obvious when you've hit someone on NH or CH. And like I said, there is generally a different sound if something connects on CH (and if you're paying attention to the match, you can also generally tell if you'll likely CH someone).

The reason why there aren't really hit effects in DOA5LR is because they look ugly as hell and detract from the visual experience.

When I counter hit in DoA I might accidentily launch my opponent...... I can guarantee you that no normal human being with any amount of practice will recognize the situation and be able to capitalize off it..... If I have to wait for an obvious tell like the stun then its already too late, I'l whiff my juggle and they'l fall to the ground, or recover.... these oppertunities come and go literally at the blink of an eye.... thats why we have hit effects in the first place.
you're worrying about the aesthetics of the game way way too early.... they are more practical issues that require some fine tuning before we get to that point and I'm not talking about DoA specifically... I see this happening everywhere in this medium.
If I were to give you a real world example.... imagine if all the lines on a Football Field were painted blue instead of white.... its a small change but in the middle of action it can make a big difference.
Besides...... one of the reasons I want the yellow flash is not just because the hit status unintuitive but its also not particularly pretty to see annoying message in red at the corner of my screen..... I want it gone..... but I need it play effectively.
Don't know how you manage without them.

 

[KasumiLover]

I have to admit, fighting the Virtua Fighters is annoying, but I don't hate them. They have weaknesses that make them much easier for them to tolerate:
Has strong offense and almost non-existent recovery frames, but throws are rather mediocre in damage, and holds aren't much to brag about either.
Very combo heavy and holds and throws tend to leave you open for punishment, but her holds are so weak, it hurts...and her throws, like Sarah, aren't really threatening
Has good damage potential and an auto-counter in neutral position, but if you throw him in neutral position, it's counted as a Hi-counter Throw. Plus he has no real gimmick.
His knee is horrifying, and has very strong combos, but his best moves from what I've seen are mostly mid, so holding him and shutting him down is pretty simple for me.
As long as they have their own weaknesses, I have no reason to hate them.

 

[DestructionBomb]

Generally speaking, the VF characters are difficult with certain Yomi and certain playstyle in complexity within execution. The approach is different. You cannot play Akira like a Kokoro and you cannot play Kokoro like an Akira. It's not that the VF characters are easier in this game, the DOA mechanic is openly free for precise inputs. You could perform 2336P and within that "3" is a mistake but the game will still register that as 236P because it's being generous..which makes it easier on the side for pad players. Is that a bad thing? No, it's not. Because you might have players who are too accustomed to the pad since they were first playing on the SNES. The VF characters are in fact the hardest characters to play within the game along with Raidou, majority of their inputs is still not generally easy to do...it's DOA that is giving you a bike with invisible training wheels. Try adding Ryu Hayabusa and Raidou in VF. Those throw inputs will be the hardest inputs in your entire life. Do Ryu Hayabusa's Izuna drop in training mode (Full version) and look at the inputs at the bottom. About 80% of that motion is incorrect. Is that a bad thing? No, of course not but this is to provide meaning to people that are saying the VF characters are easier in this game. They are not. It's the built-in mechanic for free flow to help players not get irritated when dropping stuff, and they amped it up a bit for online play.

Now here is my general opinion about DOAxVF. I personally would not like a DOAxVF because that alone means that it would be an entire new game and an entire new mechanic build that we all have to adapt. And if there is a general feedback when it comes to crossover games..it's that most of them sell well but the game itself on a competitive scale, turns out quite bad and can cause a huge dilemma with 2 sides of the community. Which is why I genuinely prefer "Guest" characters. Why? because guest characters visit the game and respect the game mechanics. Guest characters are technically speaking - *New* characters regardless, they are exactly no different than Rig and Mila appearing in the game, The word "Guest" applies to reality. If someone were to visit your house to sleep over for a few months, he has to abide by your rules and abide by his/her honor. The issue with 1 or 2 of the posters here is that some of them believe they are in the house raiding all your food and leaving you with nothing to eat and Argentus is currently sleeping and having a dream of this happening, but the psychologist said he needs to drink plenty of water and that he needs to play the game...a bit more..to bypass his hallucination about twerky movements and uh, whatever your drink was giving you.

But wait! let's not go there.

So if you are talking about crossover guest characters into DOA so far? It was excellent. Well done TN. You should add characters over there (The ones that make sense.) Tekken characters? I don't mind but please avoid the ones that have lasers shooting out of their eyes or remove the move and provide DOA frame data within the characters.

*Yes to Guest Characters. Absolutely. Bring more for a new refresh if you cannot come up with a character idea. It's still New characters.
*No to DOAxVF new game. It's going to cause issues and likely a big split from 2 communities from 2 games. However, if it turns out good and surprises me. Literally shocking me. I will take back what I said about the DOAxVF game and give it a yes.

Now let me put this in bold:

"There is no clash of the system, the VF characters are doing good here because these are not direct straight paste of the VF characters from over there. These are characters that were done on a DOA base model and received the rights from SEGA to add their movesets, voice clips, animation for winning/outro into the game."

 

[Lando41]

Generally speaking, the VF characters are difficult with certain Yomi and certain playstyle in complexity within execution. The approach is different. You cannot play Akira like a Kokoro and you cannot play Kokoro like an Akira. It's not that the VF characters are easier in this game, the DOA mechanic is openly free for precise inputs. You could perform 2336P and within that "3" is a mistake but the game will still register that as 236P because it's being generous..which makes it easier on the side for pad players. Is that a bad thing? No, it's not. Because you might have players who are too accustomed to the pad since they were first playing on the SNES. The VF characters are in fact the hardest characters to play within the game along with Raidou, majority of their inputs is still not generally easy to do...it's DOA that is giving you a bike with invisible training wheels. Try adding Ryu Hayabusa and Raidou in VF. Those throw inputs will be the hardest inputs in your entire life. Do Ryu Hayabusa's Izuna drop in training mode (Full version) and look at the inputs at the bottom. About 80% of that motion is incorrect. Is that a bad thing? No, of course not but this is to provide meaning to people that are saying the VF characters are easier in this game. They are not. It's the built-in mechanic for free flow to help players not get irritated when dropping stuff, and they amped it up a bit for online play.

Now here is my general opinion about DOAxVF. I personally would not like a DOAxVF because that alone means that it would be an entire new game and an entire new mechanic build that we all have to adapt. And if there is a general feedback when it comes to crossover games..it's that most of them sell well but the game itself on a competitive scale, turns out quite bad and can cause a huge dilemma with 2 sides of the community. Which is why I genuinely prefer "Guest" characters. Why? because guest characters visit the game and respect the game mechanics. Guest characters are technically speaking - *New* characters regardless, they are exactly no different than Rig and Mila appearing in the game, The word "Guest" applies to reality. If someone were to visit your house to sleep over for a few months, he has to abide by your rules and abide by his/her honor. The issue with 1 or 2 of the posters here is that some of them believe they are in the house raiding all your food and leaving you with nothing to eat and Argentus is currently sleeping and having a dream of this happening, but the psychologist said he needs to drink plenty of water and that he needs to play the game...a bit more..to bypass his hallucination about twerky movements and uh, whatever your drink was giving you.

But wait! let's not go there.

So if you are talking about crossover guest characters into DOA so far? It was excellent. Well done TN. You should add characters over there (The ones that make sense.) Tekken characters? I don't mind but please avoid the ones that have lasers shooting out of their eyes or remove the move and provide DOA frame data within the characters.

*Yes to Guest Characters. Absolutely. Bring more for a new refresh if you cannot come up with a character idea. It's still new characters.
*No to DOAxVF new game. It's going to cause issues and likely a big split from 2 communities from 2 games. However, if it turns out good and surprises me. Literally shocking me. I will take back what I said about the DOAxVF game and give it a yes.

Now let me put this in bold:

"There is no clash of the system, the VF characters are doing good here because these are not direct straight paste of the VF characters from over there. These are characters that were done on a DOA base model and received the rights from SEGA to add their movesets, voice clips, animation for winning/outro into the game."

Good summary right there. Which is why i would love more VF done in Doa . TN....make it happen please. I dont have any problems with the game as is and bring more over to flow will make me a happy camper even more.

 

[Argentus]

How do you know when you counter hit ? are you a wizard ?

Because it said counter hit. And I counter hit.

I don't like having seizures just because you can't pick up on the existing cues. Sorry to be mean but I really hate hit effects with a passion.

 

[Lulu]

Because it said counter hit. And I counter hit.

I don't like having seizures just because you can't pick up on the existing cues. Sorry to be mean but I really hate hit effects with a passion.

Huh..... I thought you said you played with The Hit Status Off.... in other words those red letters that pop up on the screen.

 

[Lulu]

Generally speaking, the VF characters are difficult with certain Yomi and certain playstyle in complexity within execution. The approach is different. You cannot play Akira like a Kokoro and you cannot play Kokoro like an Akira. It's not that the VF characters are easier in this game, the DOA mechanic is openly free for precise inputs. You could perform 2336P and within that "3" is a mistake but the game will still register that as 236P because it's being generous..which makes it easier on the side for pad players. Is that a bad thing? No, it's not. Because you might have players who are too accustomed to the pad since they were first playing on the SNES. The VF characters are in fact the hardest characters to play within the game along with Raidou, majority of their inputs is still not generally easy to do...it's DOA that is giving you a bike with invisible training wheels. Try adding Ryu Hayabusa and Raidou in VF. Those throw inputs will be the hardest inputs in your entire life. Do Ryu Hayabusa's Izuna drop in training mode (Full version) and look at the inputs at the bottom. About 80% of that motion is incorrect. Is that a bad thing? No, of course not but this is to provide meaning to people that are saying the VF characters are easier in this game. They are not. It's the built-in mechanic for free flow to help players not get irritated when dropping stuff, and they amped it up a bit for online play.

Now here is my general opinion about DOAxVF. I personally would not like a DOAxVF because that alone means that it would be an entire new game and an entire new mechanic build that we all have to adapt. And if there is a general feedback when it comes to crossover games..it's that most of them sell well but the game itself on a competitive scale, turns out quite bad and can cause a huge dilemma with 2 sides of the community. Which is why I genuinely prefer "Guest" characters. Why? because guest characters visit the game and respect the game mechanics. Guest characters are technically speaking - *New* characters regardless, they are exactly no different than Rig and Mila appearing in the game, The word "Guest" applies to reality. If someone were to visit your house to sleep over for a few months, he has to abide by your rules and abide by his/her honor. The issue with 1 or 2 of the posters here is that some of them believe they are in the house raiding all your food and leaving you with nothing to eat and Argentus is currently sleeping and having a dream of this happening, but the psychologist said he needs to drink plenty of water and that he needs to play the game...a bit more..to bypass his hallucination about twerky movements and uh, whatever your drink was giving you.

But wait! let's not go there.

So if you are talking about crossover guest characters into DOA so far? It was excellent. Well done TN. You should add characters over there (The ones that make sense.) Tekken characters? I don't mind but please avoid the ones that have lasers shooting out of their eyes or remove the move and provide DOA frame data within the characters.

*Yes to Guest Characters. Absolutely. Bring more for a new refresh if you cannot come up with a character idea. It's still new characters.
*No to DOAxVF new game. It's going to cause issues and likely a big split from 2 communities from 2 games. However, if it turns out good and surprises me. Literally shocking me. I will take back what I said about the DOAxVF game and give it a yes.

Now let me put this in bold:

"There is no clash of the system, the VF characters are doing good here because these are not direct straight paste of the VF characters from over there. These are characters that were done on a DOA base model and received the rights from SEGA to add their movesets, voice clips, animation for winning/outro into the game."

But the VF Characters are significantly much easier to use in the game they come from than they are in DoA (except for Akira). Why ?!

Also do any of the VF Characters have Offensive Holds ? I know Sarah has parries and good for her but Jacky only has the one Parry that I know of and Pai..... ?
I'm guessing it would be extremely unfair to give the fastest and safest characters in the game the very same tools they are suppose to be vulnerable to..... but I just want to be sure.

 

[Force_of_Nature]

Have you used the VF characters in VF5FS against someone that knows how to fight them properly? I really don't see how they're easier in VF compared to DOA.

 

[Lulu]

Have you used the VF characters in VF5FS against someone that knows how to fight them properly? I really don't see how they're easier in VF compared to DOA.

Doesn't matter.... if I lose in VF it win't have anything to do with Execution but if I lose in DoA its because I can't do this move or that input.... I suck anyway so win or lose it doesn't matter to me.... I'm more concerned about stuff that I just flatout can't execute. Its like playing chess with one piece missing from the get go.
And about that, what the hell is reasoning behind Gen Fu and Eliot's (3) P's ? Its such an ambiguous input and it doesn't need to be at all... and yet it just is for some reason....

 

[Argentus]

Huh..... I thought you said you played with The Hit Status Off.... in other words those red letters that pop up on the screen.

No with hit effects off. So no little explosion effects every time a hit lands.

 

[Lulu]

No with hit effects off. So no little explosion effects every time a hit lands.

Oh.... well that I can live with.... I can't tell those tiny puffs of air apart from each other anyway..... hell for the longest time Kokoro had this ambiguous attack where both her fist and foot look like they are hitting you and I didn't know which one to counter, the hit effects did nothing to help narrow it down....
I'm currently experiencing a similar problem with two of Leifang's Attacks.... don't know if shes punching or kicking, high or mid.....
Heres a fun fact.... you know that booty bump Lisa perform's from her BT stance...... the move details classify it as both Mid Punch and Kick.... and you can confirm it by holding...... Tina's butt on the other hand is a lot more confu- okay now I'm just rambling.

 

[Lando41]

Really tho.....complaint about the hit effects in doa5? If they were like Tekkens then yeah but i dont see an issue with them seriously.....or is that just a nit pick goin around?

I actually like Vf5s and Doa5 hit effects. Pretty solid imo.