Dealing with Stun Abuse

[dawnbringer]

I like the overall concept, yet, it seems a bit flawed. First off, the attack that put the opponent in the short stun was more damaging than the jab that greatly extends the stun -- which leads to excessive hold attempts, which leads to complaints about holds while stunned etc.

Not sure what you mean here. Anyway, you don't just hold out of nowhere, you should hold on anticipation. And what complains are you talking about? Complains about holds rarely mean much; one can hold as much as they want, it will only make them killed faster.

B) There is no visual or audible indication as to the length of the stun. So you don't even know when a stun is going to be deep or not.

Yes, you need to know properties of a move you hit with. This is done gradually by encountering this move during matches and practicing.

 

[OldsmoBuick]

From brain to hand in 1/6 of a second ... sounds like a guess ...

 

[onedayitllmake]

Is it the case that pressing nothing, is in a way a viable option? Since they as mentioned, can only stun so much?
That's what I've done a couple of times, mind you I'm currently a terrible player, so I'm actually asking.

 

[OldsmoBuick]

Is it the case that pressing nothing, is in a way a viable option? Since they as mentioned, can only stun so much?That's what I've done a couple of times, mind you I'm currently a terrible player, so I'm actually asking.

That depends on your definition of 'viable'. It's definitely an option. If you aren't going to attempt a hold, you should be SEing at the very least, though.

 

[shinryu]

That depends on your definition of 'viable'. It's definitely an option. If you aren't going to attempt a hold, you should be SEing at the very least, though.

Basically this. There's no penalty to stagger escaping (with some nasty exceptions if you're back-turned, actually). Overall, though, I would only not hold if you really anticipate a throw coming up, and even then you can exploit that better with a low hold. I'm still not clear on whether or not there are actually any stuns where stagger escape gets you out of any possible attack, but there are definitely stuns where you can prevent an opponent's best options. Obviously in the case of a sitdown stun you don't have a lot of choice. But typically you're better off with some kind of hold.

 

[dawnbringer]

Overall, though, I would only not hold if you really anticipate a throw coming up, and even then you can exploit that better with a low hold.

But typically you're better off with some kind of hold.

Throw is not the only option to punish whiffed hold. As far as I know stun frames are added to hold recovery, so it effectively increases window of opportunity for your opponent if they predict the hold. For example, they can use slower attacks that weren't possible without whiffed hold.

I'm still not clear on whether or not there are actually any stuns where stagger escape gets you out of any possible attack

There are. There are stuns that can be reduced to frame advantage without anything guaranteed. For example, +15 knee stun can be slow escaped to +7 stun. Moreover there are stuns that never guarantee follow-up, because strikes are too slow and you that cannot throw stunned opponent.

 

[OldsmoBuick]

Basically this. There's no penalty to stagger escaping (with some nasty exceptions if you're back-turned, actually). Overall, though, I would only not hold if you really anticipate a throw coming up, and even then you can exploit that better with a low hold. I'm still not clear on whether or not there are actually any stuns where stagger escape gets you out of any possible attack, but there are definitely stuns where you can prevent an opponent's best options. Obviously in the case of a sitdown stun you don't have a lot of choice. But typically you're better off with some kind of hold.

I'm going to suggest that you change your mentality on holds, while stunned. As DOA5 gets it's legs under itself, people are going to better understand the mechanics and underlying philosophy, of the game. At that point, average to mediocre players, will mercilessly, exploit the fact that you hold often -- I didn't say always. Adjust your game now, before it becomes a habit.