Free Step Dodge

Not knowing the frame data can hurt you for sure, but in my opinion, if you have a general idea of what you can punish(mainly throw punish) and what attacks to use in certain scenarios, than you can do well even without frame data, and you can even condition players. On high-level plays, especially in tournaments, frame data knowledge is quite mandatory.

Ring/Spatial Control>>>>>>>>>>>everything else.

@ChaolanLegacy - I mean it's actually possible to do well without the need of frame data knowledge fully once you get the general basis down for visual sense on what to look out for like you said (Ex. Hayabusa's 6PP, you don't have to think twice with disadvantage, you can copy what frame data players would do to it and throw it as well) not to say it's mandatory but recommended yeah.

This is true online, otherwise false in general. Someone with more knowledge and more experience can condition someone a lot better than someone without that knowledge.

Like, Nyo players can get away with 2P on NH and do something else because you cannot block or hold 2PP online unless you mash hold. Thats not really conditioning, thats abusing lag lol.

Indeed,there are quite a lot of things people can get away with online compared to offline,sometimes it is so bad that you can't even punish accordingly, or as you said, get hit by something online which wouldn't hit you online.

However in most of the games in pool play not everyone knows the frame data, and huge things can go sometimes unpunished, but they might have a feel to do this in a scenario, or take huge risks here. To get into top 64 and such, you do need frame data knowledge, as well as experience, match-up knowledge etc.

hawt dam, i didn't expect so many responses! I actually posted this after running a lengthy set with an offline buddy of mine who plays helena, zack and rig. surprisingly we went even but when it was all done he was going on about how conditioning can make frame data irrelevant, and to a certain degree i kinda had to agree with him

Cause he definitely had me blocking in situations where I should have been hitting a button, and got grabs off in situations where, from a from frame data point of view didn’t make sense. Granted as the set went on I got better about blowing up the gaps in his offence with quick pokes and his pressure got less effective as the set dragged on (the fact that it was offline helped im sure lol).

So in an offline scenario, maybe not so much, but in the crazy world of online, I definitely saying knowing how to condition is hella more useful than knowing all the numbers

Steady isn't extremely deep into frame data and has played games not on the net as well as winning from more of a visual perspective than most -

What Hajin is referring to is the terrible concept applied from playing on the net that players throw out on what you normally would absorb but much more difficult to absorb within the net and causes the player to think it's conditioning. There is proper conditioning as well as bad ones.

Now I may sound like a condescending prick, but conditioning isn't really justifying much if the person know's what's going because it's tossing your scenarios to him. If the stuff you do is clearly unsafe situations and he's not doing anything about it, it's not really sort of conditioning, he's just respecting you too much that shouldn't be respectable in the first place unless they are forced to deal with it.

such as the nyo NH 2p into throw, yeah that shit definitely don't work offline lolz,

If you want to get technical with the word "conditioning" on global definition here's one.

You splat somebody on the wall and do a setup that stops the WUK. You do it again and again until they get it the first time. But you also have a setup incase they choose to get up right away. You forced them to deal with the option of getting up because they are too afraid to deal with the ground. That's "conditioning."

You conditioned them to get up instead or get up and block which can result of them to take extra precautions such as getting up and block and then you throw them again to reset everything back to square one. You can condition someone to block more often or attack less if you provided a proper situation that forces them to do that.

and no you're not being a condescending prick, tell it how it is Mr.Bomb! PREACH

As for the 2P into throw from Nyotengu. The only genuine concept applied there is if they are expecting the follow up and "they hold". Low holding is added recovery and preventing you from rising. An intelligent response is to block the first and provided all concepts besides low holding.

Biggest thing I condition a lot of players online and in general with is throw, and run up throw. Makes people crouch on wake up or mash a lot. End result is me gaining a lot of counter hits because people are scared of being thrown. Throws are a powerful tool in fighting games.

That is mostly how I beat Teru Rock at NEC last year. Made him scared of run up throw.