Character Force Tech's?

[Omegan Eckhart]

After seeing the drama over Helena's pseudo force tech set ups I decided to have a look and see how many characters can do it as well, as I am convinced that the use of hard knock downs to avoid wake up kicks is universal.

We all have in depth knowledge of different characters so add what you can so we can compile info on all characters.

Helena: 33P4P > 6P or 2K
Ayane: 6K2K > 2F+K
Tina: 6PPP > 2F+P or ???

 

[Drake Aldan]

Some in here, too.

http://www.freestepdodge.com/threads/pseudo-force-tech-setups.1929/

Might be worth quantifying the damage loss for characters compared to finishing a full/staple combo.

 

[shinryu]

Unfortunately most of the setups I posted there appear to be techable: use these instead.

Tina gets 8p or 1p 6f+k from 236p, hold 33p, 6f+k, 3p+k, and BT p+k guaranteed. She can also use 6pp6k from a standard launch for a pseudo force tech like Helena's. Her ground throw does not allow force techs that I know of.

Bayman should get 8p or p+k from any p+k on critical or juggle. This is character dependent to some extent which one you have to use. He has a couple of pseudo setups (8k, p+k, delayed 6ppk in juggles).

Mila can force tech after 9p and 3f+k with 2p 3f+k or just 3f+k. There's enough advantage after the tech to mixup 9p or 3f+k for a reset. She doesn't really have a good pseudo force tech but she's hunting for mount after a juggle anyway so she doesn't really need that.

Zack appears to have several force techs that work after juggles, but they're character dependent and a bit timing nasty. Only one that pops to mind is after a high stun threshold 33kk launch pp2kkk should work, or 9k launch 2kkk. I know he gets a decent pseudo after many launches with 2kp into whatever string extender or 2p2kkk to force tech.

Hitomi gets a force tech after 3f+k, not sure if she has any setups for that from juggle or any pseudos. I suspect 9pkk might be a good candidate for setting it up though. Don't play her extensively.

Supposedly Hayate can use pp2k, but I think this is very tight timing.

 

[Raansu]

After seeing the drama over Helena's pseudo force tech set ups I decided to have a look and see how many characters can do it as well, as I am convinced that the use of hard knock downs to avoid wake up kicks is universal.

We all have in depth knowledge of different characters so add what you can so we can compile info on all characters.

Helena: 33P4P > 6P or 2K
Ayane: 6K2K > 2F+K
Tina: 6PPP > 2F+P or ???

It is not universal...I've already told you this. If it was Hitomi would have the best force techs in the game as she has 5 variations of juggles that have hard knockdowns. Helena's pseudo tech works because that juggle puts her at +20 and 6p is 12 frames. Hitomi on the other hand is only at +13 after the hard knockdown.

 

[shinryu]

It is not universal...I've already told you this. If it was Hitomi would have the best force techs in the game as she has 5 variations of juggles that have hard knockdowns. Helena's pseudo tech works because that juggle puts her at +20 and 6p is 12 frames. Hitomi on the other hand is only at +13 after the hard knockdown.

So not enough time for anything to connect after the hard knockdown; they just can't tech? That seems odd... Can you give me an example? I'd like to see what's going on.

 

[iHajinShinobi]

After seeing the drama over Helena's pseudo force tech set ups I decided to have a look and see how many characters can do it as well, as I am convinced that the use of hard knock downs to avoid wake up kicks is universal.

We all have in depth knowledge of different characters so add what you can so we can compile info on all characters.

Helena: 33P4P > 6P or 2K
Ayane: 6K2K > 2F+K
Tina: 6PPP > 2F+P or ???

Ayane's 6K2K > 2H+K isn't a force tech (in DOA5).

These are what Xdest and I have found, with viable followups.

Force Techs

Starter 8K Normal hit, counter or Hi counter

PP6K2K - Delay the 2K followup so that it forces the opponent off the ground immediately.

Starter 4P Counter and Hi counter

BTPP2PK
BTPP6P2K (delay)

Starter BT6P Counter and Hi counter

1PK

Starter BT4K Counter and Hi counter

BT6P, 1PK - Slightly delay the low sweep in 1PK on lightweights.

All of the above force techs allow for true 50/50 mixups between 3P, 8H+P, 8H+K, and 66KK4.

Breakdown: Neither 3P or 66KK4 can be beaten by "any" attack opponents try to attempt after being forced up. Both are vunerable to holds, however, can be blocked. If 66KK4 is blocked, Ayane is still in a good spot to continue pressure. Both 3P and 66KK4 can be side stepped. But this is where the Dynamic Duo of the infamous 8H+P and 8H+K come into play. Both moves track, preventing all side step attempts. And the animation between these two moves are very hard to tell apart. So, after forcing opponents up, if they attempt to attack, 3P and 66KK4 beats them clean and puts them in CH/HCH state. If they block, they are thrown by 8H+P. If they duck, 66KK4 hits them. Going for force techs definitely does sacriface a bit of damage, but in return, you're allowing Ayane to keep advantage by pressuring opponents to keep the upper hand.

Also, wouldn't it be better just to create a thread about force techs in each individual character sub-forum or in their combo threads? That is where I have all of these listed at.

 

[Jefffcore]

Mila:

Guaranteed
After any standing 3H+K or 9P you can force tech with 3H+K or 2P, 2P. 2P, 2P doesn't really do any damage and you're at +26; 3H+K does more damage and you're still at +19.

Pseudo
Any time you do P6PP, 3PP you can do 3H+K. If they tech themselves you're at +1 on Lights, and on Mids you're at +0. On Heavy's you have to stick to P6PP, 3H+K which also leaves you with + (I'm just not sure how much yet). If you wanna sacrifice damage you can do just P6PP, 3H+K on a Midweight to get more than +0. If you force them up with 3H+K you're at +20.

If you had a low enough launch height you can do 2P, 2P instead of the 3H+K to get more advantage; it works best after a low punch hold on Midweights.

**Mila's mounts act similar if broken.

 

[Nereus]

Jann Lee: After CB....33P PP6P 1P. Have to wait a little while for it to work. If done right guaranteed (i don't think it works that easily on bayman/Bass). Leaves you at +16 or +18 (can't remember off top of my head). You can do 6P after force tech or D-Gunner for a 50/50 mixup.

Gen Fu: 236T,8P,8PP2K. One of the combos with the force tech that you can do the combo with. I believe this may work with any combo given the height of the launch/character. Leaves Gen Fu at +10... but the range is why i believe this force tech may not be that effective. Have to delay the last Kick. Not that hard to pull off.

Hitomi: After CB... Either 8H+K or 66H+K, 3H+K. This one is weird. After the CB you have to delay the 66H+K and the 8H+K JUST a LITTLE BIT..... then do the 3H+K afterwards. Leaves her at +18 and you can mix it up with 1P+K or 6H+K after the force tech. Credit for the mixup goes to Jeffcore (Your still a pain in the ass)