Helena Questions

[Murakame]

Sup guys; I have a lot of trouble dealing with Helena when facing a competent opponent. They say the best way to deal with a character is to learn the character yourself. Despite all of her shortcomings I'm attracted to the way she eliminates the wake-up kick; something I fear because it put's an end to my offense. I understand other characters have the ability to do this but the way Helena just constantly puts on the pressure is cool to a player like me that loves to use aggressive rush down / pressure characters. So I wanted to ask:

1. What are the options that allow Helena to begin her onslaught?
2. How does she stop the opponent from interfering with these options?
3. Is there a time I should ever stop attacking? Or is she so unsafe that the best option is to continue the flurry of slaps?
4. What should I focus on learning first? The Bokuho options? Untechable combos?

 

[CrimsonCJ]

1. They're actually weaker than you'd assume, but there's a really decent number of them. Know 1PPK; it hits low can get a stun. 2H+K works on the same principle; probably less holdable but fewer mix-up options and less safe on block. 6P+K is safe but kinda slow. 3PPP is faster and has decent range; 4PPP/4PPKK has a little bit better range to start but is slower. 33PP/33P4P crushes highs, and thus can be huge to beat out jabs. P+K is another high crush with good range. KKK/3KKK give some range and are pseudo-safe because you can delay them.
2. Honestly... by picking different ones a lot. Just using different advantages (or the same advantage that an opponent has a blind spot to) gets you a long way even if none of those moves in isolation are all that great. Sometimes easier said than done, though.
3. A. Slowing the pace can bait a hold and get you started all over again, that or lead you into a different string; B. There are certain places (like against the wall) where you are more or less forced to at a certain point let it reset.
4. Learn the strings that allow you to pseudo tech. (They're easy! Half of em end in 33P4P or a variant like it). Knowing the crushes helps too. Then I would try and figure out BKO and the more extended combos.

(To clarify on 4, however; the tech combos take you into and through BKO, so you will already know some of it. And there's not that much to the rest, I suppose. The 4P transitions? The sweep? 6p out of BKO is the pseudo-tech.)

 

[Vie du Soleil]

Hey guys, I'm trying to get a better handle on Hele's evasive options so I thought I'd ask for tips. I've found BKO duck go be great for interrupting combos but getting it off in the middle of a string on block seems to be nearly impossible. Any tips toward proper execution? Also, can someone tell me do BKO 3p4p and BKO pp really execute in 9 frames as the in-game data indicates?

 

[Doug Nguyen]

Hey guys, I'm trying to get a better handle on Hele's evasive options so I thought I'd ask for tips. I've found BKO duck go be great for interrupting combos but getting it off in the middle of a string on block seems to be nearly impossible. Any tips toward proper execution? Also, can someone tell me do BKO 3p4p and BKO pp really execute in 9 frames as the in-game data indicates?

You can really only do it if they delay there attacks or the attack is charged/slow. I would recommend side stepping instead. Side step K can go into Bokuho if you hold down. BKO PP is 12 frames i think, 11 after the patch. And i think you talking about BKO 6P4P, that is 14 frames.

 

[CrimsonCJ]

Hey guys, I'm trying to get a better handle on Hele's evasive options so I thought I'd ask for tips. I've found BKO duck go be great for interrupting combos but getting it off in the middle of a string on block seems to be nearly impossible. Any tips toward proper execution? Also, can someone tell me do BKO 3p4p and BKO pp really execute in 9 frames as the in-game data indicates?

Well, you could interrupt if the move went mid-high, but most moves head from high to mid. Interrupting anything else is going to require some black magic, basically. You usually want to, ideally, hit them during a string cancel or on the recovery of a wiffed attack.

I'd have to look at the data, but no way does either attack in 9 frames. You may be looking at only the second part of the string.

 

[Vie du Soleil]

Thanks for the help guys. Bertha it was indeed BKO 6p4p I meant but going for those two attacks alone always comes up as 9 frames, same with BKO pp (just BKO p is coming up at 12) i have traded with kasumi's jab using this attack but it's hard to really test the timing since one person is pressing p and the other is helena lol. BKO duck is a thing guys don't write it off haha! SS is fantastic but the duck route can really pay off (the few matches I've done it) p+k right after seems to lay the girl right on the floor from what I can see.

 

[Doug Nguyen]

Thanks for the help guys. Bertha it was indeed BKO 6p4p I meant but going for those two attacks alone always comes up as 9 frames, same with BKO pp (just BKO p is coming up at 12) i have traded with kasumi's jab using this attack but it's hard to really test the timing since one person is pressing p and the other is helena lol. BKO duck is a thing guys don't write it off haha! SS is fantastic but the duck route can really pay off (the few matches I've done it) p+k right after seems to lay the girl right on the floor from what I can see.

Yeah i love BKO duck but only if used properly really. Its not that good for interrupting attacks. Its good if you whiff an attack or they block your attack and your already in BKO.

 

[Vie du Soleil]

Agreed I just want to to be moooaaar! Lol I'm always surprised how few attacks actually work when you add duck at the end of a botched attack into BKO. Side question, has anyone found a good use for 236 p+k outside of her delicious wall game? With it becoming +1 on block I really want to add it to my go to arsenal

 

[Doug Nguyen]

Agreed I just want to to be moooaaar! Lol I'm always surprised how few attacks actually work when you add duck at the end of a botched attack into BKO. Side question, has anyone found a good use for 236 p+k outside of her delicious wall game? With it becoming +1 on block I really want to add it to my go to arsenal

Yeah it used to be really good in DOA4, much faster. But not really, that attack isnt really that good. +1 to me isnt that big of an advantage. And the attack has a slow start up too. So i would rarely get them on block.

 

[Omegan Eckhart]

Agreed I just want to to be moooaaar! Lol I'm always surprised how few attacks actually work when you add duck at the end of a botched attack into BKO. Side question, has anyone found a good use for 236 p+k outside of her delicious wall game? With it becoming +1 on block I really want to add it to my go to arsenal

No that move is useless! Kill it and burn it's corpse!

Seriously the only way to use it is condition the opponent to block, say do 33P > 236P+K. A good player won't let you get away with a free cancel like that though.

If used against a dumb opponent who can't tell her 3in1's apart you could do 6P when it's blocked seeing as most people know all her other 3in1's are -4 on block and will try to attack punish her when it's blocked. Again don't try it against someone who knows what they are doing.

 

[Vie du Soleil]

Funny thing is most people treat all her variants the same, so the plain move really works wonders if it comes out. Stunning is probably the best route (when isn't it?) a light stun like 236 Pk might make them block long enough to get it off.

@bertha, you couldn't pay me not to use it in 3 lol. Won't people need a 10 frame mid to beat it out now? Ignoring lows for a moment of course