Lets be serious here Alpha-152 needs to be banned.

[KidArk]

Except for the one tournament to rule them all: Evo.

Where Wobbles (?) made it to 2nd place but was outplayed by a Peach player who knew how to defeat the characters by keeping them separated.

Yes and i'm sure every banned character has been beaten before, knowing MUs do help, but that statement was primarily to address the fact that he said Alpha wasn't over powered. If anything you helped prove my point as I said the ice climbers are pretty low tier in terms of everything except for being able to chain grab. Where as alpha is not exceeding only in her 50% grabs but in many other faculties as well. Even though they're not banned at EVO since they aren't even a presence at EVO anymore (SSBM), the players only viable tournament life is in smaller ones where I do believe I still saw bannings in select tournaments.

 

[Crext]

Except for the one tournament to rule them all: Evo.

Where Wobbles (?) made it to 2nd place but was outplayed by a Peach player who knew how to defeat the characters by keeping them separated.

Actually it was Star Fox. Also he massacred him 6 - 0.

The Peach fight with the Swede was close though 2-1, so was the fight with jiggly puff (again 2-1). In a way it proved right there that the ice climbers wasn't ban worthy.

 

[Awesmic]

Me personally don't give a shit about this discussion anymore. No matter how nice you try to be people can't have a mature discussion. People have to get butt hurt from non sense instead of having a proper debate. If TN didn't listen to this community bullshit I can see why. If you was to show them this topic they probably wouldn't waste there time reading through this sillyness.

If a lot of people here didn't come off as stuck-up, condescending, and full of apathy in their posts, I'd bet my own Christie doll the naysayers would've listened to y'all by now and compromised their defensive views to come to an understanding. If Deathofaninja could cope with what I was saying, anyone can do better.

But no, that's too much like "holding hands and Candyland" for you people, and this is one of the many reasons I don't speak my mind very often..

 

[Prince Adon]

If a lot of people here didn't come off as stuck-up, condescending, and full of apathy in their posts, I'd bet my own Christie doll the naysayers would've listened to y'all by now and compromised their defensive views to come to an understanding. If Deathofaninja could cope with what I was saying, anyone can do better.

But no, that's too much like "holding hands and Candyland" for you people, and this is one of the many reasons I don't speak my mind very often..

I meant on both sides of the argument.

 

[Tenryuga]

What people need to understand is that in a debate facts are presented and disputed for both sides. Personal feelings and emotions have no place in an argument as it litters the argument with bias. A few others and myself have presented facts about Alpha-152 and these facts were challenged as "claims and theory craft." with no supporting details.

So I decided to provide videos showcasing Alpha being bodied and Alpha doing the bodying so unbias discussion could follow. I'm not an unreasonable person. If the Alpha players came at me with anti-strats and facts that dispute my argument then I would accept defeat. But they are not. Instead they see things as a personal attack on them and want to use that and whatever spite competitive players may have against a specific player and Alpha to fuel their argument. They've basically been providing us with statements like "Learn the MU." assuming that people don't know it. And if our assesment of the MU is wrong this is the reason the Alpha players are here. To correct us and explain it.

As it stands right now the only counter arguments I have seen are "Alpha is free at the wall" and "Her strings are predictable." I provided evidence that disputes the former and I agree with the latter. I even pointed out one flaw (lack of an 7i throw for punishment) that can help their case. From what I see the only real anti-strategy against this character is "make good reads at all times in the match." and this isn't even a strategy the Alpha players presented, it is one that I, the opponent, had to present for them.

It also doesn't help when you have them saying their 7K is unsafe, yet when the frame data is bought to the table that disputes that they do not acknowledge it or explain why they had the notion of it being unsafe. How am I supposed to trust what a player has to say about their character when they come to the table with incorrect information or won't correct / acknowledge mistakes?

 

[Deleted member 473]

Yes and i'm sure every banned character has been beaten before, knowing MUs do help, but that statement was primarily to address the fact that he said Alpha wasn't over powered. If anything you helped prove my point as I said the ice climbers are pretty low tier in terms of everything except for being able to chain grab. Where as alpha is not exceeding only in her 50% grabs but in many other faculties as well. Even though they're not banned at EVO since they aren't even a presence at EVO anymore (SSBM), the players only viable tournament life is in smaller ones where I do believe I still saw bannings in select tournaments.

Are you going to TFC?

 

[hollow]

Honestly if this was 1.02 Alpha I don't think discussion would be necessary. You would have to be extremely delusional to think a character with a 12 frame +2 on guard flip kick that has high damage on counter hit and crushes 12 frame lows and mids on top of all the other things stated in this thread is fair game in a tournament.

Well it's not 1.02 it's 1.03 so this comment was unnecessary and did not help the discussion, just saying.

 

[Aven Kujo-Gin]

I don´t want her to get banned, because with the new feather weight she have, I´m going to have a lot fun juggling her like there´s no tomorrow.

 

[Tenryuga]

Well it's not 1.02 it's 1.03 so this comment was unnecessary and did not help the discussion, just saying.

What you quoted was in response to what Gruntdude said about banning 1.02 Alpha in the UK. It wasn't an argument for the current discussion.

 

[Steady G]

Okay this is what I am going to say about Alpha. Haha (here we go, I might get cursed out of what I'm about to say since I always do when I make a statement but I'm going for it anyways)

If you take a look at the story line point of view of DOA, Helena, Lisa, basically DOATEC itself "created" Alpha to annihilate the ninjas so to speak. So, her damage, evasive techniques, and speed fits PERFECTLY! If DOATEC wanted to create something to overpower the ninjas, they did one hell of a job at it! That's why when people pick Alpha, I would usually pick Christie OR Kasumi (because I like the idea of Kasumi beating Alpha once in for all haha) in order to have a better chance of defeating her.

Banning a character for a reason such as damage or the MAIN reason is that people get owned by her is craycray to me. LOL There are MANY ways around that thing and you guys just have to find the best options that would work best for you. I'm not saying that the people complaining about Alpha don't know how to fight her, I'm saying that people need to make better choices when fighting her. Lets face it, Alpha isn't going anywhere and she is a "boss" character. You guys expect her to fight like Bass or something? Haha

P.S. Y'all better leave alone! Hahaha Oh and another thing, I didn't read this whole thread so take that into consideration as well. Haha

 

[MasterHavik]

LBSH Alpha 152 needs to be buffed badly. She is a fucking jobber now. Alpha isn't really hard to beat peeps.

 

[MasterHavik]

Where is all this crap coming people? DOA5u is around corner and we're still talking about this. For all we know Alpha may have been ran into the ground some more when she doesn't. I think alpha rips apart people trying to be overly aggressive. And she benefits from reckless. This character's holds are pretty much MIA if she gets knockdown she is pretty much boned. How is she bannable when she is so easy to piece apart? When I can rip her apart with a low tier character without much effort.

 

[Raansu]

Where is all this crap coming people? DOA5u is around corner and we're still talking about this. For all we know Alpha may have been ran into the ground some more when she doesn't. I think alpha rips apart people trying to be overly aggressive. And she benefits from reckless. This character's holds are pretty much MIA if she gets knockdown she is pretty much boned. How is she bannable when she is so easy to piece apart? When I can rip her apart with a low tier character without much effort.

MIA? Her normal holds reset her position and she has a parry that completely removes the mid mix up game and both options take her away from the wall. I'd hardly call either those MIA or a bad thing in general. And she is far from "boned" when she gets knocked down considering she has invincibility frames during the tech on top of having a parry, 9 frame jab and a 12 frame unholdable flip kick. Those "negatives" are not that negative and will be even less so in 5U with most of the FT's being removed from the game.

Now, if you bothered to read the other posts you would see why people want her banned. She has speed, high damage juggles and damaging throws equal to that of a grappler on top of extremely good string manipulation and nigh impossible to SS. Her having raw speed is perfectly fine, she should be able to apply that kind of pressure, but to do so from both a striker and a grappler perspective is pretty broken. Her throw damage on HCT should not be equaling that of a juggle damage. That's something a slow grappler should be doing, not someone who has raw speed and zero issues pressuring you.

 

[Blackburry]

Where is all this crap coming people? DOA5u is around corner and we're still talking about this. For all we know Alpha may have been ran into the ground some more when she doesn't. I think alpha rips apart people trying to be overly aggressive. And she benefits from reckless. This character's holds are pretty much MIA if she gets knockdown she is pretty much boned. How is she bannable when she is so easy to piece apart? When I can rip her apart with a low tier character without much effort.

You know that this game is like pretty much all about momentum and offense, right?

 

[DR2K]

Point proven.

You just made the nicest person in the world tell you to fuck yourself. Congrats.

P.S Ban alpha. Will her new lightweight it looks like TN is aware she's a bit too good.

 

[MasterHavik]

You know that this game is like pretty much all about momentum and offense, right?

Geez really? I thought it was a 3rd person shooter. I know this game is about all it and Alpha is made to kill you for it. Here's the thing I do this vs. all i9 characters with a jab I block or maybe sometimes hold it if I want to. And this where throw punishment comes in handy too. I don't know about everyone, but Zack, Bass, and Hitomi can get their offense started with their 6Ts. Once on the offense you don't stop Alpha becomes a training dummy. But you know I have no problems vs. her so yeah I don't know what else to say...this is borderline tym threadworthy stuff I see on TYM about Mk9/Injustice.

Also I feel people are giving her the SC4 Algol treatment.

 

[Raansu]

You just made the nicest person in the world tell you to fuck yourself. Congrats.

P.S Ban alpha. Will her new lightweight it looks like TN is aware she's a bit too good.

For being the nicest person in the world he certainly has made a lot of subtle comments in this thread that would be considered pretty stuck up.

 

[Xernuht]

I'm sorry, but ALPHA's only true weakness in 5 is her wake-up game, which doesn't guarantee she will stay down once she's down. While she's standing, she has the tools to beat every other character at their own game for less effort. Bass, Hayabusa and Hayate need 3-stage-throws to manage 80+ damage and have to put in work to get them in, not to mention having their own major flaws in other areas to balance it out. ALPHA? Free-canceling at any point in her strings leading to a simple 236236T nets her 100 damage without counters. Her 9-frame high beats or trades with anything NOT a high crush, a tool few others have access to. Her long strings will track every sidestep the other guy tries, and she still has tracking attacks to pick you out of those. She has reliable guard breaks that are easy to capitalize on with her speed. Her holds do little or no damage, but they all set her up for her overpowering offensive game. Her default strike damage is better than most of the cast. As long as ALPHA is standing, you are in a blender, and if you manage to knock her down, it does NOT suddenly render her incapable of standing back up and restarting the blender and win you the match.

Now, I haven't been paying much attention to her buffs, but from those vids posted earlier, I see her hilariously unsafe FLOAT stance just got an 11-frame launcher, rendering her second major opening useless.

I don't want her banned, but a character who has these tools already and is getting better in 5U is something that needs addressed by TN with a patch. However, with the entire cast getting overhauled in 5U, there is no guarantee that their anti-ALPHA abilities will work as well as they did in vanilla 5. I would recommend a ban from TFC simply because of her 'boss' status, give the community some actual time to figure out what is bad about the characters, then revisit the discussion.

 

[CyberEvil]

For being the nicest person in the world he certainly has made a lot of subtle comments in this thread that would be considered pretty stuck up.

I'm going to tell you this once, publicly: stay on topic and do not attack other members. There was literally no reason to go in on Awesmic, dissenting opinion or not. Keep to the discussion.

 

[Tenryuga]

Being honest here Alpha having her own weight class in 5U is already a step in the right direction as it follows her role of a glass cannon. I think that if the damage on her juggles was reduced a just a little bit, B.U.R.S.T nerfed to 45% damage (I mean it IS a 20 frame grab. Gotta be something good for landing it.) her low throw slowed down to like 7i and the damage toned down to maybe 80 - 90 points and making her 7K unsafe like everyone else's in exchange for a faster mid P would be good enough in addition to the nerf's Emperor cow posted. She would have an overpowering offense in exchange for shit defense like she is supposed to have. We can ban her for TFC then after that assess what needs to be addressed if anything.