Mass Effect 3

[Rikuto]

ME2 was not a bad game. In fact on its own, it would've been a really good game.

The problem people have with ME2 and ME3 is that ME1 had this massive scope as far as character development, inventory, exploration, etc. Basically everything outside of the shooting mechanics was actually really fucking awesome, if not flawed. All bioware had to do to fix the problems was revamp the mako's control scheme and add more cool shit to planets.

Instead they removed all of the cool stuff. Exploration was gutted completely and replaced with cookie cutter bullshit that people from their market research said would sell better. Then you took it further and gutted inventory and the ammo system. They DID improve the cover mechanics, and that is a good benefit, but that's all they did that was really positive. There is absolutely no reason they couldn't have done that begin with.

It had a ton of potential and people hate seeing potential not only squandered, but completely cast aside and written off as a bad idea because it didn't conform to market research. Then you start getting into the more sketchy business designs like new-game-only codes being required for multiplayer, and day 1 DLC which not only should've been in the game to begin with..... IT IS!

It's the old Art vs Business debate. The most infuriating aspect is that just about any time something is impressive enough to do well in the gaming industry it ends up following this pattern in sequels and gutting itself to make more money instead expanding on what made it so desirable in the first place. This pisses off most of the early adopters, and who can blame them?

Luckily the trilogy is over. We don't have to watch it degrade itself any further. Bioware will now probably release some new IP, and it will either blunder horribly or it will be really good until they follow the same pattern as they did with Mass Effect and Dragon Age.

Fuck, I miss the 90's. We had a lot of shitty games back then, but the good ones NEVER cannibalized themselves like this.

 

[Raansu]

There are some spoilers in this response. Read with caution.

The DLC mission was meant to introduce Javik into your party and, despite what I said earlier, hes one of the better characters in the ME universe.

The DLC should of been included with the game. For $10 it wasn't really all that great. The mission itself was barely 20 minutes long and gives very little back story.

Why? Because hes a Prothean and most had always wondered what exactly happened to them and who they were as a race. The interactions he has with Liara in particular were worth the extra scratch.

We know exactly what happened to them...Didn't need a $10 launch dlc to know they were wiped out by reapers. Most of their history was explained throughout ME1 and ME2 as well as the books (which I have read.)

Ransuu, you're just a disagreeable person. ME3 was great and the side missions you're referencing weren't even necessary to get over a 5000 universal readiness. You could have just done all of the N7 missions and hoped online for a few games to get that.

Why would I want to play some lame horde mode to increase my galaxy at war rating? Not only was the idea dumb, its also no excuse to turn the side quests into lame fetch quests with zero interaction. You don't even talk to many of the quest givers. You walk past and overhear their conversations then find the item by scanning a planet, bring the item back to them...At least ME1 had the decency to let you explore the planets, many of which involved combat both on feet and in the vehicle. You don't even fight in the majority of the side quests in ME3, the least they could do is add more back story to them. They were a lame excuse to extend the game in an annoying way (ie. scanning planets is boring and reapers popping up every 3-4 scans in the area was nothing more than a headache.)


Regardless its not about side quests being necessary or not. It's the fact that they stripped them down to meaningless fetch quests. I like side quests, they generally involve some backstory and extend the game. The side quests here were shortcuts and were almost meaningless. Just more proof that BW was simplifying the game for fps casuals.

Also, there are 16 different endings, of those 6 are distinctly different and they were influenced by so many different options thats I'd imagine that none of us got the same ending.

There are 3 endings with "variations" based on reputation, paragon, and renegade choices. The whole "16 different endings" thing is a farce as they are all the same with very very very very slight differences between each one, mostly differencing in how the final mission itself plays out. The actual ending to the game only has 3 different scenarios. All of which are exactly the same outside of how the reapers are dealt with.


All 3 scenarios have Sheppard die (except 1, the "perfect ending" where it shows Sheppard breathing meaning he's still alive which you get for choosing to kill the reapers), all 3 have the same big blast wave destroying the mass effect relays just with different colors based on if you choose to control them, kill them, or merge synthetics with organics (that one was dumb) and regardless the ending ends the same with Joker and the normady crashing on some world with the companions that you did not bring along on the final mission and all endings have the same after credits cutscene as well.

Options from ME1 influenced that ending, romance was handled much more realistically this time, the choices were harder (Cure the Genophage, Geth or Quarian),

The choices weren't all that difficult if you played the game correctly... I cured the genophage and still got the salarian fleet to side with me and got the krogan and the turians to team up. I also solved the Geth and Quarian conflict peacefully without losing either side, both fleets joined the final fight. So please do tell me about these difficult choices. ME1 had difficult choices, and those choices had no compromise involved. Then again ME1 was overall a better game.

the gun play was much better this time around (Then again, you'd never know because you're playing with a mouse.).

This makes no sense....So because you had your aim-assist on the 360 the gun play was magically better?

"All of the endings suck." I bet you just went to IGN and watched the endings.

No I simply replayed the last mission and picked all the different options.

Christ, what about the in-between? What about everything that happened in between the ending? Bad endings or no (And they weren't), ME3 was about putting the cap on the relationships you built and showing you the consequences of the actions you executed through the last 2 games.

What about it? It had its few moments, but overall it wasn't anything special...It lacked any real interaction that ME1 had. It was a glorified third person shooter with all its rpg guts almost completely removed. Almost all the conversations you have with your companions are reduced to just walking up to them and listening to them say whatever random line they say. There was hardly any traditional cutscene's involved with the companions...

Not to mention the game felt extremely rushed...It felt like they had so much more to explain and just cut it all out. The ending was pushed on you so quickly it felt empty. It had no gut to the story.


"ME2 was terrible." Thats garbage - what, because the inventory system was nerfed? Because of the planet scanning? What about the story and the game play Ransuu? You're the only person I've ever heard say ME2 was a bad game.

The story wasn't all that great in ME2... I love the ME series, but it went downhill fast after ME1. They just kept gutting content and turning it more into a shooter and less of an RPG. Rikuto pretty much explained why many fans disliked ME2 and ME3. I'm also far from being the only person to say ME2 was bad. Many original ME1 fans disliked ME2 for several reasons.


What the hell kind of take is that Ransuu - stop pushing BS.

Here a question you need to answer really fast - How does Grunts N7 mission end. Describe it to me so I can believe that you actually played this game.

He lived for me. He stayed behind to hold off the Rachni and tackled one off a ledge making it seem like he died. He came limping out of the cave covered in blood as Sheppard was getting ready to leave.

Happy?

Oh and I got the Rachni to join the fight as well.

Forgive me for not being a biodrone. ME2 and 3 were not terrible games on their own, but to me personally they were not good because they just were no longer ME games. They fixed some issues that ME1 had but they also stripped the games down to be less and less of an RPG between ME2 and ME3. Interaction was almost completely gone with ME3 outside the "big" cutscenes.

 

[Relius Starkiller]

ME1 scope was too large and the character development wasn't done well enough. They did a lot of things well but the only thing they did spectacularly were the party members.

ME2 stripped away the mako sections and introduced the planet scanning which was bullshit however the number of party members, the loyalty missions, the hubworlds you visited and the streamlined progression system more than made up for the lack of the Mako and the bloated inventory system.

ME3 struck the right balance between the spartan ME2 and the over stuffed ME1. You've got the best story telling of any of the three - Example: Garrus isn't always checking calibrations. Sometimes hes shooting the shit with Joker or James, sometimes hes talking to Dr Chaukaus, you can catch the guy in front of the memorial wall contemplating who you lost along the way.

After EVERY major encounter the crew has a take on the situation, they aren't waiting for level triggers anymore.

The enemies are much more diverse. You've got the husks (Who run you down) and the generic soldiers but you've got Brutes, Mechs, Geth Primes, Melee centric Phantoms, Sniping Nemeses and, oh yeah, the AI is better.Oh, and there are legitimate boss encounters.

The missions aren't what they used to be either (I.e go from point A to B) hold areas for periods of time, protect squad members and VIP's. There are turret sections, points where you get to drive an atlas, get away chases.

The new weapons are more diverse and now the customization is more than just for aesthetics.

ME3 took the best parts of the previous titles and added a lot of new ideas. Do I miss the Mako and the Hammerhead? You're damn right. Do I miss it enough to cry about it - no.

And for the people saying the From Ashes DLC was on the disc, I think parts of it were but at the same time it was a 700mb download. What happened was that they wanted to make the March 5th release date but what it came down to was timing and disc space. The Javik character wasn't even a thought until around January and, for those of us who play on console, the number of times you have to swap discs during the game should give you and idea of just how little space they had for the characters voice work (Which is mostly what the pack contained.).

Should they have charged for him - no, I didn't have to pay for Zaeed Misani in ME2 so why am I paying for a day 1 extra character? Its bullshit but I enjoyed the game enough that I'm willing to over look it.

 

[Relius Starkiller]

Forgive me for not being a biodrone. ME2 and 3 were not terrible games on their own, but to me personally they were not good because they just were no longer ME games. They fixed some issues that ME1 had but they also stripped the games down to be less and less of an RPG between ME2 and ME3. Interaction was almost completely gone with ME3 outside the "big" cutscenes.

Ok, you played.

I think we just have different ideas on what the game should have been and I don't think there is a correct way to play the game

For me the Quarians died, Tali died and Legion died. The Krogan and the Turians did join up as well as the Salarians but curing the Genophage shouldn't have been an easy choice for anyone - because once the war is over the Krogans are going to over populate the galaxy again and start another war, is that really worth having them on your side? They don't even have a space fleet!

I chose to play the game as if I'm the one making the choices and I don't restart when I don't get the outcome I wanted.

The interaction in ME 1 and 2 wasn't handled as well as it could have been. You never really knew when new dialogs and quests for the crew were going to be made available. Now, you knew that, at the conculsion of every major mission or most N7 encounters you'd get some new dialog from the crew.

I wasn't a big fan of walking up to Garrus, him saying "Shepard" and for the next two hours he'd have the same two or three dialog trees. ME3 constantly fed you personal interaction, ME2 and , especially, ME1 cannot say the same.

 

[Relius Starkiller]

Also to Rikuto's point about good games in the 90's - thats not true at all.

There were many examples of games experimenting with new gameplay and it not turning out as
well as anyone had hoped - Example, PSone era Final Fantasy.

Final Fantasy 7 Materia system.

FF8 = Draw System

FF9 = Job system

Further back?

Mortal Kombat

MK2

MK3U

MKT

MK4


How about more recently

Halo: CE

Halo 2

Halo 3

Sure Mario and Zelda didn't disappoint during the 90's but Crash Bandicoot, Bloody Roar, Sonic and so many others all began promisingly and fizzled out due to lack of creativity or over ambition.

Mass Effect is the greatest RPG series ever created - stop cock blockin G.

 

[x Sypher x]

You forgot Halo: Reach =

Lol I'm kidding. Although I wish I had extensive knowledge of those games you listed, cuz I'm sure at least a few of them would be arguable. Especially among their communities. But if there's a common ground then cool.

 

[Relius Starkiller]

Hey, remember the first time you heard this?

 

[Relius Starkiller]

AND I FINISHED THE GAME.

Ok, I went for the control ending. . . .I knew Shepard was going to eat it, that was the only way it could ever end.

And the way it was handled with the flash backs, I loved it.

THEN we flash to the relays being destroyed and as they are being destroyed a wave of energy is tailing the Normandy for some inexplicable reason. . .the ship crash lands on a forest planet. . .credits.

What. . .the . . .fuck.

Everything I said still stands about what happened in leading up to the ending being the most important part. . .however, I now see how Ransuu could be slinging the that kind of vitriol at the game - that ending is shit.

Why couldn't they give us a more detailed visual of what happened on the planet after his death?

Also, where is the really bad ending? ME2 had the "Everyone Dies" ending, where is that for this?

I. . .I think that as much as I love the game, I hate the ending but I love the series even more, its just a mother fucking shame that it ends in a sale pitch for more DLC.

I think their need to be able to offer DLC and maintain continuity while doing so helped to shape the ending that we got - hell, they went around telling everyone and their fucking mom that ME3 was a great place to pick up Mass Effect and that James Vega was, quote "an Entry point into the series for new players."

I didn't have an idea on how it would end exactly, I didn't know. . .but Jesus Christ, was that worth thinking about for almost FIVE YEARS.

I'm still going to restart the series and play through as a straight up renegade though, lots of choices and story nuggets I've missed over the years.

I give Mass Effect 3 a 9 and the series as a whole a 9.5. Greatest Trilogy of all time. . .worst ending imaginable.

 

[Relius Starkiller]

I have no mouth and I must scream.

 

[Relius Starkiller]

"TELL ME SOME MORE STORIES ABOUT THE SHEPARD!"

How does this old man even KNOW Shepard to be telling him stories about that time Shepard had a personal conversation with Samathan Traynor?

Look, really bad endings are fine, I was expecting Shepard to die. . .but Jesus, no writhe on his grave? No Krogan and Human children playing in a park on earth?

No rebuilding of the planet earth after the battle?

No "Reapers kill everything" and the only thing thats left is Liara's recordings of the events that lead up to the final showdown?

Where was Harbinger in all of this?

WHAT THE FUCK?

Now is where I get angry, if they try to nickle and dime me with DLC. . .I really think that unless Bioware fixes those endings they may have just put a dagger into the ME franchise.

Again, I love all three, I loved ME3 up until the end. . .but that end. My god. . .

 

[Raansu]

Can't say I didn't warn you to be ready for it.

 

[Relius Starkiller]

This was like the first relationship I ever had.

It started great, was great, ended quickly after I refused to meet her mom.

I wanted to meet your parents Mass Effect but you didn't let me!

 

[x Sypher x]

Lol XD

 

[Raansu]

Uhhh...What? And really? Vega is the lead character? That dude was completely uninteresting in ME3. And krogans look like something from evangelion...

 

[Relius Starkiller]

Bioware and EA are trying to sell me some shit.

I cannot believe they really did this - they made the ending the same for everyone so that they can expand on the universe. . .IN MASS EFFECT 2 ALL OF YOUR PARTY MEMBERS AND SHEPARD COULD DIE AND THEY STILL CAME OUT WITH A THIRD GAME!

Again, what they hell were they thinking?

 

[Relius Starkiller]

I'm going to use my PVR for something productive.

My problems with the end of Mass Effect are two fold.

A) There was not enough flashback time dedicated to what Shepard did leading up to the final moment that he died. They should have taken moments from throughout the series and worked them into the ending. Conversations, key events, relationships, ect.

B) The music that plays when the crew landed on the new planet - it strikes me more as "New Begining" and not " Hard Fought Victory." Again, this is the end of the Mass Effect franchise for me, there is not a next game, or book, or movie that I'm waiting for. They should have played the ME1 menu theme (I.e what is played for "Star Kid and Grandad") and as they were playing that theme the camera should have panned upwards into the stars.

God, I remember that fuck Casey Hudson talking about a Mass Effect MMO at one point. They think they just created a whole new universe? All they did was kill it for the ones who really gave a damn.

I cannot understate how much I enjoyed Mass Effect 3, I really loved it and I'm going to replay it again. However, there should have been multiple endings and if it comes in the form of DLC, then fine, I'll take it but after I get those new endings. . .IF I get those new endings, reguardless of their quality, they will not be getting another penny out of me.

Anyway, my plan is simple: Remix the ending of Mass Effect 3 and show those assholes as EA (This is no longer Bioware to me) that its not ok to shit on your fanbase - at least when Halo fucks you it has the common curtsey to give you a reach around (Halo: Reach)

 

[Relius Starkiller]

 

[Relius Starkiller]

Oh, look what I found!? BIOWARE FUCKING UP AGAIN!

WHY WAS THIS NOT IN THE GAME!?!

 

[Raansu]

Mass Effect MMO would be horrible...

 

[Raansu]

Oh, look what I found!? BIOWARE FUCKING UP AGAIN!

WHY WAS THIS NOT IN THE GAME!?!

That was >_> Sounded like there was a bit extra in there but I specifically remember this conversation right before Sheppard passes out.