Meaty Setups in DOA5U: Dealing with Wakeup Kicks

[Nereus]

I was testing to see whether i can find ways to get around wakeup kicks as whiff punishes and i came across this: The fact that you can ACTUALLY meaty the wakeup kicks. A " Meaty " setup (Popular in Street Fighter) is basically a setup that allows you to beat your opponents wakeup options depending on their wakeup and its properties. This can also be applied when dealing with crouch techs in SF4. This same method can be applied with DOA and its wakeup system. Now, with well-timed Attacks (Particularly midkicks) you can " Meaty " the wakeup kick and get a counter hit, into some good damage. I tested this out with Zack's and his and it turns out both versions work well. And the with Zack beats both low wakeup kicks AND medium wakeup kicks. I also tested this out with with Jann Lee and it also beats both Low wakeup kicks and mid wakeup kicks. Now the argument still stands: the fact that this may not be worth it due to the timing. Well, The same can be said about SF4 and its meaty setups, but people are still able to consistently pull it off, so why can't we? Try to see what you can find and post your discoveries here.
Get " Lifted " with Knowledge

 

[OolongTea]

I think this is well-known, Nereus.
Please correct me if I'm wrong, but the problem is that, in SF4, each character has a fixed time on the ground after a hard knockdown for example, it's always the same amount of frames. In DOA they can just lay on the ground for more frames as they wish before doing the wakeup kick and then there goes your setup.
It's very effective against mashers, tho

 

[Nereus]

I think this is well-known, Nereus.
Please correct me if I'm wrong, but the problem is that, in SF4, each character has a fixed time on the ground after a hard knockdown for example, it's always the same amount of frames. In DOA they can just lay on the ground for more frames as they wish before doing the wakeup kick and then there goes your setup.
It's very effective against mashers, tho

True, but each character gets up the exact same way when it comes to doing a midkick wakeup or a lowkick wakeup. And this is not counting special wakeups, we're talking just regular wakeup kicks. It doesn't necessarily mess up your ability to do it, but it does mess up the setup. So in conclusion, whether they do it delayed or not you can still " Meaty " or stuff the kick, the timing may just be a little different.

 

[StrikerSashi]

AE players don't actually time a lot of their setups. They whiff moves that take up certain amounts of time and then do the meaty as soon as possible afterwards so that the actual timing is negligeable. Ibuki can do 41236P 4MP j.HP for an easy safejump, for example. Thing about 2D games is that a lot of moves are active for 5-6 frames if not more (easily 8f), so you have a big window for meaties. Most 3D strikes like that are stuff like slow running/jumping kicks. Plus, the amount of delay possible on wake up kick in addition to this makes things a lot harder that it should be.

 

[Nereus]

AE players don't actually time a lot of their setups. They whiff moves that take up certain amounts of time and then do the meaty as soon as possible afterwards so that the actual timing is negligeable. Ibuki can do 41236P 4MP j.HP for an easy safejump, for example. Thing about 2D games is that a lot of moves are active for 5-6 frames if not more (easily 8f), so you have a big window for meaties. Most 3D strikes like that are stuff like slow running/jumping kicks. Plus, the amount of delay possible on wake up kick in addition to this makes things a lot harder that it should be.

The same method can be applied to DOA meaties also. For example, i do a 6T with Jann Lee, Dash , throw out a P, and then do 4K afterwards. If they decide to take forever to wakeup, i hit them with a 2P and force them to get up.

 

[MasterHavik]

Hmm...nice find with my boy Zack. How hard is the timing on stuff like this?

 

[Nereus]

Hmm...nice find with my boy Zack. How hard is the timing on stuff like this?

Its pretty difficult IMO. Not really worth trying though due to diff. wakeup timings. But if your opponent is constantly waking up... BAAM.

 

[MasterHavik]

Ah okay well you know any way to stop a wake up kick besides blocking or using certain moves to beat low ones.

 

[KidArk]

I stop wake up kicks with leon, two back dashes p+k fully charged T... profit.

 

[Yaguar]

Eliot has (whiff) as a pseudo-tech.
If they tech, you're at +frames post whiff, if they don't you get as a FT for +metricfucktonne.

This involves dropping the end of a combo post-launch though, quick example would be:
~ (whiff)