DOA5U Rig's Match-up Rating and Discussion

Crext

Well-Known Member
Standard Donor
EU
PSN ID
Crext
Howdy, thought we might start a discussion regarding Rig's match-ups and what you believe to be the case. Remember that this is just speculations based on 1 perhaps incomplete view at this time, but I'll still want to hear your opinions, so we could get some estimates up and running.

5 means equal, 6 means you win 6 of 4 if you are equally good, and 4 the other way around.

I'll give an example as I view things.

Rig vs
Akira
- 5
Alpha152 - 5
Ayane - 4 (Rig's disfavor)
Bass - 5
Bayman - 5
Brad - 6
Christie - 4
Eliot - 6
Gen Fu - 5
Hayate - 4
Helena - 4
Hitomi - 5
Jann - 5
Kasumi - 5
Kokoro - 5
Leifang - 4
Lisa - 5
Mila - 5
Pai - 4
Ryu - 5
Sarah - 4
Tina - 5
Zack - 5
New crew:
Rachel - 5
Ein - 5
Momiji - 4
Leon - 5
Jacky - 5

My experience is limited based on perhaps less than 10 meetings against some of the characters above (as an example Eliot is a rare gem).
So I'll admit straight off the bat that there is some match-ups here I'd want more practical testing with against more different people. I do not main Rig, so there will be some of you that are more experienced at this than me, and I am counting on you to speak your word.

In other words I don't feel like I am in a situation to judge the complete roster, and want a discussion going. What I bring forth is not perfect and I want you to correct me!

Here is the complete match-up rating discussion

Hoping for some good replies!
 
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Hades

Member
St. Louis
Main Character
Rig
Gamertag
xSA Hades
Rig vs
Akira
- 5
Alpha152 - 5
Ayane - 5/6
Bass - 7
Bayman - 4
Brad - 6
Christie - 3
Eliot - 5
Gen Fu - 5
Hayate - 6
Helena - 6
Hitomi - 4
Jann - 5
Kasumi - 5
Kokoro - 6
Leifang - 4
Lisa - 5
Mila - 5
Pai - 5
Ryu - 5
Sarah - 3
Tina - 6
Zack - 6
New crew:
Rachel - 5
Ein - 6
Momiji - 5
Leon - 5
Jacky - 5

OKAY (OMG HADES YOU TAKE FOREVER!!!)
I know. But I took time to breakdown EVERY matchup to a tee.
I'll post explanations for matches as requested
(or all of them if really wanted, but know that will take some time)
 
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Hades

Member
St. Louis
Main Character
Rig
Gamertag
xSA Hades
Why is Rig vs Ayane 5-5 or 6-4? I thought this would be in Ayane's favor?

Rig vs Bass 7-3? I don't think it that bad.

Rig vs Gen Fu 5-5?

Just curious about a few of these.
Rigs 66k, 66p, and 6kk4p are the main tools rig can use to counter-space Ayane. In this matchup Rig really needs to do a lot of baiting and punishing if the Ayane wants to space.
If Rig can catch her in a back turn stance he can punish her so hard for devastating damage. Also, spacing can be a danger for Ayane because she'll lock herself against a wall and Rig can just jail her.

Rig Bass is 7-3 because Rig beats Bass in every way, literally Bass players are just forced to mash holds because there is no other option. Bass has nothing to get out of Rig stance mixup. He has nothing that can really just beat his 6kk and Bass can't outspace rig.

I feel with Rig/Gen Fu its a very "Whoever gets the starting pressure wins". Yes, Gen Fu can parry some of the things in Rigs stance pressure, however with 2k now being a stun it makes it much easier to blow people up for trying to just parry their way out of the situation.
 
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Allan Paris

Well-Known Member
Rig vs
Ayane
- 5/6
Kasumi - 5
Pai - 5
I am curious to know your specific information on these match ups. I don't want to wait forever to get a response on them so I only want to know these 3 for now. I have many more questions on quite a few of them you listed.

I can tell you that I am certain Ayane is 6-4'ing him. I know there are more Rig players than Hoodless but he is pretty solid with the character. I have very limited knowledge with using Ayane and there isn't much that Rig can do to her once the fight opens up. Just the basic things that Ayane does gives Rig issues, her spacing, crushes, whiff punishment. These are the only things that entail my use of Ayane.

With Kasumi I know for a fact that she is 6-4'ing him and Pai is doing the same. For both characters, they can poke him in between 2 of the strings that Rig revolves around for pressure, PP and 6KK into any attack follow up. From PP the only attack that can't be interrupted with a poke is his mid kick follow up. Though both characters excel at holding mid so you can't keep nailing them with it to stop them from poking in between the string.

When you are outside of his Bending Stance the only way for you to pick up frame advantage is from going high. Pai is solid at crushing, and Kasumi is not as strong as Pai when it comes to crushing but she has a couple options that serve her enough justice to hold him up. Even when he gets to his Bending Stance it's damn near impossible for him or any character for that matter to frame trap Kasumi or Pai with +1. So his frame traps are not viable against them the moment they block the flowing the attack that is being used to frame trap. Yes, you can mix in a throw but that throw just so happens to be a 12i throw in his Bending Stance and at high level play that throw will not be as big of a factor as most think it is.

For Kasumi, not only is she beating him out she also has two sets of parries at her defense. I have come to find out that when she parries if she doesn't have enough frame advantaged to launch you for free she has enough advantage to where you can't hit a button.

There is even a weird case in which the game says she's at a disadvantage but when buttons are hit she wins when she shouldn't. I have to keep looking into that one because I am not sure if that goes all across the board for all characters.

For Pai, she picks up the same frame advantage that he gets from poking (+1) or she is at neutral, so he is forced to read her because hitting a button or counter poking is not happening. She locks down the neutral game up close, so you have to keep the fight at a mid to long range game.

I would really like to sit and play all Rig players in a drawn out session, the more players the better to truly see what's going on. I play Hoodless religiously and he does well but when facing these particular 3 I can clearly see him struggle. Maybe that's just him, I still want to hear what you have on the character for these match ups, Hades.
 

Hades

Member
St. Louis
Main Character
Rig
Gamertag
xSA Hades
@Allan Paris This is coming from my personal experience (and I play against Ayane on a regular basis, Snipe xx2 is one of my most common sparring partners, granted he plays a very rushdown Ayane but I also play Sir Skeleton from time to time.) But from what I've seen is that Ayane is very hard to an extent with against Rig because she can outspace him, and she has better tools when It comes to getting in. What I've experienced with Ayane is that if they try to space out against me its easier to jail them against the wall which is hard for ayane to get out of (And to my knowledge the only "Jailing" rigs I've seen are myself and Jeager, I haven't really seen to much of hoodless though but from what I remember he plays a very mixup based rig.) The one tool I feel that might make this a 6-4 Ayane would be her Back stance 4H+K. Rig really has no answer to that. But what I also see is that Rig has some of the most devastating back punishes (i.e 6kk4p 4p 33k. 6p2k 6k 33k etc.) So if he can catch her back turned he can blow her up tremendously.

Kasumi, I can see where your coming from with that one as well, and I actually can see how it is a 6-4. I might look more at that later. My theory going into most of that is Rig can blow up characters with parries quite easily. From what I remember when dissecting that matchup was that Kasumi had a hard time getting out of the stance mixup, but she also does her 1p so I don't know. I will probably talk to xSA NightSakura later and see what he thinks cuz I did most of this work by myself with no one elses input.


Pai, I actually literally meant to hit 4 but I guess I tapped 5. lol.
 
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Allan Paris

Well-Known Member
Yeah, when I play Hoodless he will run up and try to catch her BT while she is spinning, that doesn't work out too well from him though. That is risky because she can attack from her Hajin Roll. So that's honestly a 50/50 there because you are not guaranteed to hit her how you want. Your options don't completely negate her Haijin Roll and that can't put him above her because of that. I know those guys, I haven't played snipe in forever but Skeleton I catch here and there.

When you decide to rush-down Skeleton how does that work out for you? Do you get blown up more often then not or do you catch him BT more than he hits you?

4H+K is unsafe with Ayane, just block it and go to work on her. How exactly are you jailing her because now that I think about she has 12i low jab the same as Kasumi and Pai, and you can't jail them because of that and their other pokes/crushes but the 12i low jab is one the pokes that's in their arsenal to spot the jailing. Since Ayane shares that with them I don't know how you are jailing her.

How is Rig blowing up a character with a Parry? Would he blow up Gen Fu as well? I am curious as to know what tools he has to blow up Parries besides throwing which everyone can do. I don't know who are playing against but they must be miss using them, no offense to them. Nahh, she has no issue with getting him out of it, I believed she did at first but once I sat down with the numbers and saw what was going on, she can fluently keep him from going it as well keeping him out of it so he can't loop her into anything. I'm not saying Bending Stance is completely useless against her but he can't go nuts in it like he would against another character that can't deal with it.

No need talk about anything, lets play. Too much talking is being done. I'm on the Ps3 and Xbl let me know what's up. The only issue will be internet connections and I hope it is solid enough to get some games in.
 

UncleKitchener

Well-Known Member
Standard Donor
I play both Bass and Rig and I won't rate this MU that low for Bass or that high for Rig.

One major weakness of Rig is that he can be crushed or SS more frequently than others and Bass has two good crushes that can eliminate the turns or flamingo with :2::P::P: and :1::P:. :1::P: is pretty much the momentum shift he needs and :2::P::P: on CH will stun and combo and is hard to react to for most if not everyone. His pokes at mid range are also very good against Rig. One very good poke Rig has is :6::6::P: while Bass' answer to that or pretty much most things at mid-range that don't have crazy crush or SS properties is :3::K:.

:P::+::K: is also the answer to most things against Rig outside of flamingo, unless it's :1::P: or FLG :2::h::+::K:.

Bass is also very good at throw punishment and if you do a lot of things outside of FLG, the momentum is going to shift immediately, but even in flamingo you're not invincible if you want to keep your frame advantage.

For Bass, anything -3 or more is a good sign to start pressing buttons again and the new :41236::P::+::K: is a good crush.

These two are very much good at what they do, but each can easily punish the other. It's not like the Brad or Christie matchup where he has to completely change his playstyle.

5-5 at best 6-3 at worst.
 

TOMA SAN

Well-Known Member
Standard Donor
PARIS
Main Character
Rig
PSN ID
l-Toma-San-l
i see you forget one thing really important guy and i see one thing very important against RIG !!
if you see your match up just in a normal stage (like a ring) its ok but dont forget !!! in home RIG kill ayane !! and lot of character !! if you know the right way to play rig at home stage or at temple of dragon ;)

look your environment is the key to break bad match up
 
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