System What's the science behind beating wake up kicks?

WAZAAAAA

Well-Known Member
It's based on the wuk and incoming attack data.
If the wuk is active before the incoming attack the wuk will win. If the incoming strike is active too early (1 our 2 frames after the strike final active frames but before the wuk active frames) the wuk will win.

This is where it gets interesting (not at console atm so I might get numbers wrong). Assuming all wuks deal 20 damage (give or take 1 or 2 points because I'm not running through all characters to find out) all you have to do is make the active frames of a strike match the active frames of the wuk and the strike needs to deal 20 damage to trade or 21 points or more to win. Based on whether you win or not you will also either beat out or get beaten out as either a Counter hit or Hi Counter hit, I believe you will get Hi Counter if you match the first active frames of both strikes but the wuk only gets a HCH if the opponent was throwing.

So all it boils down to is:
Does your strike deal more than 20 damage and did you match the active frames?
I do believe the strike needs to be either mid or low as well because the wuk is considered to be in a crouching position.

You are going to see more strikes beating out wuks from Super Heavies and slower characters primarily because the SHs don't actually have many strikes that deal less than 20 points of damage and the slower characters have more access to stronger strikes than characters that are i10 high strike or faster without serious dedicating and risk coming from them.
High strikes can beat a mid WUK, here's an easy example with Jann Lee vs Kasumi (or anyone else) on midK set as com reaction: 9KK 9P 8K.
Asides from that, great post, it's still a weird mechanic but it makes much more sense now, thank you.
 

Lulu

Well-Known Member
High strikes can beat a mid WUK, here's an easy example with Jann Lee vs Kasumi (or anyone else) on midK set as com reaction: 9KK 9P 8K.
Asides from that, great post, it's still a weird mechanic but it makes much more sense now, thank you.

And now you have the secret formula for ruining friendships in DoA. ;) go crazy with it.
 

WAZAAAAA

Well-Known Member
nice and simple explanation from the developers themselves through an old changelog
Revised hit detection for rising kicks. When rising kicks and strikes hit at the same time, rising kicks now lose to strikes if the strike causes higher damage.
起き上がりキックの当たり判定を見直し、ダメージがより大きな打撃と相打ちしたときに、起き上がりキックが負けるように変更。


TL;DR wake up kick active frames no longer invincible, so they can be beaten in trades like normal strikes if you outdamage them
 
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