The Official Dead or Alive 5 Tier List with Discussion thread
- Thread starter Matt Ponton
- Start date
Based on the current in progress match-up chart, here are the current tiers:
May 19, 2013 6:48 AM (GMT - 5)
S: Leifang, Ayane, Kasumi, Christie, Sarah
A: Akira, Jann Lee, ALPHA-152, Lisa, Pai
B: Brad Wong, Gen Fu, Helena, Mila, Hayabusa, Bayman, Hayate, Hitomi
C: Kokoro, Rig, Tina, Zack, Bass, Eliot
May 19, 2013 6:48 AM (GMT - 5)
S: Leifang, Ayane, Kasumi, Christie, Sarah
A: Akira, Jann Lee, ALPHA-152, Lisa, Pai
B: Brad Wong, Gen Fu, Helena, Mila, Hayabusa, Bayman, Hayate, Hitomi
C: Kokoro, Rig, Tina, Zack, Bass, Eliot
P1naatt1ke1tt0
Active Member
Is that B-tier Rig possibly supposed to be Hitomi?
Yes, it is. He must have accidentally typed 'Rig' instead. Hitomi and Hayate are both tied with a score of 111. There are actually numerous other characters who are tied as well.
Kokoro's matchups
Akira 5-5: Akira are very much even. They both suffer from the same problem of being linear and they can both go ham on each other. Not much to comment on.
Alpha 5-5: Alpha has the speed advantage, but the lack of a good wake up means that Kokoro can really rush her down. The the momentum of this match can shift very quickly in either character's favor.
Ayane 5-5: Ayane controls space very well, but Kokoro can quickly find her way in if she plays it right and is patient enough. The match up is skewed in Kokoro's favor if the two are playing on a level without open space like home. It is a matchup I struggle in from time to time, but I think that is a personal problem.
Bass 6-4: Kokoro really has no problem in this match up. Her overwhelming pressure makes it so that Bass has to respect her. Downside is that she loses a bit of damage from her juggles, but she can still keep the pressure up if she ends her combos with PP2KK. She can also space Bass out if she so chooses.
Bayman 4.5-5.5: This match up isn't as bad as you would think. While it is still a disadvantage for her she can still bait tank roll with the proper strings. Bayman can't tank grab her out of stance cancel 2P, 2H+KK(and strings that end in that), 3K2P(and strings that end in that) etc. Kokoro is also faster than Bayman and can keep him from getting anything started if played carefully enough.
Brad 4-6: Brad Wong has the advantage since he can crush her and evade her very well. Although I'm starting to lean towards this being 5-5. I have a lot of experience in this match up from Chosen 1, and can see that while Brad Wong can crush her and SS her, she also has such a speed advantage over him that it kind of evens out. If you position your self correctly and properly react to his shenanigans then it isn't too bad honestly. Brad is also a pretty predictable character too when you know him. So yeah I can see this match up evolving as more and more people figure out Brad Wong.
Eliot 5-5: A weaker Gen Fu that plays a less effective string delay game. Kokoro doesn't really have any thing that would make it a disadvantage for Eliot though.
Gen Fu 5-5: This is a pretty tricky match up to call, but honestly as annoying as Gen Fu is he isn't nearly as annoying to deal with offline. His strings are very holdable and side steppable even for Kokoro. The loss of 3P+K from DOA4 makes it so that he can't get you off of him. Went over this match up quite a bit with PL.
Hayate 6-4: They are pretty even at mid-screen, Kokoro has the advantage up close.
Helena : Another tricky match up to call. Kokoro wins the full screen and mid screen game because of her superior pokes, but Helena can shift the momentum very easily with a touch. Kokoro has good rush down, but doesn't do it as well as Helena. I can definitely see the match up being either 5-5, 6-4 Kokoro, or even 6-4 Helena. Not sure yet.
Hitomi 4-6: Hitomi has better space control, great up close tools and a really annoying punch parry. Every time Kokoro follows up Hitomi's disadvantage it is a risk. Kokoro also doesn't have anything to get Hitomi off of her outside of a regular hold.
Jann Lee 4-6: He's good at the very beginning of the match, up close, from distance, and he can step her very easily. Pretty obvious advantages over Kokoro that don't require much explaining.
Kasumi 5-5: Her advantage in this match is at the very beginning, because of her speed, but manage to get out by either crushing her, or holding her then Kokoro is at the advantage. Kasumi has to try her butt off to get back in. Just keep the match mid to full screen until you get a hit and then stay on her.
Leifang 4-6: Decent mid screen game, parries, great holds, and tracking. One of Kokoro's main launches is a mid kick which we all know Leifang blows up big time. The match up is pretty annoying.
Lisa 5-5: She is annoying, but neither character has anything that gives them an advantage.
Mila 5-5: I think this match up was worse pre-patch, but slowing down her SS tackle actually helps Kokoro out. Mila's mid screen game is very predictable, and Kokoro can really rush her down without having to worry about that sidestep as much. Mila still has a solid ground game and decent damage though.
Pai 6-4: Pai has decent offense, but what tips the match in Kokoro's favor is the damage difference as well as Kokoro's pokes midscreen.
Rig 6-4: I don't know anything about this character and still don't have much problem with him.
Ryu 5-5: Only experience I have in this matchup is against MASTER and I have to say that Ryu doesn't anything that makes the match scary outside of Izuna.
Zack 6-4: Zack sucks >_>
Akira 5-5: Akira are very much even. They both suffer from the same problem of being linear and they can both go ham on each other. Not much to comment on.
Alpha 5-5: Alpha has the speed advantage, but the lack of a good wake up means that Kokoro can really rush her down. The the momentum of this match can shift very quickly in either character's favor.
Ayane 5-5: Ayane controls space very well, but Kokoro can quickly find her way in if she plays it right and is patient enough. The match up is skewed in Kokoro's favor if the two are playing on a level without open space like home. It is a matchup I struggle in from time to time, but I think that is a personal problem.
Bass 6-4: Kokoro really has no problem in this match up. Her overwhelming pressure makes it so that Bass has to respect her. Downside is that she loses a bit of damage from her juggles, but she can still keep the pressure up if she ends her combos with PP2KK. She can also space Bass out if she so chooses.
Bayman 4.5-5.5: This match up isn't as bad as you would think. While it is still a disadvantage for her she can still bait tank roll with the proper strings. Bayman can't tank grab her out of stance cancel 2P, 2H+KK(and strings that end in that), 3K2P(and strings that end in that) etc. Kokoro is also faster than Bayman and can keep him from getting anything started if played carefully enough.
Brad 4-6: Brad Wong has the advantage since he can crush her and evade her very well. Although I'm starting to lean towards this being 5-5. I have a lot of experience in this match up from Chosen 1, and can see that while Brad Wong can crush her and SS her, she also has such a speed advantage over him that it kind of evens out. If you position your self correctly and properly react to his shenanigans then it isn't too bad honestly. Brad is also a pretty predictable character too when you know him. So yeah I can see this match up evolving as more and more people figure out Brad Wong.
Eliot 5-5: A weaker Gen Fu that plays a less effective string delay game. Kokoro doesn't really have any thing that would make it a disadvantage for Eliot though.
Gen Fu 5-5: This is a pretty tricky match up to call, but honestly as annoying as Gen Fu is he isn't nearly as annoying to deal with offline. His strings are very holdable and side steppable even for Kokoro. The loss of 3P+K from DOA4 makes it so that he can't get you off of him. Went over this match up quite a bit with PL.
Hayate 6-4: They are pretty even at mid-screen, Kokoro has the advantage up close.
Helena : Another tricky match up to call. Kokoro wins the full screen and mid screen game because of her superior pokes, but Helena can shift the momentum very easily with a touch. Kokoro has good rush down, but doesn't do it as well as Helena. I can definitely see the match up being either 5-5, 6-4 Kokoro, or even 6-4 Helena. Not sure yet.
Hitomi 4-6: Hitomi has better space control, great up close tools and a really annoying punch parry. Every time Kokoro follows up Hitomi's disadvantage it is a risk. Kokoro also doesn't have anything to get Hitomi off of her outside of a regular hold.
Jann Lee 4-6: He's good at the very beginning of the match, up close, from distance, and he can step her very easily. Pretty obvious advantages over Kokoro that don't require much explaining.
Kasumi 5-5: Her advantage in this match is at the very beginning, because of her speed, but manage to get out by either crushing her, or holding her then Kokoro is at the advantage. Kasumi has to try her butt off to get back in. Just keep the match mid to full screen until you get a hit and then stay on her.
Leifang 4-6: Decent mid screen game, parries, great holds, and tracking. One of Kokoro's main launches is a mid kick which we all know Leifang blows up big time. The match up is pretty annoying.
Lisa 5-5: She is annoying, but neither character has anything that gives them an advantage.
Mila 5-5: I think this match up was worse pre-patch, but slowing down her SS tackle actually helps Kokoro out. Mila's mid screen game is very predictable, and Kokoro can really rush her down without having to worry about that sidestep as much. Mila still has a solid ground game and decent damage though.
Pai 6-4: Pai has decent offense, but what tips the match in Kokoro's favor is the damage difference as well as Kokoro's pokes midscreen.
Rig 6-4: I don't know anything about this character and still don't have much problem with him.
Ryu 5-5: Only experience I have in this matchup is against MASTER and I have to say that Ryu doesn't anything that makes the match scary outside of Izuna.
Zack 6-4: Zack sucks >_>
FlamingMuffin
Active Member
I can agree with those Kokoro matchups, although I feel Hayate to be 5-5 (strong throw punishment, lots of crushing potential and 8P+K).
I bait shit like 8P+K and punish.
NightAntilli
Well-Known Member
Blackburry I see you very wisely avoided mentioning Christie xD
jelly senpai
Member
I still don't believe Kasumi is an S, compared to the others in that tier.
Please provide some of her disadvantaged matchups then.
Based on the current in progress match-up chart, here are the current tiers:
May 20, 2013 10:42 AM (GMT - 5)
S: Leifang, Ayane, Kasumi, Christie, Sarah
A: Akira, Jann Lee, ALPHA-152, Lisa
B: Brad Wong, Helena, Mila, Pai, Hayabusa, Gen Fu, Kokoro, Hitomi, Bayman, Hayate
C: Rig, Tina, Zack, Bass, Eliot
Gen Fu in the lower half? That can't be right. We need some Gen Fu players in here.
Pocky Yoshi
Active Member
Pardon my noob question since this concerns me, but is the match-up from Kokoro to Christie that bad for Kokoro? Or is it good? I'm curious because I take an obsessive interest in knowing my good and bad match-ups with Kokoro.
Fortunately, I can somewhat understand the game language lingo and stuff since it's similar to SCV game language despite being nooby at DOA5. Pardon my intrusion.
DontForkWitMe
Well-Known Member
similar to eliot she has no answer for christies jak stance( her high crushing sidestep move) which evades every offensive option they have available and cripples them severely in the matchup. the only surefire way to hit her out of it is with a mid/low tracking move which retardedly neither kokoro or eliot have
I always had a question about that. Can command sidesteps like Christie's and Hayate's be thrown for HiCounter like a normal sidestep, or do they function more like standard attacks and beat out throws? I always assumed the latter, but it would be good to know for sure.
It actually can avoid some mids as well... sucks.
Command side steps are Counter Thrown, not Hi-counter Thrown. But yes, if the opponent does not initiate an attack yet from the string then the throw can potentially land and deal Counter Throw damage. However, there are small cases where the side step is evasive to the point where the throw actually won't track, and if you miss time the throw you end up getting Hi-counter hit because you decided to try throwing in the middle of them performing a string.
Interesting. I guess that would involve individual testing in the training room.
Thanks for the heads up.
Also Christie's command SS leaves her in crouch which means it evades standing throws. You would have to low throw her out of it if you are going to attempt to throw her.
Interesting. Normal SS crushes highs but can be caught by standing throws. Thanks for the info.