What should a person coming from other competitive 3d fighters expect that's different in DOA?

[RoboJoe]

How do you apply ground game pressure when you have to wait for the wake-up kick? If we find a universal way around all wake-up kicks, then you can apply pressure, but if you have to wait for the attack to counter/evade, you're not really applying pressure. At least not compared to how one would apply ground pressure in SC or Tekken. And with the forced tech setup from DOA4 now gone, there isn't much benefit to the ground game as of yet.

So what can you do after a knockdown. It seems like a waste if you have to just stand there waiting for them to get up.

 

[DrDogg]

So what can you do after a knockdown. It seems like a waste if you have to just stand there waiting for them to get up.

That's more of a question for VPai since he seems to already have something in mind.

However, from my point of view, if we find some tech that allows you to avoid both wake-up kicks and it's safe if the opponent doesn't use a wake-up kick, then that will be your option. If there are only options that beat one wake-up kick, then you'll have to guess if you want to block/counter or just use that one option. Judging by the E3 build, I'm guessing every character should have a way around at least one wake-up kick.

If there isn't a safe option to avoid the wake-up kicks, I'll probably try to counter on-reaction (not all that difficult if you ask me), or just back away and let them get up. This is one of the reasons why I like the DOA2U wall game, because if you slammed someone against the wall, they could no longer use a wake-up kick, so you could apply pressure all you wanted.

 

[Einzelkind]

I thought you couldn't do a wake-up kick after wall damage in 5 either. Or did they change that again?

 

[MasterHavik]

Can you still crush low wake up kicks?

 

[virtuaPAI]

Well its not universal. Characters with uramawari techniques, can jump or evade both wake up kicks and get back turned advantage+combo. Also will force the character to get up(not sure if it changed with Doa5) and you can continue your offence.

 

[DrDogg]

Well its not universal. Characters with uramawari techniques, can jump or evade both wake up kicks and get back turned advantage+combo. Also will force the character to get up(not sure if it changed with Doa5) and you can continue your offence.

You can't do this on-reaction though, and in most cases if the opponent doesn't use a wake-up kick and you go for this, you're at a disadvantage.

Also, grounded attacks aren't always guaranteed. Depends on the knockdown. More often than not an opponent can tech roll before you can connect with a grounded attack.

 

[virtuaPAI]

You can't do this on-reaction though, and in most cases if the opponent doesn't use a wake-up kick and you go for this, you're at a disadvantage.

Also, grounded attacks aren't always guaranteed. Depends on the knockdown. More often than not an opponent can tech roll before you can connect with a grounded attack.

-I was able to pull it off in other Doa's without too much of a problem, but i'm not exactly sure how uramawari will work in Doa5. Yes, ground attacks are guaranteed against slamming attacks(those that do not cause a bounce), and if your opponent techroll during a techable situation, you can still apply pressure because you still have the advantage.

 

[DrDogg]

-I was able to pull it off in other Doa's without too much of a problem, but i'm not exactly sure how uramawari will work in Doa5. Yes, ground attacks are guaranteed against slamming attacks(those that do not cause a bounce), and if your opponent techroll during a techable situation, you can still apply pressure because you still have the advantage.

In other DOA games you can wait for an opponent to use a wake-up kick, then do whatever attack beats out the wake-up kick? Sorry, I just don't see that happening. You have to be on point to counter a wake-up kick on-reaction, I can't see you using a 15-20 frame attack to beat out the wake-up kick without starting the attack before you see the wake-up kick.

Having advantage after a tech roll is situational. It's definitely not a universal truth.

 

[virtuaPAI]

In other DOA games you can wait for an opponent to use a wake-up kick, then do whatever attack beats out the wake-up kick? Sorry, I just don't see that happening. You have to be on point to counter a wake-up kick on-reaction, I can't see you using a 15-20 frame attack to beat out the wake-up kick without starting the attack before you see the wake-up kick.

Having advantage after a tech roll is situational. It's definitely not a universal truth.

-Well, It did happen in other Doa's, and it worked quite well. http://www.freestepdodge.com/threads/rising-attack-interrupts.27/

 

[DrDogg]

-Well, It did happen in other Doa's, and it worked quite well. http://www.freestepdodge.com/threads/rising-attack-interrupts.27/

I'm not saying you can't interrupt/evade a wake-up kick. That is not what I'm questioning. I'm questioning your ability to do it AFTER you have confirmed the opponent is going to do a wake-up kick.

 

[virtuaPAI]

I'm not saying you can't interrupt/evade a wake-up kick. That is not what I'm questioning. I'm questioning your ability to do it AFTER you have confirmed the opponent is going to do a wake-up kick.

-Well me just telling you that it was possible doesn't seem to suffice. When I meet up with Sorwah, I will make a demonstration of it in Doa3.1. Hopefully this technique will transfer over to Doa5!

 

[Baron West]

Hi there. I'm asking this because I'm interested in the game some , though haven't paid much attention to it with all the Tekken hype and VF coming out. I wasn't thinking about hitting this seriously until a bunch of friends were also getting this.

My question is this, might be too general and is a flat-out noob question, but here it goes:

What are the big fundamental gameplay differences between high-level VF and high-level DOA?

What sort of things will I have to get out of my head in terms of VF fundamentals, and what fundamentalists will translate well?

Is the execution easier or harder?

Big Fundamental differences?

Wake-ups aren't as intense in DOA compared to other 3-D fighters. Getting KD in DOA isn't nearly as scary as it is in Tekken.

Command throws can't be broken. Multi-throws can be escaped, but not being able to break command throws is a pretty huge difference for most people. I been playing DOA a while, and I still try input non-existent throw escapes. Throws are very, very, very strong in DOA.

Over 90% of the moves in the game are unsafe on block, and can be punished with the unescapable throws I just mentioned. If the VF frame data is consistent as I imagine it will be, then VF characters will probably have more moves that give +frames than DOA characters. However, if you are used to playing VF, be prepared to get throw punished by moves you used to think were safe.

Every character has holds. Which means even the best strikes can't be thrown out predictably. Bottom tier characters in DOA have a better chance of winning against top tiers compared to other 3-D fighting games, except Bloody Roar.

There are no side throws in DOA, and back throws usually do pretty minimal damage. The side stepping will probably take a little time to adjust to.

Crouch dashing in DOA is similar to VF crouch dashing.

Despite the flashiness, DOA isn't as fast paced as VF. But I don't think any 3-D fighting game is.

DOA has this funky little thing called a 180 free step dodge. Not sure if someone mentioned it already.

Strings can be delayed. More so than any other 3-D fighting game.

DOA characters with special movements tend to be a lot more evasive than VF characters. Ayane, Christie, and Helena players who know how to maximize on their movement might take some adjustment to deal with.

Lots of moves can send you flying towards the wall/cliff. VF moves don't really have that kind of knockback.

Execution is a lot easier, and characters are easy to pick-up, especially coming from a VF background.