Free Step Dodge

DOA5's SS wasn't fine, but neither is DOA6's.
Using one to justify the other is bonkers.

these people will cry semen if they ever play VF and get hit with one of those deep dick punish combos from one of those killers.

@Brute You are right, though I still think the consequences in 5 for trying to avoid something is far greater than in 6. You can lose 40% of your health for being placed in stun again in 5 from trying to step strings and then forced to guess and hold what's the next to come, only to be wrong on each of those attacks once more because of the very first mistake that shouldn't be a mistake.

Course the post wasn't towards yours in that sense, but more direct to the people who still felt DOA5 was great in that department which wasn't at all.

DOA6 comes out and suddenly ppl got amnesia when it comes to properly punishing sidesteps, but half these mf's never had to think about sidesteps because they were too busy mashing retracking strings in doa5, so you can't exactly blame 'em

I'm all for a strong SS as long as every character gets fast tracking moves to deal with it. Right now every scrub out there abuses it like their mama's life depends on it.

I don't think speed has any thing to do with, an i5 throw to a 23 frame high will punish SS reliably, i think a better solution would be making sure that every character has a variety of tools to punish SS. because you have characters like Nyo who have anti SS tools out the wazoo (a safe tracking mid, tracking highs that are mad plus on block or have follow ups, and a tracking sweep with a high low mix up at the end)

Nyo has no problem denying SS while also enforcing her gameplan, but then you have characters like Kokoro and Marie who have only 2 tracking moves (the standard S attack which is unsafe and a high, and a mid kick that has no follow up) so countering SS is a much bigger commitment for them, almost too much. so have the powerful SS, but make sure everyone can deal with in a way that doesn't halt their gameplan

Every character needs fast tracking moves that they can incorporate in their mixups to make mfs think twice before doing a SS; otherwise you have to always free cancel, wait for the SS and punish with a throw which is boring af. Try playing that Gen Fu wannabe character in this shit.

@ me when DOA gets a good SS period.

And an other thing that is complete horse shit regarding the new SS is you can do it and evade 9f jabs after moves up to about -9 on block. Let's say you throw punish unsafe moves and deal this way with the SS done after them. But what do you do against safe negative moves? Risk getting stunned by doing a slow tracking move or a throw or risk getting SSAed trying to counter strike with a fast linear move?

You should not be able to SS if you're negative.

You were always able to step at light disadvantages though. Same with Tekken light negatives, same with VF etc.

It's just the problem with evasion which TN decided to add more invulnerabilities to it instead (no idea why TN went with that route). TN heard the pleas regarding the step but they took a different approach than what people thought it would be (which I can't exactly blame people for it).

Maybe TN could of just reduced the homing from each character in 5? probably, but there's over 100+ moves in DOA and adjusting each one of them to not home seems pretty time consuming I guess.

Still, we can't go back to DOA5 stepping because it's terrible, so hopefully TN makes some of adjustment to where you don't get hit by linear strings even from startup-mid string while keeping community positive.

As previously mentioned, making sidestep have start up b4 they become invincible to linear attacks is not a terrible idea. Tekken does this where the sidestep has start up frames (in fact I think every defensive technique in tekken has start up, minus armor and blocking) so if you're minus and you sidestep you can still get hit with non tracking moves if the move is fast enough.

0 frame defensive techniques (sidesteps, holds, crushes) being altered to have start up could be the sweetspot we need, although I think it would make striking based gameplay even more powerful, but then you just introduce throw breaks so you dont get killed for holding the block button

Exactly; side steps should be fast enough to evade i9 jabs in neutral and slow enough to not be able to evade the jabs if you're -1 or over on block. I'd be cool with an i9 SS.

i9 might be a bit too much, you want to lower it's effectiveness not make it useless, i'd say i4 to i6, that way if your offence is tight enough and your character is fast enough you should be able to have unstepabble offence, slower characters can still get stepped but most characters that are slower (bass, brad, helena, nyo, etc) tend to be good for tracking moves so no problem for them

You guys might be on the opposite of the spectrum.

You were always able to step during light disadvantages even from other fighting games. You are allowed to because you are safe with the exception of an unsafety situation.

The thing with DOA is that players were stuffing out people who step even from abare which clashes in itself. Opponents were rewarded while at disadvantage slapping people that stepped which isn't exactly how it goes lol.