Free Step Dodge

Like I said before. I feel personally that thes moves really don't belong here. But it adds another level of skill into the mix. Being the combo heavy game that DOA now is. It's almost necessary.

A CB will not connect at +17 unless you whiff a hold. CB's start at i19. There's a little thing called Slow Escaping that heavily reduces the effectiveness of trying to connect a CB after an insufficient amount of stun threshold frame advantage. CB's can be challenging to connect on stalwart opponents.

They won't connect at +17...

What do you guys mean when you say CB wont't connect at +17?

It means that a CB is i20 (or sometimes i19), meaning that you would have to create a stun that gave you at least 22 (or 21) frames of advantage in order to have it connect. Otherwise, the stun will end before the CB can connect.

I should have mentioned that what I mean with a +20 CB is that I would like CB to only cause the special effect once the threshold is at +20. Right now it happens when you do +17 damage in a stun.

I don't think that change would do much, really. The issue with CB->PB/PL has far more to do with PBs and PLs, and PBs particularly are just stupid and need to go.

So even if I don't bother slow escaping it wont connect?

Hands down for PB. I liked when I first saw them in the alpha demo, but I started to dislike them after the first week.
Only a few of them are cool. But the rest are just meh.

@Fiend Busa It won't unless the stun last for more than 19-21 frames.

Visuals aside (which I personally dislike, but that's subjective), they are a pretty terrible gameplay mechanic (particularly regarding neutral, though I'm not a fan of CB->PB either).

Care to elaborate? I would like to hear your opinion about this.

PB's are fine from what I've seen since like CB, they can be held pretty easily compared to YOLO supers in games like SF4 or SCV. I kinda wish they weren't treated as comeback mechanics however. PL's feel unnecessary however.

Well, for some characters they are rather potent spacing tools. With their high-damage properties they tend to overpower any same-frame collisions and take priority, even negating certain properties to go into full effect (for example, they ignore the "jumping" status on certain attacks for the full-damage animation). They're GBs with significant advantage, and can be canceled

for some rather nasty mix-ups (considering the penalty you receive for getting lobbed by one, on hit or on guard). Some also have tricky collision properties, crushing attacks and even connecting on opponents who are rather far away. This is all on top of them netting huge damage and then sending you flying into stage hazards.

Then you account for the fact that they are a goofy "comeback" mechanic, that rewards players for getting knocked around a bit before they gain their momentum, and it just seems like an absurd quality to award.

This is of course not even considering what they can do in stun, after a Cb or in ceiling stages.

For the most part I see what you mean, though PB's can only connect once per round and the character must have below 50% health. I do agree that PB's shouldn't have crushing properties despite them being rather slow.

I already addressed the health bit, which I believe actually makes them even stupider. Thank God they can only be used once per round. If you played the Alpha demo, you'll remember that that wasn't always a feature.

I don't really have a problem with CB's. The real problem is power blows (and launchers but only because they look stupid). Rachel for example has an overpowered PB.

Some PLs are pretty stupid, as well. Mila gets crazy damage off of hers, and Ryu's crushes mids.

Why?

Fuck logic; that's why.