DOA 5 Tina Thread
- Thread starter Dr. Teeth
- Start date
First, as a long time Tina player, let me say this has been a very informative thread. Still had a couple of questions and things I'm working on I'd like to ask about though:
1) p+k gives a guaranteed 2P elbow drop; does that hold true for the ppp string as well, especially if you hit the string in a juggle? If so that might make it the combo ender of choice if you can't get a better air throw/ground throw/wall bound situation set up. 8P on normal launches is kind of unreliable so far for me and 6ppp + 2p ground hit should be comparable for damage to 8P + ground throw.
2) Does she have any way into a guaranteed launcher on normal hit? 8p sitdown stun is only on a CH, I see 66k mentioned but I don't seem to get sitdown on normal hit from that either? If not that's a serious weakness for her.
3) Similar vein: I don't have frame data in front of me, but does she have anything safe to attack with? If 46P is at least even on block you can get to a position where you could try for 1P or 6P or something, and that may make it the best way to get in now, but I can't believe she doesn't have something that's at least throw-safe to poke with other than that. Or do we just throw guard-breaking stuff all day since at least she should be safe after those if not advantaged, correct? If 6F+K is safe you've at least got a decent mid punch and mid kick mix up at range, though I have no idea what you get from a connected 46P other than damage at this point. Guess you can at least start running at them.
Edit: Ah, balls, didn't see this post before:
7K leaves you +9 on block but is duckable.
6H+K is -4 only throw punishable by grapplers.
4P+K is neutral to +2 depending on spacing.
46P is neutral
Still, she got anything else to poke with that is safe?
1) p+k gives a guaranteed 2P elbow drop; does that hold true for the ppp string as well, especially if you hit the string in a juggle? If so that might make it the combo ender of choice if you can't get a better air throw/ground throw/wall bound situation set up. 8P on normal launches is kind of unreliable so far for me and 6ppp + 2p ground hit should be comparable for damage to 8P + ground throw.
2) Does she have any way into a guaranteed launcher on normal hit? 8p sitdown stun is only on a CH, I see 66k mentioned but I don't seem to get sitdown on normal hit from that either? If not that's a serious weakness for her.
3) Similar vein: I don't have frame data in front of me, but does she have anything safe to attack with? If 46P is at least even on block you can get to a position where you could try for 1P or 6P or something, and that may make it the best way to get in now, but I can't believe she doesn't have something that's at least throw-safe to poke with other than that. Or do we just throw guard-breaking stuff all day since at least she should be safe after those if not advantaged, correct? If 6F+K is safe you've at least got a decent mid punch and mid kick mix up at range, though I have no idea what you get from a connected 46P other than damage at this point. Guess you can at least start running at them.
Edit: Ah, balls, didn't see this post before:
7K leaves you +9 on block but is duckable.
6H+K is -4 only throw punishable by grapplers.
4P+K is neutral to +2 depending on spacing.
46P is neutral
Still, she got anything else to poke with that is safe?
1) 6PPP does guarantee an elbow drop, but only when it's used on the ground. If you use it as a juggle ender, you'll notice that it doesn't cause the same ground bounce animation, which is what guarantees the 2P since it gives Tina time to recover.
2) I don't believe so. A major weakness. H+K launches on normal hit and guarantees an air throw, but I don't think she has any sit down or limbo stuns on NH. In the GVN build, 66K caused a stun that couldn't be held out of immediately, but in the final version it can be held out of at any time. It's also not safe anymore (-7), so it's not really as useful as it used to be.
3) Tina's GB game isn't that great imo. None of them except for 7K leave you at advantage, and that move is duckable and punishable on whiff. It also leaves Tina at a bit of a distance, so following up from it is kind of tricky despite the fact she's at +9. 46P, 4P+K, 6P+K, and 6H+K are all safe, but she's either neutral or minus after all of them so nothing is guaranteed.
Yeah, I don't understand the point of making them guard breaks except for psychological effect, but a good player's going to know the frames and know not to worry so it does seem pointless. It almost seems like Tina is designed around getting single hits to air or ground throw (f+k, 6f+k) and chipping away at your opponent with that so that they'll stand for throws.
7k is a bit of an enigma but I wouldn't be surprised if it sets up for 6f+k or possibly 8p if your opponent tries to counterattack? Maybe even 236p or 236k, I would have to experiment. Could be it's good at walls like Mila's 66p, if the pushback is negated maybe more stuff opens up. I'll have to experiment with 4p+k as well; +2 with good spacing is at least putting you in a jab/throw position. Better than nothing.
Regarding f+k: is there a reason to prefer this over 7k if you've got a stun going? Better launch or damage? As an analogy, it seems like 33p is a better launch in general that 33k, but obviously that mixup has its own advantages.
Also, regarding 46p, is there any good followup on hit with that? Or does it just set up a run?
7k is a bit of an enigma but I wouldn't be surprised if it sets up for 6f+k or possibly 8p if your opponent tries to counterattack? Maybe even 236p or 236k, I would have to experiment. Could be it's good at walls like Mila's 66p, if the pushback is negated maybe more stuff opens up. I'll have to experiment with 4p+k as well; +2 with good spacing is at least putting you in a jab/throw position. Better than nothing.
Regarding f+k: is there a reason to prefer this over 7k if you've got a stun going? Better launch or damage? As an analogy, it seems like 33p is a better launch in general that 33k, but obviously that mixup has its own advantages.
Also, regarding 46p, is there any good followup on hit with that? Or does it just set up a run?
Ooobe
Active Member
I know it's semantics, but there are no catch grabs/throws etc. in DOA. It's a throw or an OH or DH. I believe training mode does show if it's an OH. I just mention it because It's much easier on noobs like myself when the terminology is consistent. <I'm easily confused>
DForev
Member
Do you guys land 6KK often? It's been mixed for me so far. The slowness gets me.
And yea, any launcher does more damage if you 8P then groundthrow it rather than just airthrow. But it's not consistent for whatever reason. I think it's the 8P, since it can differ in damage slightly, pushing the opponent a bit too far.
And I think 8P into 2H+P . 2H+P is guaranteed damage, if you can land 8P without the sit-down stun.
I personally like using her back-turned throws too.
Oh, and does anyone else have problems where the online is kinda predicting what you'll do? I sometimes use 2K intending to follow-up with P, but the game seems hellbent on executing Tina 2KKK even with just the 2K input. It also does this for one other string, her 66PPP (where I just input 66P). I haven't had 5 bar matches, since the game just came out in Europe/UK, but I don't have the issue with other inputs.
And yea, any launcher does more damage if you 8P then groundthrow it rather than just airthrow. But it's not consistent for whatever reason. I think it's the 8P, since it can differ in damage slightly, pushing the opponent a bit too far.
And I think 8P into 2H+P . 2H+P is guaranteed damage, if you can land 8P without the sit-down stun.
I personally like using her back-turned throws too.
Oh, and does anyone else have problems where the online is kinda predicting what you'll do? I sometimes use 2K intending to follow-up with P, but the game seems hellbent on executing Tina 2KKK even with just the 2K input. It also does this for one other string, her 66PPP (where I just input 66P). I haven't had 5 bar matches, since the game just came out in Europe/UK, but I don't have the issue with other inputs.
Django
Member
46P, 4P+K, 66P+K, are all plus at range.
Doa_Eater
Well-Known Member
Played some Tina online got D rank so far and more then average success.
Still cannot stress enough how much she needs that safety especially for online where lag doesn't favor slow characters. Either that or she needs to be a lot faster on movement, just having Lisa's backflip would mean a lot getting out after a ground throw.
Still cannot stress enough how much she needs that safety especially for online where lag doesn't favor slow characters. Either that or she needs to be a lot faster on movement, just having Lisa's backflip would mean a lot getting out after a ground throw.
Does anyone know the rules regarding Tina's down grab and how to escape them? Because I've been been able to do up to 4 of them in row on a person totally cheesying them out of their victory because they didn't know what to do and I guess lag. I told them to tech roll, but even then I guess it can be annoying, and I swear, when you get them into a corner, get more guaranteed down grabs.
Also, when I went to Legend Arcade mode, I noticed other character being able to get extra 2p hits and ground throws to the point that I was starting to get confused on how to avoid them because originally I thought techrolled saved you out of everything, but these days I don't know lmao.
Also, when I went to Legend Arcade mode, I noticed other character being able to get extra 2p hits and ground throws to the point that I was starting to get confused on how to avoid them because originally I thought techrolled saved you out of everything, but these days I don't know lmao.
You're right. I should have specified.
Hey guys, great thread. Total noob here, I have a few questions about Tina tactics. I love her style and I'm doing decent with her in Ranked (50% win ratio) but I get the feeling I'm not playing her right. I'm playing her as a standoff/turtler instead of a grappler, because I can't get decent setups into the damaging throws, namely 
Apart from when they whiff I cant seem to do this throw on a regular basis. Any good setups? Also I'm having trouble with her air throw. So far I can only do it off a with consistency and I was wondering if there were any decent combos that launch which allows me to air throw.
My opener is usually followed by ground throw and it works pretty well on putting them on the back foot early. The trouble happens when I encounter beatdown rushers like Jann Lee who come back from this strong and usually end up pinning me against the wall, and its game over. The wall hit is too slow and I suck at counters so I have no wall defense.
Also what do you recommend as the wakeup strategy? The wakeup kick or the wakeup tackle throw? The tackle almost always catches them off guard but I cant input the half circle quick enough and they always break out of it. I thought the thrower has the priority? But every time I try and half circle for the swing they break out, I assume because they are mashing A repeatedly?
Finally what do you recommend against super fast characters like Ayane and Kasumi? I have some trouble against them, forcing me to go defensive and eventually they break me down. I cant get a single throw off against them most of the time and end up losing, or winning by mashing mixup combos which just feels wrong as Tina.
Thanks in advance for any help.
Apart from when they whiff I cant seem to do this throw on a regular basis. Any good setups? Also I'm having trouble with her air throw. So far I can only do it off a with consistency and I was wondering if there were any decent combos that launch which allows me to air throw.My opener is usually
followed by ground throw and it works pretty well on putting them on the back foot early. The trouble happens when I encounter beatdown rushers like Jann Lee who come back from this strong and usually end up pinning me against the wall, and its game over. The wall hit is too slow and I suck at counters so I have no wall defense.Also what do you recommend as the wakeup strategy? The wakeup kick or the wakeup tackle throw? The tackle almost always catches them off guard but I cant input the half circle quick enough and they always break out of it. I thought the thrower has the priority? But every time I try and half circle for the swing they break out, I assume because they are mashing A repeatedly?
Finally what do you recommend against super fast characters like Ayane and Kasumi? I have some trouble against them, forcing me to go defensive and eventually they break me down. I cant get a single throw off against them most of the time and end up losing, or winning by mashing
mixup combos which just feels wrong as Tina.Thanks in advance for any help.
Kayin Amoh
Member
Every time I pick Tina I get slaughtered. Most of her moves are so slow that when Ayane starts up one of her tumble dryer strings where she rolls about like a lunatic it interrupts my moves and ends up with awful, awful juggles ensuing.
I need a completely new game plan and some moves that are fast enough to interrupt. Tricks don't work for long.
I need a completely new game plan and some moves that are fast enough to interrupt. Tricks don't work for long.
I get what you mean Kayin. Been watching KS Shogun from EFL playing Tina and it seems like he's not getting many throws off either against top class opposition. Kind of worrying for Tina's competitive prospects if the most damaging part of her repertoire is completely negated. The slowness of , , is pretty disappointing. Never mind that, apart from Death Valley Bomb and the tackle most of her throws are on the slow side. Oh well maybe it just takes some time getting used to.
Links are here if anyone wants to watch:
, , is pretty disappointing. Never mind that, apart from Death Valley Bomb and the tackle most of her throws are on the slow side. Oh well maybe it just takes some time getting used to.Links are here if anyone wants to watch:
Echo01
Member
She does seem quite sluggish, picking her up as a secondary and I'm having difficulty setting up an offence/defending against my opponent's offence. 1K seems good, but I get stuffed out of it more often than I stuff my opponent. Is 4K into BT shenanigans viable? Getting her throws off also seems to be an uphill battle...
Nothing involving the word shenanigans is viable. It basically means it's a strategy that takes advantage of a lack of matchup knowledge. As soon as a good opponent catches on, none of that stuff will work, especially since a lot of her BT options are slow enough that people can avoid it on reaction. I made this mistake this past weekend at GUTS haha.
Doa_Eater
Well-Known Member
You should use 8 T offensive catch throw then, does more damage and it is likely it will be counter damage.
DForev
Member
I still like the move, but it's not like I've been up against pros. She can still do almost anything she can from a normal stance, but she's just a slow character overall anyway. So it's something if you like the guessing game it brings. The 4K itself is one of her faster kick moves and has ok range (can't remember the frames on block though). Her 2 throws in BT are OH, she's got strikes she can hit at any level (I'm not sure how much slower compared to her normal stance strikes this is though) and at minimum you can just back away quickly and gain a decent damage to punish any whiff strike.
Also, thanks Zaruto for the video link, I'll put the rest of his matches in the video thread later.