How would you improve Eliot in DOA5U?

KidArk

Active Member
I don't really think he needed any buffs. But he doesn't need nerfs either, he's fine how he is imo.

He can't hold a candle to Eliot though, that guy deserves buffs more than every other character in the game and funnily enough he's gotten some of the worst nerfs so far. It's astounding.

Well TN seemingly essentially forced Fu players to relearn a character with the same exactly movelist.. how you accomplish this a technical marvel within itself. I've only been complained to as a player constantly for even using Gen Fu since he's "broken" but i really like eliot as a character all his strings looks really cool.. but that's all he has going for him, gen fu on the other hand looks really bland but is effective.. now if the two characters can be fused.. that'd be swell.
 

DontForkWitMe

Well-Known Member
So far nerfs we know
-7P (no more deep stun at all even on hi-counter hit and causes a shallow stun that knocks them too far to follow up with anything)
-6P+K (no more deepstun and causes knockdown on both front and backturned opponents thus completely removing his H+K into juggle setup)
-6H+K(slower start up and is now unsafe)

buffs we know
-A new tracking mid kick that only helps him in the bayman/christie matchup at best which may remain the same anyway since his above nerfs offset it

-his already worthless and risky 33P2P string now can cause a low ground bounce for small juggle damage

overall its looking grim for the little fucker.
 

KidArk

Active Member

Xcalibur BladesZ (Eliot) vs Rachel (Insert Name here) just for posterity
 
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RoboJoe

Well-Known Member
Eliot looks like he has a lot of long range moves. Maybe he should be reworked as a zoning character.
 

Codemaster92163

Well-Known Member
There's always someone to say that a character is broken. Mostly because they're too egotistical to admit that they lost a match due to lack of knowledge/skills, and would instead place the blame on a non-existent super-power.
 

RoboJoe

Well-Known Member
I spent 20 minutes with Eliot in training mode to see what I could come up with and here are some ideas. Keep in mind that I don't play Eliot, so I don't know how he was played before. I'm just tossing out some ideas of how to make him into a character that works more as a zoner that plays comfortably outside of other characters range.

2H+K - already a high crush, make it -5 (-3 at max range) so it can be his main safe poke when used from max range, but without an easy launch other than the predictable followup.

66K - make it crumple on normal hit and bound on counterhit, make it -4 (-3 max range) his go to ranged mid poke that can start combos and is safe.

66P+K - already a decent whiff punisher, up the damage to 55 normal, 68 counterhit to match Gen Fu, but without the close hit property.

6H+K - already a low crush. let it have bound status on normal hit (or sitdown stun) and make it a 2in1.

3P+K - already a high crush launcher and can connect from decent range, let it launch on normal hit and give it a bit more range.

9K - let it launch on normal hit, since it moves you forward a decent amount.

7P - used to get people off you if they managed to close in, let it push back further so you can get some space.

7K - make it a high crush, on counter hit give it launch height like Akira's just frame knee (just like Gen Fu's buffed H+K in DOA5U) or enough height to get a 66P+K afterwords for style points, but not much else since it moves you back so much. The main purpose would to put you back at max range again.

Throws - other than 5T, 66T, BT 5T, all of Eliot's throws push people outside of wakeup range or give frame adv, so they already seem alright, not much I can think off other than letting 236T hit ceilings.

Backdash - make it go further and faster.


I want to mention I'm no doa expert, let alone Eliot expert, so these are just my thoughts with less than 30 imn in the lab and I welcome criticism and ideas from people who actually play this character.
 

Codemaster92163

Well-Known Member
I understand his 7P nerf, since a 9f NH stun never really made sense to me, but he could do with his old 6H+K back from what it used to be. (3)P should revert back to its original float properties, or if not, increase his other refloats to sustain a longer juggle. 9K launching on normal hit would make quite a few people happy as his parry would then get him a guaranteed launch. 7K being a high crush would also make sense, considering Pai's 7H+K and Lisa's 4H+K have a similar animation and are high crushes. I wouldn't let him combo off of it, though. I don't agree with the 2H+K change, however, nor the SDS property on 6H+K, unless they decide to keep it as slow/unsafe as it is in the new build.
 

Belinea

Active Member

Xcalibur BladesZ (Eliot) vs Rachel (Insert Name here) just for posterity

The ground game in Doa5u is so weird. One minute 2P+K hits on the ground, and the next it doesn't.

If I've lost most of my 2P+K force tech set-ups, then I might consider that to be his biggest nerf.
 

KidArk

Active Member
The ground game in Doa5u is so weird. One minute 2P+K hits on the ground, and the next it doesn't.

If I've lost most of my 2P+K force tech set-ups, then I might consider that to be his biggest nerf.

They've noticed h+k , 6p+k to not work anymore, has h+k ever crushed mid wake up like gen fu 9k? If it became easier to beat wake-up kicks perhaps if there's a move we had that could already beat it, a 100 damage combo we could get consistently would be a little much?? Gen could get about 131 off his so I'll be surprised if he still has it. Also I don't use Eliot but what was the guaranteed damage combo?
 
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DontForkWitMe

Well-Known Member
They've noticed h+k , 6p+k to not work anymore, has h+k ever crushed mid wakee up like gen fu 9k? If it became easier to beat wake-up kicks perhaps if there's a move we had that could already beat it, a 100 damage combo we could get consistantly would be a littlle muuch?? Gen could get about 131 off his so I'll be surprised if he still has it. Also I don't use Eliot but what was the guaranteed damage combo?

The combo the eliot player in the vid below does at the :25 mark

 

KidArk

Active Member
The combo the eliot player in the vid below does at the :25 mark


LOL i went into the lab and did every combo but that one , like H+K , 6P+K , 6H+K , 4 PPPPP ( 88 damage ) or H+K , 6P+K , 6H+K EWGF EWGF 6PPPP (91) damage , or H+K , 6P+K 4PPPP 92 damage .SInce that combo is gone for 5u did they check if H+K 6H+K works.. well that's not guaranteed, it's S/E able... . See Gen Fu has two moves that allow him the guaranteed damage set ups, so i find it doubtful TN would nerf both even if they knew what they were.

P.S Does Eliot have any singe hit SD stuns? Similar to Gen Fu's 33P not as godly though ofc.
 

ScattereDreams

Well-Known Member
Eliot doesn't have anything that forces a limbo stun. He had 6p+k that could guarantee a launcher but it knocks down. P+K also forced a inescapable BT stun but it lacked range. 3KP force a sit down stun on front turned and BT opponents but it lacked enough frame advantage to follow up with guaranteed launchers. The only way I could utilize 66k or P+K was by doing a CH 2k which the opponent could hold out of.
 
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