Zeo
Well-Known Member
Neither of the bolded are top tier. High tier yes though.
The Official Dead or Alive 5 Tier List with Discussion thread
- Thread starter Matt Ponton
- Start date
vINv
Active Member
I disagree i firmly belive if akira is masterd to his full potiential no char can stand in his way he has alot of guranteed dmg options and the only char in the game with a 12 frame low that crushes highs and is plus one on hit Top tier id say is akira janlee genfu based frames and tools setups and safety as well as dmg out put
Edit: also he is the only one who gets full combo dmg while an oppnets blocking wich is all guranteed
Edit: also he is the only one who gets full combo dmg while an oppnets blocking wich is all guranteed
Tokkosho
Well-Known Member
Sarah, Pai, maybe kasumi and christie also have these, but i know for sure sarah and pai do.
Zeo
Well-Known Member
His jabs are nifty as they give +1, but that's all they give and Sarah and Pai have frame advantage in much more abundance. His only frame advantage moves are his standing and crouching jabs and his 214p which is a short range 23 frame mid punch (which also gives a measly +1). The advantage is nice in a game where everyone is at negative 90% of the time but he's not exactly all that fast and blocking after the jab will typically put him at disadvantage. In the case of his mixups (IE Guard breaks, throws) you can just crouch and his pressure is over all the same.
His guard breaks allow for deeper mixups and crippling an opponent's defense and his best guard break option gives a nice 80 points of guaranteed damage which is great, however both of his guard breaks are crushable, SS'able highs that can even be ducked. His guaranteed options are nice but the most damage he gets out of them is generally around the 60-80 mark which is nice but will require him to open up his opponent up a good 4-6 times before the round is his.
His big damage lies in his stun game combos which forces him to *gasp* guess. 16F+P is the best grab in the game as far as the stun game is concerned but can be slow escaped so his mixup options dwindle down to around 2 or 3 options and his single strikes don't cause much stun and he's prone to be quite predictable.
On top of that his tracking moves are few and far between and that becomes even more prevalent in 1.03 and his range is garbage. He's got fluid movement but his horrid range and unsafe ranged attacks make him crap as far as the spacing game is concerned.
His damage his colossus if you can get started with him which will happen, but his guaranteed situations pale in comparison to the top tiers as far as damage and practicality which forces him to play the stun game on top of bad range and easily sidestepped attacks. He's high tier for sure, but his flaws are far too glaring to consider him a top tier character. And this is coming from an Akira main.
His strongest point was his damage, which was buffed. That's why he stepped up in the tiers and that alone was enough. On the other hand the buff to SS is a huge nerf to him in actuality.
vINv
Active Member
U are looking at this from a doa mind set i play tekken i ll never agree to with u on this arguement we view it differntly if i could main akira i would i love his options u say his range is bad dash block no char is perfect but of the doa cast i think akira is a charcter that takes alot of time months of experince i have a friend that plays him in doa and vf and can do all this just frames at the drop of a hat plus his frame advantage is very intimadating but i m not her to argue jus voice an opinion it is a discussion thread
vINv
Active Member
I agree all but lei fang i think akiras better then her 
but yes i love gen fu i use genfu helena kasumi its hard to get away from gen he is very solid char with great options damging throw punishes launch throw x2 frame adv grabs unreal crush game extremly dificult to react to during the stun game hes a great char my pic for best char in 5
but yes i love gen fu i use genfu helena kasumi its hard to get away from gen he is very solid char with great options damging throw punishes launch throw x2 frame adv grabs unreal crush game extremly dificult to react to during the stun game hes a great char my pic for best char in 5
Something-Unique
Active Member
Yeah I'm in that boat as well. Sarah, Jann Lee, Gen Fu are the best post patch. Lei falls in the same pool as Pai, Kasumi, Akira. Ayane is good but not the above good imo. I think Ayane, Hayabusa, Hayate all fall in the same pool as well.
Omegan Eckhart
Well-Known Member
Top Tier:
Jann Lee > Nerf's didn't mean shit.
Lei Fang > As above.
Gen Fu > What's a nerf?
Sarah > Why the fuck did I get buffed?!
Kokoro > Same character, still hits like a truck.
Jann Lee > Nerf's didn't mean shit.
Lei Fang > As above.
Gen Fu > What's a nerf?
Sarah > Why the fuck did I get buffed?!
Kokoro > Same character, still hits like a truck.
Zeo
Well-Known Member
Kokoro is in the same boat as Akira, sidesteps were one of her weakness and the buff they got crippled her imo. I don't think she qualifies as a top tier anymore.
Kokoro wasn't top tier pre-patch, and isn't top tier post-patch. She got really 1 noticable buff, but like Zeo said the side step buff hurts her.
DR2K
Well-Known Member
Tier lists. . . hmm. . .
Jann Lee character wise was kept mostly the same, but the universal health nerf means that his big damage combos aren't as unique to him. The large health bar gave him a big advantage, you'd always have to land more combos than him. This isn't the case anymore.
The ground game was changed on a character level, so characters like Mila, Helena, and Bass have to change the way they play completely.
Characters like Lisa and Hayate got a tremendous amount of buffs and changes, that allow them to be more competitive. These could both be top tier.
For the time being every(?) character has a sitdown in a CB/launcher guaranteed.
What about the new and effective side step? Characters like Kokoro and Akira are very linear, this wasn't as big of a deal to them before because sidestep wasn't as reliable, but that isn't the case anymore.
A lot of characters haven't even been broken down yet, and probably won't be until the patch hits the other half of the userbase. Also look into the system changes to delve deeper into a characters changes and placement.
Jann Lee character wise was kept mostly the same, but the universal health nerf means that his big damage combos aren't as unique to him. The large health bar gave him a big advantage, you'd always have to land more combos than him. This isn't the case anymore.
The ground game was changed on a character level, so characters like Mila, Helena, and Bass have to change the way they play completely.
Characters like Lisa and Hayate got a tremendous amount of buffs and changes, that allow them to be more competitive. These could both be top tier.
For the time being every(?) character has a sitdown in a CB/launcher guaranteed.
What about the new and effective side step? Characters like Kokoro and Akira are very linear, this wasn't as big of a deal to them before because sidestep wasn't as reliable, but that isn't the case anymore.
A lot of characters haven't even been broken down yet, and probably won't be until the patch hits the other half of the userbase. Also look into the system changes to delve deeper into a characters changes and placement.
Something-Unique
Active Member
Actually you know what. The more I think about the more I believe Gen Fu isn't top 3 or top 5. Top 10 sure. Post patch especially characters like Kasumi and Hayate strike me as more and more silly everytime I mess with them. Hayate gets freebie stuns out the ass now and has the damage to go along with it. They basically took what Jann had and gave it to him.
I was just talking tiers with some folks and both threw out Hitomi which I found interesting. We pretty much all agreed on Sarah and Kasumi but they threw out Hitomi. I don't see it personally but I find it interesting to say the least.
I'd honestly throw these names in a basket for top in no order...
Sarah, Jann Lee, Hayate, Kasumi, Pai and u'd have something that's out the norm but somewhat agreed upon if you had people throw out lists that play the game at a high level.
Hitomi, Akira need thorough discussion on how they play out post patch now. I'm legitimately intrigued by the throwing out of a possible Hitomi.
The more I think about Hayate post patch the more I realize his only negative is his safety but everything from the best i7 throw punisher in the game with his new i12 raijin. SDS stuns everywhere lead me to belive he has everything.
I was just talking tiers with some folks and both threw out Hitomi which I found interesting. We pretty much all agreed on Sarah and Kasumi but they threw out Hitomi. I don't see it personally but I find it interesting to say the least.
I'd honestly throw these names in a basket for top in no order...
Sarah, Jann Lee, Hayate, Kasumi, Pai and u'd have something that's out the norm but somewhat agreed upon if you had people throw out lists that play the game at a high level.
Hitomi, Akira need thorough discussion on how they play out post patch now. I'm legitimately intrigued by the throwing out of a possible Hitomi.
The more I think about Hayate post patch the more I realize his only negative is his safety but everything from the best i7 throw punisher in the game with his new i12 raijin. SDS stuns everywhere lead me to belive he has everything.
NightAntilli
Well-Known Member
I never understood why people say Kokoro is top tier, not even pre-patch. Any character that outspeeds her is very hard for her to deal with due to her lack of crushes and evasiveness, and any character that has great sidestepping moves give her trouble. She might have great tools, but she is probably one of the characters that has the most bad matchups, her worst of them all probably being Christie.
I kind of wish I had access to the patch to test the new things. I think Kokoro stayed pretty in the same tier she was in before from looking at the list of changes. Yeah, sidestepping has been buffed, but 6P+K supposedly stuns on normal hit now, so, that's a huge plus.
I kind of wish I had access to the patch to test the new things. I think Kokoro stayed pretty in the same tier she was in before from looking at the list of changes. Yeah, sidestepping has been buffed, but 6P+K supposedly stuns on normal hit now, so, that's a huge plus.
Omegan Eckhart
Well-Known Member
Jann Lee, Lei Fang and Gen Fu are all extremely linear and that didn't stop them being top tier. Crippled is a very strong word for a character as good as Kokoro. She is still able to by pass the stun game easily, her damage output is still extremely high, she's still really safe. If linearity is such a problem post patch then Jann, Lei and Fu are fucked too, and I don't see that being the case.
Kokoro has an i10 jab and an i12 mid punch, with that she can compete with every character in the game speed wise. I'd kill for an i10 jab, just so I had one attack that could beat an i11 mid punch.
Honestly I don't think people can be completely objective about their characters, I mean Jann Lee players still deny him ever being top tier and say he is mid tier at best. Perhaps I'm the same way with Helena I dunno.
Murakame
Active Member
Show me a vid of a competent Kokoro player applying the level of offense she is known for vs a competent Kasumi or Christie where she isn't getting counter-blown every 10-15 seconds or so.