The Official Dead or Alive 5 Tier List with Discussion thread

[UpSideDownGRUNT]

TN just need to give Hayabusa a play style and keep to it, he's changed play styles almost every single iteration with DoA5/U being his worst so far and 2U being his best. I honestly have to say I'm not a fan of Busa in 5 compared to DoA3 or DoA2U I just find it strange how a character can be S tier in most of the games and then be B tier in 5 (according to this very thread).

 

[Matt Ponton]

Hayabusa did not change much at all from ++ to 2 to 3.

 

[UprisingJC]

iirc somewhere between -11 and -13 I think, can't remember exactly

EDIT: nevermind its actually only -8

On paper it's -8 but for most of the time Ryu players won't use it in a very close distance.

Thus it'll usually be around -3~-6.

Even though it's used in a close distance and blocked(leaving Ryu at -8), 7f low throws won't catch him. Only 5f throws can.

 

[UpSideDownGRUNT]

Hayabusa did not change much at all from ++ to 2 to 3.

Recently though he's been all over the place, I can't really say for ++ or Dimensions I haven't played those games.
However, I really preferred him in 3 and 2/U I find I can flow more fluidly with him in those games where as it feels clunky and heavy when I play him in DoA5 it might just be me I have no idea but it's definitely got a different feel to it.

 

[EvilJun]

On paper it's -8 but for most of the time Ryu players won't use it in a very close distance.

Thus it'll usually be around -3~-6.

Even though it's used in a close distance and blocked(leaving Ryu at -8), 7f low throws won't catch him. Only 5f throws can.

Honestly I don't use 6p+k and 6k from ninpo at all, can't really think of a situation where they are actually useful. If you want to go in from range 33p4 and 214p are much better options

 

[Brute]

If so, Bayman should also be called a pseudo-grappler IMO because he doesn't have 1-frame decrease in his throws.

Bayman excels in OHs. You're welcome to think that, but I certainly think Bayman is qualified as a grappler.

Some strikers like Hitomi and Ayane also have slow mids. Their fastest mid is also 13 frames(Both their 6K and 6P).

Ayane's BT 7K is 11 frames.

Same as my first part of this reply.

Buffing throws that are rarely used doesn't make him a more effective grappler.

Telegraphed moves?

Ryu's animations are very elaborate, distinct and not particularly fast, making it easier to react to his moves and strings on-reaction than many other characters (say Sarah, who's difficult to discern mids from highs or separate strings unless you've clearly memorized her movelist). Add to that his limited string mix-ups and he's basically just waiting for holds or to finish unsafe strings.

Not so many characters have setups that guarantee a CB.
Kasumi's 66KK may be one of the setups that guarantee a CB but the second hit is VERY SLOW.
Both 4H+K and 214P have a guaranteed launcher.
4H+K -> 6KK
214P -> 33P4

I would opt for the guaranteed Shoho after 214P, but your call.

I've seen a lot of Ryu players(including both beginners and skilled players) abuse the 2 moves and even his Ongyion stance all day.
33P4 ducks under high attacks and certain mids that have hitbox issues(ex: Kasumi's 66K) and launches his opponent on counter hit. Even it gets blocked, he's still +1.

33P leaves a significant distance gap that's very hard to follow up (unless against a wall) save very specific follow-ups. This limitation causes him to be held a good deal, and for the distance it creates and the speed it executes the stun time doesn't impress me. I would honestly opt for a Shoho, 236P or 6P+K in such cases where I needed to close distance and didn't think I'd be snagged by lows or mids, despite their lower speed. If I were anticipating a fast mid anyway, I wouldn't try to beat it out with any of these moves, including 33P.

 

[Jaguar360]

Okay since no one else is doing it, I'll put up Ryu's matchups. Keep in mind that I'm not very good at DOA5. I'll put short summaries next to each matchup so please respond if you want more detailed reasoning! I agree with most of what has been put up so far so I may leave out a few that have already been covered.

• Akira 5-5 No idea here.
• Bayman 6-4 (formerly 4-6) Hayabusa is basically good against anyone he can outspeed. Also, Hayabusa has greater throw damage than Bayman, very good stuns, and gets more damage on Izuna holds than Bayman's expert punch holds. Hayabusa does not really need to fear getting held in stun because his air grab allows him to launch early and still get good damage and his stuns like 9K and 3P allow him to do that. Bayman will also have trouble getting hits on Hayabusa because of his sluggishness and fear of Izuna holds. However, Bayman can throw punish Hayabusa's many unsafe moves with 5 frame T and 7 frame 4T, annoy Ryu with parries, and use Tank roll.
• Brad 5-5 Brad's unpredictability takes away Ryu's greatest strength. Ryu's lack of good lows also plays a factor here. However Ryu has the edge of speed and power.
• Christie 4-6 Ryu has to go through hell to even get a hit on Christie. Throwing's not an option. You have to get lucky to hold her.
• Gen fu 5-5 Ryu has a far superior range game and can move around more than Gen Fu can. His throw and hold damage output is higher and their speed and strike damage is similar. Gen's parries are a major annoyance.
• Helena 6-4 Helena is hard to read, but she is a bit slower than Ryu and Ryu has good starting options against her like 6p, 9k, and 1p. Ryu has higher danage output in every category. Blender can be disatrous for him however so this could be 5-5.
• Hitomi 5-5 Hitomi has great mix-up which is problematic for Ryu, but other than that neither have huge threats against each other as far as I'm concerned.
• Jahn Lee 6-4 Both charcters lack good lows, which means less guessing for Ryu. Thanks to Jahn Lee's nerfs in 1.03, Ryu gets more damaging combos, throws, and holds. Dragon Gunner is the only real threat.
• Leifang 5-5 Lei has parries, superior hold damage and move safety on her side, while Ryu can hi-counter throw Lei for great damage and does more damage on his juggles. Their speed is about even, which is a bigger deal for ryu than for Leifang.
• Lisa 5-5 Don't know
• Mila 5-5 No big threats for each other. Mila has takedown and easy CB's on her side while Ryu has big throw damage and Izuna holds.

MORE LATER

 

[EvilJun]

• Gen fu 6-4 Ryu has a far superior range game and can move around more than Gen Fu can. His throw and hold damage output is higher and their speed and strike damage is similar. Gen's are an annoyance.

MORE LATER

I'd say 5-5, a 11 frame mid will stop pretty much anything Ryu has to offer close up and if Gen Fu can be patient, Ryu is most likely going to end in a situation where Gen Fu's 6p will shut him down.

 

[Brute]

Akira 5-5 No idea here.

Not a very lopsided one, I would say. Both have good damage, but Akira has speed and frame advantage.
That said, he is heavily punch reliant and we all know what situation a flurry of punches can get you into against Ryu.

Bayman 6-4 (formerly 4-6) Hayabusa is basically good against anyone he can outspeed. Also, Hayabusa has greater throw damage than Bayman, very good stuns, and gets more damage on Izuna holds than Bayman's expert punch holds. Hayabusa does not really need to fear getting held in stun because his air grab allows him to launch early and still get good damage and his stuns like 9K and 3P allow him to do that. Bayman will also have trouble getting hits on Hayabusa because of his sluggishness and fear of Izuna holds. However, Bayman can throw punish Hayabusa's many unsafe moves with 6 frame T and 10 frame 4T, annoy Ryu with parries, and use Tank roll.

The DDT and Atomic Crush do more damage than any of Ryu's throws but obviously they are breakable.
I actually agree. I'm inclined to say Ryu has the edge in this one.

Brad 4-6 Brad's unpredictability takes away Ryu's greatest strength. Ryu's lack of good lows also plays a factor here.

Not really sure the Brad match-up is 4-6. Brad has good crush options, running P and turtling techniques which work well against Ryu, but ultimately Ryu is faster and in general if you manage to be slower than Ryu you're in for a tough time (like you said against Bayman). I'm inclined to say 5-5.

Christie 4-6 Ryu has to go through hell to even get a hit on Christie. Throwing's not an option. You have to get lucky to hold her.

Christie's crushing, speed, string delays, kick-mix-ups, etc. raise hell for Ryu. She definitely takes the advantage.

Gen fu 6-4 Ryu has a far superior range game and can move around more than Gen Fu can. His throw and hold damage output is higher and their speed and strike damage is similar. Gen's are an annoyance.

Gen-fu lacks range (save that ridiculous 214P), but honestly he doesn't have to rush Ryu at range and most of Ryu's gap closing can be easily blocked or free-stepped (teleports). Gen fu's parry options, resets, crushes, etc. work wonders against Ryu. I don't see it being 6-4 against Gen fu.

 

[Forlorn Penguin]

Bayman can throw punish Hayabusa's many unsafe moves with 6 frame T and 10 frame 4T, annoy Ryu with parries, and use Tank roll.

Bayman's T is i5 and his 4T is i7.

 

[Jaguar360]

Bayman's T is i5 and his 4T is i7.

Oh shoot. I was thinking Dimensions! *facepalm*

 

[iHajinShinobi]

lol, 13 frame mids aren't slow. 11i mids are fast, 12-13i mids are average. Anything past 13i is considered slow, just an FYI (really bothers me hearing people think 13i is slow).

 

[Matt Ponton]

Bass' fastest tracking mid is 15 frames startup. He has a 14 frame startup mid kick but it doesn't guarantee him anything but a string followup mix-up and is jab interruptable on block

 

[UncleKitchener]

Bass' fastest tracking mid is 15 frames startup. He has a 14 frame startup mid kick but it doesn't guarantee him anything but a string followup mix-up and is jab interruptable on block

Playing this character is like driving a car while having your hands and feet cuffed to the steering wheel and pedals.

 

[P1naatt1ke1tt0]

Playing this character is like driving a car while having your hands and feet cuffed to the steering wheel and pedals.

Yeah but at least you're driving a Hummer in demolition derby and the other cars are Minis and Smarts.

 

[Brute]

Bass' fastest tracking mid is 15 frames startup.

Ryu's fastest tracking mid is also 15 frames (4P).

Not saying Ryu's even half as slow as Bass, though, and he does get better options from it.

 

[Zeo]

You should be so lucky, Akira's fastest tracking mid is 18 frames (214P+K). One of the five tracking moves he has, God the Christie matchup is a nightmare with him.

 

[Brute]

You should be so lucky, Akira's fastest tracking mid is 18 frames (214P+K). One of the five tracking moves he has, God the Christie matchup is a nightmare with him.

The Christie match-up is a nightmare with pretty much everyone. Very few can keep foot with her. Her crushes, speed, mix-ups and side-step evasions are going to trip up almost everyone somewhere.

 

[Zeo]

The Christie match-up is a nightmare with pretty much everyone. Very few can keep foot with her. Her crushes, speed, mix-ups and side-step evasions are going to trip up almost everyone somewhere.

This is true but a lot of her evasiveness can be clenched by a nice tracking mid. Her Jakeio evades non tracking mids and crushes tracking highs. Hayate and Hayabusa for example can snuff her with a well placed 6PK/4P (Hayate) or 4P (Busa).

Akira on the other hand's tracking mids are too slow and will be hit before they come out unless you guess she's going to go into her stance and just throw the move out, which is never smart. I stand by Christie and Ayane being his personal worst matchups. Even if Christie gives everyone a headache.

 

[FlamingMuffin]

Kokoro's fastest tracking high move is i17. Fastest (and only) tracking mid is is like i31. I'd take a i15 or i18 tracking mid any day.