The official "I want DOA5U for PC" topic.

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d3v

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But think about the decision business wise. ...TN wouldn't need to sell DLC. And they're making a killing off of it. So a PC port is them basically shooting themselves in the foot...
Because cosmetic DLC doesn't sell on PC.. oh wait, hello TF Hats, DOTA/LOL hero sets, courier skins, etc.\

And if we stick to just fighting games, the only DLC content for AE on is also just cosmetic.

Also, we're forgetting the fact that they can also bring in Core Fighters to PC/Steam as F2P and make money of selling the characters and extra modes..
I'm betting the only reason they don't want to port the games is because of hackers. Just remember that time when TN sued some guys for making some nude mods...
This is a dumb, pointless reason to not release something on PC.
^ He gets it. Thats why they really won't put it out on PC.
This shows that YOU HAVE NO IDEA ABOUT WHAT YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT!

Not releasing a game on a platform just because people can mod it is just plain stupid. Not when it means denying the possibility of yet another avenue for revenue.

Consider this, the most expensive part of making a game (and the DLC) is the art assets. Art assets alone can take up up to a good 50% or more of a game's budget.

Now consider that the art assets are already done. After the initial $200,000 (est.) per character has been spent, they don't have to spend the same amount to bring that character over to PC. Sure, they'll still have to spend to port the code to the PC, but the cost of that is way smaller, especially when you consider that some of the groundwork for this has already been done for the arcade version (which is running on Windows PCs).

What a PC port represents is another opportunity to recoup that initial investment. Anything earned by the PC version DLC goes on top of whatever the DLC originally earned.
 

Yaguar

Well-Known Member
Im implying the effort it probably takes to maintain 3D fighters. Most games thats 2D is hard in itself and 9 times outta 10 its designed by a different team because its so time consuming.

Design work is done... I mean I'll admit they've not made some of the best design decisions but that is done.
The rest is just ignorance. So I'll take a stab at this.

Let's take a look at Injustice as an example. It is a fighting game that primarily takes place in 2D space, but the game is fully 3D.
The difference between 2D and 3D is the render engine. So primarily we're looking at the code base used within that or the Graphics API. Option wise we have Direct X (lets say DXD9 because 8 year old hardware, not too sure but it may run 10) and OpenGL.

For the last 5+ years PC GPU's have been running DXD11, GPU's are backwards compatible with Direct X versions. So a GPU that runs 11 is capable of running the older API's, you have to link the code library regardless of the version in use.

Long story short as long as they weren't doing anything incredibly hacky in the GPU then the graphics engine will port pretty quickly. All the shaders should be fine off the bat (welcome to the world of HLSL) and I'll have to check what the XBox uses but I know the PS3 is a slightly modified OpenGL library.

Basically if they wrote their code well (which they will have as it is a multi-platform game already) all that they'll need to do is alter a few sections of the render code and the graphics engine will port straight up.

"But what about all the different hardware for PC's?!"
Negligible. What we're talking about is graphics API's, which are standard. They just have to set a minimum bar AKA run on DXD9/10/11.

The game is already built to run on 32 bit systems and x64 is compatible with x86 (or you'd be royally fucked) so the CPU architecture shouldn't have too many issues. The struggle here will be multi-threading and pipelines. Most of the time will be focused on bug testing.

What is interesting here though is that generally fighting games will have a fairly strict game loop. So actual computing frame by frame should be pretty strict and not worry too hugely about concurrent programming. Each players action does have to be calculated before effects can trigger so it would make more sense to run and wait or run 1 by 1 then calculate game logic from there. This should save a lot of the concurrent stuff in game logic so that'll be less weight on hardware differences.

Ultimately the "2D vs 3D" is a flat out ignorant argument so I hope some of this sheds light on that. Design work is just what it sounds like, design. This is now a software engineer discussion, do they have the technical capabilities over the creative ones. So lets bin that one too.

Modding and hacking is still a concern, you're right. But lets look at it from another angle. Steam is pretty well protected. Sure it isn't 100% but that all comes down to the developer. As far as locking down a game online goes it is easily possible, look at how many games you acquire that will need you to use Hamachi to access online functionality because you simply cannot connect to the servers.
Mods however you'll have to worry about data encryption etc. If the art assets have decent lockdown and the way the DLC functions are built into the .exe it might be okay (this is only a fleeting thought, I can probably come up with something better if I had 5 minutes to actually think).

Hope this shines some light on a few area's.
 
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Deleted member 473

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When I see a 3D game being ported without flaws (especially since TN's engine is made from scratch), then I'll understand what you guys are saying, until then nope. All this is absolute speculation.
 

d3v

Well-Known Member
When I see a 3D game being ported without flaws (especially since TN's engine is made from scratch),
AE, which before you complain, is in 3D where it counts (rendering). It's also on a home built engine.
...then I'll understand what you guys are saying, until then nope. All this is absolute speculation.
I'm the one who's actually talked to game devs about stuff like this (development costs) and I've worked in software development myself. While this may be "speculation" it's logical speculation. Heck, what I just wrote could be expanded upon to form the basis of an actual business case proposal for a port.
 
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Deleted member 473

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AE, which before you complain, is in 3D where it counts (rendering). It's also on a home built engine.

I'm the one who's actually talked to game devs about stuff like this (development costs) and I've worked in software development myself. While this may be "speculation" it's logical speculation. Heck, what I just wrote could be expanded upon to form the basis of an actual business case proposal for a port.
Even Harada is on the fence about it though....
 

Yaguar

Well-Known Member
Ignorance is bliss but this has now jumped over the edge and is taking the piss.

I'm out of this "argument" on the basis of I support the idea as a logical expansion to the series and not a talking to a brick wall, at least a sponge absorbs.

@Blazeincarnated you've had two people with knowledge in the subject area reply to you with why it is a completely plausible idea. I even attempted to explain it as best I could but if you want to play silly buggers you're on your own. This is now pointless and I'm wasting my time.
 

d3v

Well-Known Member
Here's a fun fact, in certain regions, the most active community only for the world biggest fighting game (SSFIV AE2012) is on the PC, not PS3, not XBox, PC!

That just shows how much of a market there is on the PC for these things.
Even Harada is on the fence about it though....
Except current Namco should really be looked as an example for anything, especially with how terrible they've gotten at interacting with the fans ever since they lost Filthie. And that's on top of some terrible decisions (that horrid F2P system in Tekken Rev and SC: Lost Swords, making Lost Swords singleplayer only, making a hash of a port with SCIIHD with offline input delay).

This is actually a problem with alot of (non indie) Japanese FG devs in that they haven't really considered PC. Luckily for us, Street Fighter is owned by Capcom USA and the folks there pushed to have the games released on PC. Of course, the recent trend is towards having more fighters on PC (thanks in part to Capcom). Now, other devs big and small are seeing the light and understanding that PC is a viable platform for fighters. Heck, we got SNK-P releasing on PC now which is something.
 
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David Gregg

Well-Known Member
Well this thread took a turn for the worse. :O Like I said it's a great idea and I would buy the PC version day 1, but if I were TN (and let me clarify that I'm not to avoid conflict) I would hold off right now b/c the timing is bad. The arcade version is a risk in it of itself, adding another version on top of that is when you really start to gamble. And who knows maybe if they released the PC version it would attract a whole new crowd and it would be a great success. But on the other hand it could flop and I think that possibility is why they are sticking w/ 360/PS3 for now.
 

CyberEvil

Master Ninja
Staff member
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I'm not a fan of cleaning up nonsense. No warnings are going out for this, mostly because I found it humorous that Yaguar flagged his own post and everything came from that. Everyone keep to the topic going forward and stop trying to annoy and piss each other off,
 

Skilletor

Active Member
Keep moving those goalposts.

And if anything, netcode would be better on PC, because it is for every other fighter available on the platform. Save maybe MK9.
 
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Deleted member 473

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Keep moving those goalposts.

And if anything, netcode would be better on PC, because it is for every other fighter available on the platform. Save maybe MK9.
You're not understanding my point. TN's engine is built from the ground up. Do you see those graphics? For them they'd have to do extensive testing to even make sure its up to par to even put on PC. MK9 is 2.5D. It didn't work for that,(probably not Injustass either (sorry for the pun, had to lol)) and I sure as hell don't think it will work as easily for 3D fighters like TTT2 or even DOA.
 

Skilletor

Active Member
You're not understanding my point. TN's engine is built from the ground up. Do you see those graphics? For them they'd have to do extensive testing to even make sure its up to par to even put on PC. MK9 is 2.5D. It didn't work for that,(probably not Injustass either (sorry for the pun, had to lol)) and I sure as hell don't think it will work as easily for 3D fighters like TTT2 or even DOA.

MK9 is 3D models, 2D gameplay. So is Street Fighter 4. So is Injustice.

I have no idea what you mean by TN's engine is built from the ground up. So is every other engine. That DoA5 is being released in arcades with PC architecture means it would be pretty easy to port.

Your reasoning just sounds extremely ignorant. I'm going to stop talking to you now.
 

Yaguar

Well-Known Member
Fact: If your engine is built from the ground up you know what it is capable of more than a 3rd party engine.

They already have a multi-platform engine (XBox, PS3, PS Vita, Arcade).
Rendering between 2.5D and 3D is rendering in 3D. The physics and game code do not change because of the platform. PC can run any programming or scripting language that the XBox or PS3 can.

The only difference in platform generally is in a few classes which are platform specific implementations. Change these, you have a PC version of DOA5.

I do not doubt the technical applications of porting DOA5U to a PC.
The only points worth looking at are:
Can it go to Steam? (Biggest platform)
Do they want to do it?
BIGGEST of all: Is there a market for it?

I've spoke to a lot of marketing people due to being part of a small team from large and small studio's and we are told by the vast majority:
"If it will run on PC, do it. It's another platform to try boost your sales and exposure."

This comment comes regardless of being small or large. It is up to the studio themselves to decide if it is the right move for their game though.

PS. I will make the mulit-platform point after every point I see that is clearly lacking in knowledge of games or software development as a whole. Hell hath no fury like a programmer scorned.
 
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Deleted member 473

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MK9 is 3D models, 2D gameplay. So is Street Fighter 4. So is Injustice.

I have no idea what you mean by TN's engine is built from the ground up. So is every other engine. That DoA5 is being released in arcades with PC architecture means it would be pretty easy to port.

Your reasoning just sounds extremely ignorant. I'm going to stop talking to you now.
  • Thats what I said, 2.5D
  • No it does not, look at DOA Online. Once again it failed. ...Mind you that was 5 years ago with DOA4 graphics.
  • deal wiht it.gif
 

Yaguar

Well-Known Member

Do we have to have another episode?
You are clearly clueless, please leave this thread to the big boys now.
You aren't stating opinions any more (if you ever even did) put pure ignorance and none sense. This kind of stupidity is viral and I'd rather you didn't poison the minds of the audience with you clear inability to even comprehend what "Hello World" is.
 
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