What's the difference between Eliot and Kokoro?

SilverKhaos

Active Member
When fighting AGAINST them, not playing AS them.

When going against them, the seem to be functionally the same character, at least in the ways people tend to use them.
 

ScattereDreams

Well-Known Member
I'm sure Kokoro's much faster, and safer. Both linear characters, Kokoro actually has useful sit down stuns. I play them both very aggressively, but I think Kokoro pays off more. I think you need to be a little more specific though when you say "seem to be functionally the same character". Kokoro's rush down is much more effective.
 

KwonJigglypuff

Well-Known Member
Kokoro has more pressure, she is more offensive...

Eliot.. well... I don't know... what is his 'individuality'.. What is his gameplay based on ? It's hard to describe.
 

DR2K

Well-Known Member
They have different, moves, proerties, animations, frame data, damage outputs, etc. . .they're both light weight class. Eliot lives by his parry and jab speed to start pressure. Kokoro has niether and uses her crushes and range to start her offense.
 

SilverKhaos

Active Member
I'm sure Kokoro's much faster, and safer. Both linear characters, Kokoro actually has useful sit down stuns. I play them both very aggressively, but I think Kokoro pays off more. I think you need to be a little more specific though when you say "seem to be functionally the same character". Kokoro's rush down is much more effective.

When fighting against them, it seems to be...the same rhythm to their offense (kind of a general, "1, 2, 3456. 1, 2, 3456...") similar stances, similar strikes and strings, etc.

That's how it feels when fighting them anyway. When fighting AGAINST them, I wind up treating them as the same character.
 

DR2K

Well-Known Member
When fighting against them, it seems to be...the same rhythm to their offense (kind of a general, "1, 2, 3456. 1, 2, 3456...") similar stances, similar strikes and strings, etc.

That's how it feels when fighting them anyway. When fighting AGAINST them, I wind up treating them as the same character.

That's probably why you're having so much difficulty fighting them.
 

SilverKhaos

Active Member
From your obvious lack of experience with them and the need to make this topic.

...okay, let's recap.

I saw I've fought them a lot, and have noticed that they are extremely similar as I find myself using a single method that deals with both of them as if they were the same character, so I ask what the differences actually are, as they come across as functionally the same opponent that are dealt with in the same manner.

And your response is to say I'm having trouble facing them.

To quote a great man,
"Evil Knieval couldn't have made that leap!"
 

SilverKhaos

Active Member
Well... for one you mash high and mid counters.

For the other you mash mid kick and high counters.

That's something, at least. Trying to recall which one actually kicks. The fights all kinda blur together after a while, to be honest lol. Probably need a break from DOA soon so I don't just get sick of it.
 

DR2K

Well-Known Member
...okay, let's recap.

I saw I've fought them a lot, and have noticed that they are extremely similar as I find myself using a single method that deals with both of them as if they were the same character, so I ask what the differences actually are, as they come across as functionally the same opponent that are dealt with in the same manner.

And your response is to say I'm having trouble facing them.

To quote a great man,
"Evil Knieval couldn't have made that leap!"


When fighting against them, it seems to be...the same rhythm to their offense (kind of a general, "1, 2, 3456. 1, 2, 3456...") similar stances, similar strikes and strings, etc.

Screams inexperience.
 

Kokomi

Member
From your obvious lack of experience with them and the need to make this topic.

Screams inexperience.

Sorry to be an ass, but aren't we all in the learning process? I don't think there's a need for the inquirer to be treated like that. Can't we all just get some inquirer-friendly answers, he was asking the difference between Kokoro and Eliot, and if its within your area of expertise, perhaps a bit of enlightening, such as elaboration on their basic tools and moves would help this lost gentleman here. Then we'll all be happy members because he's not the only one curious about Kokoro and Eliot now that someone brought it up.
 

Awesmic

Well-Known Member
Standard Donor
Eliot has some things Kokoro does not...

More moves that track...

An actual 10-hit combo that strangely feels like a nod to Tekken...

Good parries...

One of the best relaunchers in the game (and a throw that launches)...

And bragging rights for having the quickest "Talk to the Hand" gesture, clocking at 9 frames per second... and stuns. (Even Christie and Kasumi can't say that about their fastest move...)

Oh, and Eliot resembles a Gundam pilot (and possibly a character from Hunter x Hunter), while Kokoro resembles Tifa. But that's a story for another day...
 

DR2K

Well-Known Member
Sorry to be an ass, but aren't we all in the learning process? I don't think there's a need for the inquirer to be treated like that. Can't we all just get some inquirer-friendly answers, he was asking the difference between Kokoro and Eliot, and if its within your area of expertise, perhaps a bit of enlightening, such as elaboration on their basic tools and moves would help this lost gentleman here. Then we'll all be happy members because he's not the only one curious about Kokoro and Eliot now that someone brought it up.

Treated like what? When did I state inexperience was a bad thing or stated anything in a manner that was unfriendly?

If you don't expose the root of the problem, then you can never learn. Step number one in being able to differentiate between the two characters is acknowledging the fact you know very little about them. If you can't get past this step then there's nothing anyone can type or say that will help.
 
Sorry to be an ass, but aren't we all in the learning process? I don't think there's a need for the inquirer to be treated like that. Can't we all just get some inquirer-friendly answers, he was asking the difference between Kokoro and Eliot, and if its within your area of expertise, perhaps a bit of enlightening, such as elaboration on their basic tools and moves would help this lost gentleman here. Then we'll all be happy members because he's not the only one curious about Kokoro and Eliot now that someone brought it up.

I wish this was how things worked around here.
But unfortunately, this community has a few members who prefer to give snide remarks as oppose to actual useful input.

On topic.
I think that Kokoro is more of a pressure, punish character due to her crushes and multiple options that she has to make your character sit their ass down. (sitdown stuns)

I haven't played with many Eliot's but on paper he seems like the type of character who disrespects stupid offense's with his parries. But I also know that he is more punch oriented.
 

DR2K

Well-Known Member
I wish this was how things worked around here.
But unfortunately, this community has a few members who prefer to give snide remarks as oppose to actual useful input.

This community also has members that are overtly sensitive that jump to irrational conclusions based on their emotions. Not that that's a terrible thing, but almost every member in this community is actually out to help you more than they are to hurt you.
 
This community also has members that are overtly sensitive that jump to irrational conclusions based on their emotions. Not that that's a terrible thing, but almost every member in this community is actually out to help you more than they are to hurt you.

It's also not a terrible thing to avoid making unnecessary comments, as your second point is redundant.
But that is neither here nor there.

Back on topic because I feel there is more I can add.

I think the problem most run into when facing an Elliot is that his strings are a bit more ambiguous (if you don't know them) A lot of his punches that look mid are actually high's and vice versa. Kokoro on the other hand isn't so ambiguous you can see many of her moves and tell where to guard or hold.
I don't know about Eliot, but you can also sidestep much of Kokoro's offense.

I would also state that Eliot can handle pressure better with his parry game and that 9P jab that just screams (stahp it)
I feel that Kokoro falls to pressure, because she is pretty slow and unless you get lucky with a jab, a good free cancel will disrupt anything she does to try and get out of pressure. But I feel that, Kokoro can pimp the stun game better than Eliot.
 

Kokomi

Member
Treated like what? When did I state inexperience was a bad thing or stated anything in a manner that was unfriendly?

If you don't expose the root of the problem, then you can never learn. Step number one in being able to differentiate between the two characters is acknowledging the fact you know very little about them. If you can't get past this step then there's nothing anyone can type or say that will help.

...okay, let's recap.

I saw I've fought them a lot, and have noticed that they are extremely similar as I find myself using a single method that deals with both of them as if they were the same character, so I ask what the differences actually are, as they come across as functionally the same opponent that are dealt with in the same manner.

And your response is to say I'm having trouble facing them.

To quote a great man,
"Evil Knieval couldn't have made that leap!"

@DR2K, I think that's enough to show that this young gentleman actually DID acknowledge his lack of knowledge within the DOA world. He might have sounded like he wasn't acknowledging anything, but what he probably means is this "I personally think Kokoro and Eliot are the same thing, but someone please prove me wrong."

Nobody spoke about inexperience as being a bad thing. But I think

That's probably why you're having so much difficulty fighting them.

From your obvious lack of experience with them and the need to make this topic.

Remarks like this can be easily avoided as to prevent any misunderstanding. As you've mentioned, inexperience isn't a bad thing. But you might also noticed that, you've unintentionally offended or caused three members to feel uncomfortable right here. So the way I see it, this isn't an issue of being overly sensitive because there are more than one person who feels the same way.
 

Rikuto

P-P-P-P-P-P-POWER!
More than one person feels the same way about a lot of things. That doesn't mean that group of people is necessarily right about anything.

I hate to say it, but DR2K is absolutely right in this situation and he gave blunt advice, and also explained the difference between the two characters. Rudeness is saying what is unnecessary, and I don't think he has said anything unnecessary yet. He also has a very valid point about sensitivity.

If someone goes around tossing direct insults, I'm happy to take care of them because that is 100% unnecessary. But this was just uncomfortably truthful advice. The fun fact about learning a fighting game is that we damn near always trick ourselves into believing one thing and someone has to break down that wall of lies we build up in order to improve ourselves. The one who does this isn't being rude, in fact he's probably the best ally you have.
 
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