You all need to make sure you understand what is going on before asking Team Ninja for nerfs/buffs.

[dawnbringer]

This thread is so weird. The topic is simple: you all need to make sure you understand what is going on before asking Team Ninja for nerfs/buffs. There are so many posts here that clearly indicate that indeed we need to.

I think most people complaining about the balance are missing the bigger picture.

 

[HiguraShiki]

Jann Lee the easiest to use? Maybe. But that doesn't mean he is easy to win with. You won't see just anyone winning with Jann Lee.

Essentially, people can win with him even with bad reads via dragon gunner and his damage overall. He is easy to win with because of his high damage output. In this game that means fewer guesses = a win.

 

[Raansu]

Essentially, people can win with him even with bad reads via dragon gunner and his damage overall. He is easy to win with because of his high damage output. In this game that means fewer guesses = a win.

If anything is linearity makes him more difficult to win with... But people rather complain about him rather than learn how to get around him.

 

[DR2K]

If anything is linearity makes him more difficult to win with... But people rather complain about him rather than learn how to get around him.

What the hell does linearity even mean in DOA? People say the same bullshit bout Kokoro. She hits like a truck, is safe, and does everything great, but she's so linear!

 

[Raansu]

What the hell does linearity even mean in DOA? People say the same bullshit bout Kokoro. She hits like a truck, is safe, and does everything great, but she's so linear!

His reliance on a specific tool makes him easy to read and most of his attacks are easily SS'd.

 

[DR2K]

His reliance on a specific tool makes him easy to read and most of his attacks are easily SS'd.

It's a shame sidesteps suck balls in this game. They're usable compared to other DOAs, but not reliable enough to depend on.

His dragon stance on block can't even be interrupted by basic jabs, total block pressure. You can of course hold, but it's a total guess. Then another guess, then you've lost 60-70%. Which is fine and dandy, but doesn't make sense that other characters don't have those kind of options. It's not even a fair fight at mid distance with him, safe 66k or dragon gunner? Or how about being the only character with a 5 in 1(4ppp string) that can be canceled into dragon stance on block?

If his weakness is linearity, then cool, but the tool designed to beat that isn't up to par. Or maybe it was, but also got nerfed with each passing revision.

 

[Raansu]

It's a shame sidesteps suck balls in this game. They're usable compared to other DOAs, but not reliable enough to depend on.

His dragon stance on block can't even be interrupted by basic jabs, total block pressure. You can of course hold, but it's a total guess.

I SS and get SS'd all the time...you just have to know when to do the SS.

Seriously man? Seriously? Please...PLEASE start going into sparring and test something BEFORE you post something as fact.

Bass has a 13 frame jab...if he's interrupting it then EVERYONE in the cast can interrupt it. His dragon stance isn't some insane tool in neutral, it just helps him keep the pressure once he has you stunned. Using dragon stance in neutral is generally not a good idea.

 

[DR2K]

Fuck online then. Because I couldn't even do that with Christie.

 

[DontForkWitMe]

yeah DOA5 online his a whole new ballgame. when discussing buffs/nerfs TN SHOULD focus on balancing characters based soley on offline. mediocre characters like lisa and hayate for example might as well be raised a tier when fighting them online where they get away with far more bs shenanigans due to the assy netcode making it impossible to react/punish their parlor tricks consistently.

can't count how many times i fell victim to hayates cart wheel flip kick garbage string that 99.98% of scrubbyhayate players spam online where as offline that shit would get shutdown with ease. eliot of course is just as trash online as he is offline... who cares if lows are harder to react to online when his lows do shit damage while leaving him at disadvantage on hit anyway while opponents can continue blocking any follows ups after getting hit by them in a string.

 

[HiguraShiki]

His reliance on a specific tool makes him easy to read and most of his attacks are easily SS'd.

What? Easy to sidestep?! Maybe if the person is stupid enough not to throw in the entire string. Even if you sidestep one of Jann's attacks, the next one will almost always hit you, so essentially the SS is useless. And I agree with DR2K, wtf is linearity? That his moves are SS'able yet you can almost never interrupt his next string? That he is basic? That he looks like a freaking 90 degree line? How is that even a freaking weakness?
Specific tools to rely on?
1)Everyone has specific tools they rely on.
2)What specific tools? Essentially almost every move he has is already a great tool to win the game, be it 66T, dragon stance, etc. The only difference is that no other character in the game has better tools than he does.
3) His damage output is ridiculous just for playing the same game everyone else in DOA5 plays.
And to top it off, it's absolutely ridiculous that his mid punch hold guarentee's dragon gunner. I'm sorry but I don't see any of these so called "weaknesses"

 

[iHajinShinobi]

^ But Ayane's 64 mid punch hold guarantees her a launch into juggle damage (good juggle damage). Does that make her mid punch hold ridiculous?

Also to everyone that still continues to whin about Dragon Gunner. Are your reactions that slow to the point that you cannot duck it (then punish) or just throw it when you see it? It is not as difficult to react to as you all make it seem (you're all just too accustomed to DOA Online/Lag, I guess). And if it does connect, Jann Lee should very well be rewarded damage for it.

People...just start spending more time in the lab and find ways with dealing with certain things. I'm sure people will answer questions you have if you ask about something as well. The whinning needs to be put to a halt.

 

[Prince Adon]

Seriously. I hardly ever get caught by the dragon gunner.

 

[HiguraShiki]

^ But Ayane's 64 mid punch hold guarantees her a launch into juggle damage (good juggle damage). Does that make her mid punch hold ridiculous?

Also to everyone that still continues to whin about Dragon Gunner. Are your reactions that slow to the point that you cannot duck it (then punish) or just throw it when you see it? It is not as difficult to react to as you all make it seem (you're all just too accustomed to DOA Online/Lag, I guess). And if it does connect, Jann Lee should very well be rewarded damage for it.

People...just start spending more time in the lab and find ways with dealing with certain things. I'm sure people will answer questions you have if you ask about something as well. The whinning needs to be put to a halt.

64 mid punch is an expert hold, Jann's mid punch hold is not. Also proving that Jann is easy to use is that he gets a free dragon gunner after it, which is another easy move to pull off, yet the damage is rewarding.

 

[Prince Adon]

64 mid punch is an expert hold, Jann's mid punch hold is not. Also proving that Jann is easy to use is that he gets a free dragon gunner after it, which is another easy move to pull off, yet the damage is rewarding.

It's not guaranteed. Also, if you want to see some guaranteed craziness try getting caught by a mid kick hold by Lei Fang. Now that's fatal.

 

[iHajinShinobi]

But...this is an easy game to play. There are no characters in this game that are really that difficult to play over another...64H is still a mid punch hold that guarantees damage. Doesn't matter whether it's a normal or experthold. That's basically saying that all holds in this game are ridiculous because they guarantee damage.

 

[dawnbringer]

who cares if lows are harder to react to online when his lows do shit damage while leaving him at disadvantage on hit anyway while opponents can continue blocking any follows ups after getting hit by them in a string.

This is how quick lows work in general.

 

[HiguraShiki]

But...this is an easy game to play. There are no characters in this game that are really that difficult to play over another...64H is still a mid punch hold that guarantees damage. Doesn't matter whether it's a normal or experthold. That's basically saying that all holds in this game are basically ridiculous because they guarantee damage.

Sure it's easy, but having 1 character get more damage than the rest of the cast while being easier than the rest of the cast is not an exception. If you are going to make an easy character, lower the damage output he does.

 

[iHajinShinobi]

Can you name a fighting game that has a cast of characters that deal an equal amount of damage for every single character?

 

[dawnbringer]

Sure it's easy, but having 1 character get more damage than the rest of the cast while being easier than the rest of the cast is not an exception. If you are going to make an easy character, lower the damage output he does.

That makes no sense. Imagine if Ryu of Street Fighter series deal less damage just because he is the "Ryu" of the fighting game. Being "simple" (easy to get into with) does not justify him being less powerful.

 

[Prince Adon]

Topic like these makes me want to just go back to playing VF LOL.