A bunch of players show up to an event venue in person (say an arcade) and we pay some money to the pot. Then, we play against each other (usually best-of-3 rounds, double-elimination). The Winner(s) get to take the pot money home.
When do you think DOA6 will be released and what do you want to see in it
- Thread starter ItasumiJinsei
- Start date
Well I'm not going to argue that, lol. I do think she's just fanservice for lolifolk, but I won't pass final judgement until I play her for myself and see how she handles.
Argentus
Well-Known Member
few more tweaks I hope they'd make.
Hitomi
- Fix her strings so she can't just continue always hitting the opponent, regardless of whether they are airborne, on the ground, tech rolling, or side stepping. It's ridicouls that she can just continue strings without a care in the world because Hitomi force techs opponents casually with nno slowdown in her strings, and her strings seem to always track everything. So if a hitomi gets to knock me down, all I can do is sit there and bounce around as she continues to juggle me, and there's seemingly nothing I can do about it because she force techs me in mid string so I can't do wakeup or anything, and even if I do manage do, her strings autotrack to hit me as I'm tech rolling anyway, making it useless.
- Hayabusa
Even if they don't remove the teleport stance, I think they should balance it. Either give some telltale sign of which teleport is about to come out, or make it so they can't track. I'm really tired of running under, jumping over, sidestepping Ryu's teleport overhead grab, only to see it realign him like a fucking Tetris piece to connect with me.
In general.
- I hope the ymake juggles take a little more effort. It's ridiculous how almost every little tap launches in 5 (which is horrifically amplified by fast characters like the female ninjas.
- that and/or make people fall faster, instead of just slowly floating through the air, breaking the flow of the fight into constant pauses.
- STOP LETTING HIGHS AND MIDS HIT OPPONENTS ALREADY LAYING ON THE GROUND. When even have "falling down" as part of the game mechanics when the opponent can just keep doing their strings and you'll bounce right back up for them anyway? ( even though there's no way that particular hit should be connecting, let alone causing you to bounce/recoil/stand up from a prone state). Too much coddling for people, there's no punishment for dropped juggles here. "oh, you messed up and the opponent fell? No worries, the opponent will automatically be standing back up in a stunned state for you so long as you just continue your string as if you didn't mess up." If the person being attacked fell, that's it, the combo should be OVER.
- Get rid of Alpha. So tired of people running to the boss characters when they lose, it's part of why i'm against Tengu returning.
To be faair, the majority of the design choicess with 5 have been terrible lol.
Hitomi
- Fix her strings so she can't just continue always hitting the opponent, regardless of whether they are airborne, on the ground, tech rolling, or side stepping. It's ridicouls that she can just continue strings without a care in the world because Hitomi force techs opponents casually with nno slowdown in her strings, and her strings seem to always track everything. So if a hitomi gets to knock me down, all I can do is sit there and bounce around as she continues to juggle me, and there's seemingly nothing I can do about it because she force techs me in mid string so I can't do wakeup or anything, and even if I do manage do, her strings autotrack to hit me as I'm tech rolling anyway, making it useless.
- Hayabusa
Even if they don't remove the teleport stance, I think they should balance it. Either give some telltale sign of which teleport is about to come out, or make it so they can't track. I'm really tired of running under, jumping over, sidestepping Ryu's teleport overhead grab, only to see it realign him like a fucking Tetris piece to connect with me.
In general.
- I hope the ymake juggles take a little more effort. It's ridiculous how almost every little tap launches in 5 (which is horrifically amplified by fast characters like the female ninjas.
- that and/or make people fall faster, instead of just slowly floating through the air, breaking the flow of the fight into constant pauses.
- STOP LETTING HIGHS AND MIDS HIT OPPONENTS ALREADY LAYING ON THE GROUND. When even have "falling down" as part of the game mechanics when the opponent can just keep doing their strings and you'll bounce right back up for them anyway? ( even though there's no way that particular hit should be connecting, let alone causing you to bounce/recoil/stand up from a prone state). Too much coddling for people, there's no punishment for dropped juggles here. "oh, you messed up and the opponent fell? No worries, the opponent will automatically be standing back up in a stunned state for you so long as you just continue your string as if you didn't mess up." If the person being attacked fell, that's it, the combo should be OVER.
- Get rid of Alpha. So tired of people running to the boss characters when they lose, it's part of why i'm against Tengu returning.
To be faair, the majority of the design choicess with 5 have been terrible lol.
David Gregg
Well-Known Member
Argentus
Well-Known Member
Not nerfs. Changes!
I never see anyone else, so I can't really comment on them. Mostly I just see ninjas, Hitomi, and Kokoro. Hitomi and Kokoro I just have the same opinon "Fix it so they can't just continue hitting you when you are already knocked down". To clarify, how it seems like they don't have to do any kind of a setup to ground juggle or anything, because their normal strings bounce you back up from the ground, plus all the constant tracking, makes it waaaay to hard to recover from being knocked down.
Everyone else, I haven't faced enough/don't use, so I can't really comment on any changes I want on them.
I do feel that Ryu's new ability to spam tracking, semi-unblockable, unpredictable teleports, is one of the biggest bullshit, worst design choices in DOA history.
David Gregg
Well-Known Member
(sighs) Being a player who has Hitomi as one of my mains what you suggested is most certainly a nerf. But this is one discussion I just don't have the energy to engage in (especially given your views on juggling to begin with).
Anyway:
Okay, I'm gonna explain this shit one more time in hopes you listen.
1) Shit ain't new. The teleports have been in there since DOA4 and Dimensions and GUESS WHAT? THEY WERE BETTER BACK THEN
2) The OH sort-of tracks, but free-stepping up or down or even backwards will cause it to whiff. Same thing for his other teleport attacks. Wait, there's a universal solution that beats every teleport move? Yes. For the millionth fucking time, there is.
3) High attacks intrecept him more often than not. If you have a high crush high attack, that's another solution to all his junk.
4) The free teleports (ongyoin 66/88/22) have such huge mega-recovery you have to be an imbecile to be hit by something coming out of them. And honestly, the ongyoin parry has the same problem half the time, depending on the attack you parried.
So, in summary: no one cares if you think they're oh so difficult. I think they're bullshit, too, but that's because they're too damn easy to get around with universal solutions to every option.
Argentus
Well-Known Member
So what you are saying, is that you are apparently psychic, and know exactly when they are going to try to come in from above, and when they are going to teleport behind you, or when they are just going to launch from directly in front of you, and always make the right reaction based on each?
Free stepping doesn't do shit, in my experience. Damn thing still autoaligns to track me no matter where I move. (Or at least, doesn't work RELIABLY). If you got it down, good on ya. but you say "free stepping causes it to whiff", but when I free step, it doesn't whiff, it still tracks.
like I said, not a nerf. Or at least, if you do consider it a nerf, then you need to work on your hitomi more (No personal offense intended). I just don't think it's right that certain characters can just mash strings out, and the game's mechanics will basically make it work for them regardless of most anything the opponent can try to do. Too little effort, for too much payoff, in my eyes.
I see it like when they removed Mila's infinite. That wasn't a "nerf", that was just a balance tweak, and it didn't make Mila any weaker, it just made her not (as) stupid easy to do damage with. If removing mila's infinite was called a "nerf" or "ruining the character", all that told me, was that they were bad Mila players to begin with, and needed the handicap to do any good with her.
As I said, I'm not trying to personally attack you, just trying to justify why I don't see it as a "nerf".
Juihau
Well-Known Member
I'd love to go on a small rant about how tech rolling seems to be the solution to the vast majority of your problems, but I'll just say this.
On that note, are there any other characters that can get hi-counter air throws? I'm legitmately curious.
Rachel disagrees.
On that note, are there any other characters that can get hi-counter air throws? I'm legitmately curious.
I've been meaning to test that. Thanks for reminding me.
Argentus
Well-Known Member
I'd love to go on a small rant about how tech rolling seems to be the solution to the vast majority of your problems, but I'll just say this.
Rachel disagrees.
On that note, are there any other characters that can get hi-counter air throws? I'm legitmately curious.
okay, that's awesome lol. I'd love to test if Desert Falcon can just grab him, but I don't think it would register, Leon would just try a regular throw instead at that time.
(Of course there is the fact that if Ryu had done any of his other teleports/attacks from that stance, Rachel would have been screwed, so that was pretty lucky lol)
I've tried to leaping attacks to hit Ryu out of the air and whatnot, but he either realigns backwards to come down on me as I'm landing, or he just grabs me in midair and the games Tetris's us to the ground to continue his grab animation.
As for tech rolls. I'd love it if they were the simple solution. But when I techrol, the opponents strings just keep tracking and hit me during/out of tech roll anyway. So all that happens is I wind up rolling right back into their string, making no difference.
No, I'm saying when you see his huge ass 44-77 frame warm-up animations, you can begin free-stepping, and even if he teleports free instead of in the air, you still have plenty of time after seeing that to wail on him during his recovery frames because they're huge. And that's a ZERO FUCKING EFFORT yomi solution to all teleport attacks. Seriously, 0 room to complain there.
Well when everyone else on the planet can do it and it works fine except for you, I think it's your problem, not the game's.
Argentus
Well-Known Member
ZERO FUCKING EFFORT, huh? If we completely ignore that if they teleport behind my back, he's faster than my turnaround attacks, and if he just attacks from the front, it will track the freestep, then sure, zero effort, in theory. In practice, not so much.
If I had some way of anticipating, there'd be no problem, and that's all i'm asking for. I think it's really bullshit, that they actually gave Ryu a stance that cannot be predicted, thus finally proving right all those idiots who tried to call DOA's gameplay "random".
No he isn't. I just told you that. Study the damn frame data.
What is it with you and hating empirical evidence?
Juihau
Well-Known Member
Well, yeah. You can't just get up and attack unless you've been knocked a considerable distance away. Blocking is key. If they throw you, they're often not in a situation where they can just force tech you if you don't tech yourself. Take advantage of that. Despising juggling and whatnot is one thing; calling for such drastic changes solely because you haven't figured out how to get around a certain tactic is another entirely, and one that will invariably result in backlash such as has happened here.
Argentus
Well-Known Member
Wow. Someone offering actual, real advice instead of just trying to attack me or making blanket statements.. I'm honestly surprised. (And grateful).
Anyways, I do try to block, it just doesn't seem to work. Either i'm getting hit during the tech roll before I can block, or i'm just stuck back in the string due to grabs/guard breaks/really fast attacks. I'm guessing that i just haven't found the timing or something, but just not working for me, so I've pretty much given up trying.
Because it doesn't matter what the "empirical evidence" says, when something else happens in the actual match. If I play matches and my fastest attacks are still always beat out, that's the "evidence" i'm going to go by. Like when people try to (quite adamantly) say Ryu's teleport grab doesn't track, or Kokoro's strings don't track, but when I play against them, they blatantly DO track, in full 180 degree turns at times, to boot. You can quote frame data all you want, but I'll believe the frame data when my in game experience isn't the exact opposite. In game experience is more important than frame data, for me.
And (I know i'll get flamed for this, too, but I gotta point it out) for the record, this is supposed to be a finished game. Why the fuck should I have to study the game's coding? That's not even "being a good player", that's "Shitty game design" when you get a "completed" game, have to take it right the hell back apart to use it effectively lol. I know the elitists will brush that off as a scrubby comment, but I'm just laughing at the irony of the situation. Might as well just make your own game at that point lol. Mostly just me observing the semantics of your statement, is all.
Anyways, I'm stopping here, because i'm not interested in dealing with a flame war, you can get as mad as you want, but I stated what i'd like to see changed (and why) in a thread asking what you'd like to see in the next game. Your own problem if you disagree, doesn't matter to me anymore.
David Gregg
Well-Known Member
Back on topic I really think Aquarium would make a great DOA6 stage. It would look amazing in HD especially on PS4/X1. It would also be cool if, when you hit the glass hard enough like say a Power Blow, it cracks and water starts pouring into the room giving it a slippery surface.
-_-
It happens exactly like it should for the rest of the world, and that's exactly what empirical evidence is: gathering data. ie: from the lab or from observation/study "in the field" (ie: actual match). I don't think you know what the word "empirical evidence" means, so here's a definition:
"based on, concerned with, or verifiable by observation or experience rather than theory or pure logic."
I wouldn't be telling you this stuff in theory if I didn't practice it myself and verify that it works. That's empiricism.
That would work if you were doing it right. But you're not. So while the rest of the planet is playing the game and finding that it works like it should, you, and only you, will be alone alone, refusing the accept the truth of what is actually happening because you don't trust arithmetic and logic.
It's part of the finished game. It's like asking "Why do I have to read the code to figure out how much money I have in GTA?" You don't. The game tells you. Just like the game tells you all the frame data in the game's practice mode, which is part of the full/complete game.
Believe it or not, I'm trying to help you. If you would listen to me, you wouldn't get caught by Hayabusa's weakest gmmick tools all the time. But instead, you shut your ears, say you don't trust evidence, and thus eliminate the possibility of learning anything, including how to get around this really, really simply problem.
I could make a video showing you how to get around it all, but of course you wouldn't trust it for some inane reason.