Competitive balance: DOA5U mechanics changes

[TakedaZX]

Kind of agree with the rest of your post.
But why, except Rig ?

Also, sorry to make you repeat things guys, but I still don't understand why 300 is too much ? I still don't get it.

Also, how would you make Hitomi, Zack and Eliot more special ?

Hitomi is special but underestimated just like Zack. They have a unique playstyle that revolves around them enveloping themselves in the stun game and mixing in their frame advantage throws as well as deep mix-ups.

Eliot on the other hand just doesn't play the game well. He doesn't have "great" guaranteed damage... sure but it ain't just that. He has little tracking and the bit of tracking he does have is once again, negligible. What I would do is make his 4P2K/BT 2K track, as well as give him a tracking mid kick that looks a mixture of Hayate's 6PK and Bayman and Kokoro's 7K. It should also link into his 4P sorta like how 1K4P does. I saw in his video that they're giving him more ground bounce type stuff to work with as well so that's going to be something to be hyped for.

Also I talked in one of my previous post about increasing the advantage of his parries by 1 frame to give him Gen-Fu status stun game.

 

[TRI Mike]

Kind of agree with the rest of your post.
But why, except Rig ?

Also, sorry to make you repeat things guys, but I still don't understand why 300 is too much ? I still don't get it.

Also, how would you make Hitomi, Zack and Eliot more special ?

It was kind of a joke. The Rig sub-forum hasn't gotten any posts since April 4th and I know most members here and none of them main Rig or even seem to notice his presence in the game anymore. Which is sad.

Regarding the health, DOA2, 3, 4 and Dimensions worked with 240. The franchise has always been about fast-paced fights that are over in a matter of 30 seconds or less even among slow characters like Bass or Tina. That was one of the things that made DOA so cool. You fucked up¿ you lose a lot of health in the opponent plays right and viceversa. Raising the life to 300 makes the game too slow and tedious, a HCT from Tina will only take 1/3 of a life bar, you'll need a LOT of strikes to win, a LOT of juggling and holds to beat an enemy in a single round. That may be OK for 2D fighters (Looking at you Blazblue) but in DOA's case, it's not supposed to be like that.

 

[KwonJigglypuff]

It was kind of a joke. The Rig sub-forum hasn't gotten any posts since April 4th and I know most members here and none of them main Rig or even seem to notice his presence in the game anymore. Which is sad.

Regarding the health, DOA2, 3, 4 and Dimensions worked with 240. The franchise has always been about fast-paced fights that are over in a matter of 30 seconds or less even among slow characters like Bass or Tina. That was one of the things that made DOA so cool. You fucked up¿ you lose a lot of health in the opponent plays right and viceversa. Raising the life to 300 makes the game too slow and tedious, a HCT from Tina will only take 1/3 of a life bar, you'll need a LOT of strikes to win, a LOT of juggling and holds to beat an enemy in a single round. That may be OK for 2D fighters (Looking at you Blazblue) but in DOA's case, it's not supposed to be like that.

Oww okay, thanks for the explanations.
Then, how would you make Rig more.. erm.. appealing ?

And what are Rig's and Mila's supposed individualities?
I kind of like her faints the way they are, but what about ground stance ? This way, she would be a character focused on comebacks.

 

[TakedaZX]

It was kind of a joke. The Rig sub-forum hasn't gotten any posts since April 4th and I know most members here and none of them main Rig or even seem to notice his presence in the game anymore. Which is sad.

Regarding the health, DOA2, 3, 4 and Dimensions worked with 240. The franchise has always been about fast-paced fights that are over in a matter of 30 seconds or less even among slow characters like Bass or Tina. That was one of the things that made DOA so cool. You fucked up¿ you lose a lot of health in the opponent plays right and viceversa. Raising the life to 300 makes the game too slow and tedious, a HCT from Tina will only take 1/3 of a life bar, you'll need a LOT of strikes to win, a LOT of juggling and holds to beat an enemy in a single round. That may be OK for 2D fighters (Looking at you Blazblue) but in DOA's case, it's not supposed to be like that.

My brother enjoys Rig (though not the game). Even still there are some good Rigs out there. Ho0DLeSs is definitely one of them though I think he mains Hitomi (don't quote me) and ScattereDreams can use an assortment of characters as well but his Rig stands out.

Oww okay, thanks for the explanations.
Then, how would you make Rig more.. erm.. appealing ?

And what are Rig's and Mila's supposed individualities?
I kind of like her faints the way they are, but what about ground stance ? This way, she would be a character focused on comebacks.

Rig is another character that's under-estimated. He really works by widdling you down while having very good juggle damage and good forced tech setups. He also has good guaranteed damage off of a ceiling toss since he can link sitdown stuns into a guaranteed critical burst or launcher. More over he can get some good frame advantage and poke you to death basically. To make him more appealing have more good players show what he's capable of on stream.

Mila's hot. She's played by a lot... and she's hot. But most of her players dropped her because their loyalty was shattered by her nerfs. They deem her unplayable which is not true, seeing as one of out best [Galen the Wise] even gave my nigga SweetRevenge a challenge. He's a really solid player, very solid and it goes to show you can utilize her strong points very well. She's a very well built character but while she is powerful she feels slightly incomplete with such a small movelist and it seems like there's much more they could do with her. Of course that's not the only character he's good at though.

She's also hot. Just saying.

Sorry for always dropping these books on you guys. I just have nothing better to do since I just moved and there's not much to do outside of my house in this area.

 

[EMPEROR_COW]

I think 240 is way to small for the way this game currently flows.

But the 270 we currently have feels great. Gives enough aggression without being too boring..

As for the 300..... >__>
I honestly dont wamt to make a judgement with lack of DOA5U knowledge, but my gut instincts tell me its high..

I think if we can get it back to 270 every1 would be happy.. just dont quote me on it just yet because we still havent seen the flow of high level matches with the current system.

 

[synce]

I don't think anything can convince TN to get rid of 300 lifebars at this point, seems the only reason they increased it was to accomodate PL's. Momiji can do at least 150 damage on normal hit.

Anyway it's still fucking stupid. Rounds in TR, SC5, VF5 can take 10-30 sec, but DOA5 with 300 HP is mininum 30 sec. Aside from that, when you can absorb so much damage it encourages sloppy play.

RE: Rig
Probably no one uses him because of his cheesy design, not because his style. There is seriously nothing I hate more in games than skinhead dudebro types. Hwoarang is way cooler

 

[David Gregg]

To make it more useful than PBs why not allow uncharged power launchers have followup damage? I mean of course it would have to be a fraction of what you could do if it was charged in terms of damage and combos but it gives every player a go-to launcher.

 

[EMPEROR_COW]

Can sum1 help filter this thread? This is a serious thread and the only hope for us to voice our "technical" opinion over to japan.


The casuals should stick to their own threads.. (AKA DOA5U general discussion thread). Keep your fan talk and costume talk and character preferences etc. there.

 

[TRI Mike]

Heey General Discussion WAS supposed to be about gameplay too.

 

[Berzerk!]

Please keep on topic
When talking about individual characters please make sure its an example that illustrates a point about the system and mechanics

 

[Saber]

Well since everyone is doing it...

Last I recalled, no. Members were talking about Offensive Holds and parries, IIRC, and merely stated character tools as examples and how to make them a bit more viable for each character to make it a legit tool (e.g. in Eliot's case, to increase parry frame advantage). No one has stated a wishlist of what a player wants for a specific character (and while we're on that topic, whatever you just listed down will make him downright broken).

Anyway, has there been any news regarding sidesteps in general? Like no magical tracking and making sidesteps a little faster? It's a great tool to use, but the recovery after a SS sucks.

 

[crapoZK]

Anyway, has there been any news regarding sidesteps in general? Like no magical tracking and making sidesteps a little faster? It's a great tool to use, but the recovery after a SS sucks.

SS suck really badly, so I hope they take out the magic track afterwards, and make it more like sorry, Tekken's sidesteps. Yeah.
I do know for a fact that they have made the SS faster though through watching E3 gameplay.

 

[Female Tengu]

Ok, the first two changes are indeed a bit counterproductive for the competitive scene.


But guys, where is the problem....just spam TNs twitter and facebook account, then I'm sure they will change it back to like it was before, lol

 

[J.D.E.]

I agree with the recovery frames but SS's suck? I don't think SS suck. I use ss just fine offline against people that use non-tracking moves. The character I've had trouble sidestepping the most is Ayane, a character you wouldn't be sidestepping, anyway

 

[Matt Ponton]

I agree with the recovery frames but SS's suck? I don't think SS suck. I use ss just fine offline against people that use non-tracking moves. The character I've had trouble sidestepping the most is Ayane, a character you wouldn't be sidestepping, anyway

Which sucks, because all but one of my locals use Ayane . It makes for some boring practice I tells ya. Some have expressed dropping Ayane just for the sheer fact everyone else is using her.

 

[bingsoo]

Which sucks, because all but one of my locals use Ayane . It makes for some boring practice I tells ya. Some have expressed dropping Ayane just for the sheer fact everyone else is using her.

Not necessarily drop, but maybe learning a secondary I will check out Momiji in 5U lol

 

[J.D.E.]

Which sucks, because all but one of my locals use Ayane . It makes for some boring practice I tells ya. Some have expressed dropping Ayane just for the sheer fact everyone else is using her.

I have her as a secondary, but yeah it's annoying trying to find ways to predict her strings even as a primary Kasumi player (even though I can interrupt) some just because of the fact you won't be sidestepping her. So even as a Bass player, I feel your pain.

EDIT: I'm guessing it's Bingsoo XD

 

[Matt Ponton]

To bring that side topic back on board. I still personally believe that the side stepping mechanic is lacking. It either needs to be sped up or a character's string should remain off-axis at any point it's side stepped unless an attack in the string is considered tracking. Of course, this is a problem for characters like Kokoro or Eliot as most of their strings are linear making it so you just have to step the first and/or second attack and they'll have to stop and either throw punish or re-align.

 

[TakedaZX]

What I want to see mechanically changed is the issue of tracking lost.

I find it stupid that if someone decides to come in with Leifang's 6h+k, Kasumi's 66K, or other like moves, when I sidestep them (and correctly at that), If I go to punish with a sidestep strike it whiffs. What's worse is they're completely safe even if I throw.

Also if I free step and attack at the wrong time there's a chance of COMPLETE loss of tracking and i'll keep going forward as if they were still standing where they started the move from.

I know it's hard to make games like this perfect, but can we get some aerial tracking please?

This would also help with some combo issues for the characters that have chances of ending up under their opponent (there aren't many).

 

[TRI Mike]

To bring that side topic back on board. I still personally believe that the side stepping mechanic is lacking. It either needs to be sped up or a character's string should remain off-axis at any point it's side stepped unless an attack in the string is considered tracking. Of course, this is a problem for characters like Kokoro or Eliot as most of their strings are linear making it so you just have to step the first and/or second attack and they'll have to stop and either throw punish or re-align.

But then just make some of their moves track.