"I Got No Time For You!" The General Jacky Discussion Thread
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MeanMrMustard
Active Member
Stay out of range of the wake up kick and whiff punish with 4h+k. Once they stop wake up kicking your can run up and do whatever you want to pressure with.
WINBACK
Member
Things that should be addressed in the next DoA5:U patch for Jacky, from issues that need to be fixed to a few suggestions to his move set.
LAST EDITED: 10/16/2013
MAJOR ISSUES:
-the 4P series on block (credit goes to BlackWhiteBoi for showing me this at The Fall Classic):
---4P,1P = this move has a major bug. If the opponent blocks the first hit (4P), they *cannot* crouch guard the following 1P by using Down+Guard (unless the opponent delays their 1P input). Basically, the second hit becomes unblockable if you try to do Down+Guard to block it. However, the opponent CAN block the following 1P by holding Down/Back (or Down).
Note that you also cannot Sidestep or Hold the 1P in this situation.
---4P,2K = same issue as the above. Note that the 2K follow-up gives a +10 frame advantage on hit and is 3 points of damage stronger than the 1P follow-up, so it‘s much more dangerous on hit.
---4P,K = a similar issue: if the opponent blocks the first hit (4P), they *cannot* crouch under the following K by using Down+Guard. On top of that, if the opponent attempts to crouch under it by holding either Down/Back (or Down), the following K actually HITS (even though it‘s a High attack). Yes, it hits you when you try to crouch under it. Note that 4P,K gives Jacky +2 frame advantage on block and leaves Jacky back-turned.
-----SUMMARY OF THE ABOVE: so the 4P (on block) mix-up against Jacky is: if you think Jacky is going to do 4P,2K and you attempt to hold Down/Back (or Down) to crouch guard the second part, and instead he does 4P,K, then the following K will hit you. Now alternatively, if you just stand there and block high against Jacky, then you're left open to being hit by the 4P,2K or if they do 4P,K instead and you block the following K then you're now at -2 frame disadvantage against Jacky.
This is pretty dumb and should be fixed so that you can crouch guard or crouch under the 4P follow-ups normally after blocking the 4P.
-the P,P,4P,K string (credit goes to Kurt for his input on this):
---P,P,4P,K = the last two hits of this string have the same "4P,K" issue listed above. If the opponent blocks the 3rd hit of the string (the 4P), then they *cannot* use Down+Guard to duck under the 4th and final hit (the K).
However, this was actually how this string functioned in Virtua Fighter 5: Final Showdown, so it makes sense to function this way in DoA5:U. However, the two oddball things about it in DoA5:U are:
1.) Similar to the issue with the "4P,K" two-hit string listed above, after blocking the 3rd hit (4P), if the opponent attempts to crouch under it by holding either Down/Back (or Down), the following K actually HITS. This should be fixed; the opponent should not get hit for trying to crouch under this.
2.) Here's an annoying issue: if the opponent blocks the first two hits of the string (P,P) and attempts to use Down+Guard to crouch under the 3rd hit (4P), the 3rd hit will actually HIT the opponent even though it‘s a High attack. This should be fixed.
Note that the opponent CAN use Down/Back (or Down) to crouch under the 3rd hit (4P) after blocking the first two (P,P). Another thing the opponent can do to go underneath the 3rd hit is to quickly do an attack that goes under Highs in the early start-up frames (such as a 2P).
-things related to Pak Sao:
---certain throws that change entirely when done on Counter or Hi-Counter (such as Tina’s T, her While Standing 64T, or Hayabusa’s 46T) do not change at all when done on Jacky when he is in a neutral position, although he is in Hi-Counter status due to Pak Sao.
---in some situations where the opponent throws Jacky, Jacky will receive Hi-Counter damage when it doesn’t make sense, most likely due to Pak Sao putting Jacky in a Hi-Counter state whenever he is considered to be in a neutral position.
Below are four examples of this...
1.) Have Rachel do her 66T Offensive Hold on Jacky, and once behind him have her immediately do her 6T throw. Rachel will do a back throw and Jacky will receive Hi-Counter damage even if he holds the Guard button. Note that you can’t even crouch to avoid Rachel’s 6T in this situation.
2.) Have Mila or Hitomi do their respective 6T throws (which leaves them at a large frame advantage) on Jacky. After the throw, delay slightly and then do another 6T so that you grab Jacky almost immediately after the previous 6T. If you time it perfectly, Jacky will receive Hi-Counter damage even if he holds the Guard button. This seems easier to do with Mila.
3.) As Hayabusa, block Jacky’s 1P+K,P,K (which puts Jacky at -7). Immediately after blocking it, do Hayabusa’s 6T throw (which is a 6-frame throw). This is a guaranteed punish no matter what Jacky does, but for whatever reason, Jacky receives Hi-Counter damage *unless* he holds the Guard button.
4.) Have La Mariposa/Lisa do her P+K attack against Jacky on block. This will guard break and put Jacky at -5. Immediately after Mariposa does P+K, have her do her T throw (which is a 4-frame throw). If you time it perfectly, Jacky will receive Hi-Counter damage even if he holds the Guard button (credit goes to Ain Lin for pointing out this occurrence).
-Tag Battle related:
---Ground Attack Tag = Jacky’s “Ground Attack Tag” appears to be buggy and unfinished (it has some weird 8H+K-looking animation). You can even do odd Tag juggles with it. To see what it looks like, play Tag Battle and have Jacky as your partner. Knock the opponent off of their feet and then input 8H+P+K to have Jacky come in with a Ground Attack. Observe the weirdness. *****FIXED IN VER.1.03*****
---default Tag Throw = when Jacky’s partner does a default Tag Throw to him, Jacky's throw will do 55 points of damage on Normal, Counter *AND* Hi-Counter. He can never get the additional damage bonus of a Counter or Hi-Counter default Tag Throw from his partner.
Note that other characters in DoA5:U also have this same issue when their partners do a default Tag Throw to them (namely Akira, Alpha, Brad, Christie, Eliot, Hayate, Hitomi, Kokoro, Mariposa, Momiji and Rig).
-Tracking related:
---the second hit of Jacky’s 4P,K tracks, but the 4th hit of Jacky’s P,P,4P,K does *not*. This should be fixed so that they both track.
---the 3rd hit of Jacky’s P,P,K string tracks, but the 3rd hit of 6P,P,K (and the 5th hit of P,P,6P,P,K) does *not*. This should be fixed so that they both track, which is also how they functioned in Virtua Fighter 5: Final Showdown.
However, for the sake of balance, this could affect the tracking on the 3rd hits of Jacky’s 6P,P,P and 6P,P,2K (and the 5th hits of their respective P,P,6P versions), which were only half-circular in VF5:FS.
-Lightning Kicks (2H+K,K,K,K,K) related:
---when Jacky hits someone against the wall with Lightning Kicks, his “special animation” after the 5th hit makes him unable to guard, and in some situations the opponent has enough time (after being hit into the wall) to recover from the ground and hit him for free. My suggestion is: this move, when a wall hit occurs, should have no special animation for Jacky so that he can guard and avoid guaranteed damage. This would be similar to how Jann Lee’s 236K and his 46K do not do his usual special animations afterwards when the opponent is knocked into a wall.
MINOR ISSUES and SUGGESTIONS FOR IMPROVEMENT:
-Pak Sao = is currently 0 on hit, but it should be better than that. For comparison, in VF5: Final Showdown it was +10 on hit.
-H+K,K = the 2nd hit of this should Trip Stun from tip-range, similar to what Sarah‘s 3H+K currently does at tip-range in DoA5:U. For comparison, in VF5:FS the second hit of Jacky’s K+G,K would actually knock down the opponent at ANY range and still do full damage, as opposed to DoA5:U where it only does 50% of it's normal damage at tip-range and doesn't knock down at all.
-8H+K = a few changes, because as of now it's pretty useless:
---it is currently -1 on block, but it should be better than that. For comparison, in VF5:FS it was 0 on block at closer ranges and +1 on block from further ranges.
---make it completely invulnerable to lows once he's airborne. Currently, many low attacks will still hit Jacky when he is well off of the ground.
---make it a Middle attack, not a High which it currently is. In VF5:FS, it was a Mid.
---and finally, if it becomes a Mid attack, ensure that the attack-box on 8H+K can reliably hit opponents that are doing a Low Wake-Up Kick. (I was originally going to suggest this last change for 8K, but I feel with the decent start-up, good range, and great safety that 8K already has, the buff should go to 8H+K to make it more useful.)
-Slide Shuffle H+K = it is currently -1 on block, but it should be better than that. For comparison, in VF5:FS it was 0 on block.
-Fire Darts (both the "Slide Shuffle~Ducking" version and the "While Running" version) = is currently -2 on block, but it should be better than that. For comparison, in VF5:FS it was +6 on block.
---(with back to foe) 2P or (with back to foe) 2K = one of these two moves should have Tracking ability. For comparison, in VF5:FS they were both half-circular moves (and they each covered a different side). I would recommend the 2K simply because of the circular animation.
---(when facing a wall) 3P+K = the range on this is horrible compared to how it was in VF5:FS. It should travel much further. Also, like in VF5:FS, it should have Tracking.
-a list of Jacky's Throws that should have the "Ground Hazard" ability (ex. shocking the opponent on the electric floor in the "Lab" stage; busting through the floor grate in the "Fuel" stage, etc.) = 46T, 66T (Wall version only) and his Throw to foe's back.
-a list of Jacky's Throws and Holds that should have the ability to knock the opponent off of ledges = 46T and High Kick Hold.
-"Special K.O." effect = Jacky currently has no moves that cause a "Special K.O." effect (the slow-motion effect with a unique camera angle) when used as the final hit to K.O. the opponent. Some examples of characters and moves that can do this are: Hitomi's 236P, Hayabusa's Izuna Drop, and Akira's 466P+K.
---suggestions for which of Jacky's moves should have this effect = 3P,P,P (final hit only), 6K, 66K, 7K, 46H+K, Slide Shuffle P, Fire Darts (both the While Running version and the Slide Shuffle~Ducking version) and High Kick Hold.
Note that the moves suggested above are what would cause the "Super Replay" effect in Virtua Fighter 5 and VF5: Final Showdown when they were used as the final hit to K.O. the opponent. (Jacky's High Kick Hold is basically the old Virtua Fighter 5 version of Pak Sao, which had the Super Replay effect.)
Questions? Comments?
I don't use Twitter, so if someone hasn't sent the major issues to Team Ninja already, they should.
LAST EDITED: 10/16/2013
MAJOR ISSUES:
-the 4P series on block (credit goes to BlackWhiteBoi for showing me this at The Fall Classic):
---4P,1P = this move has a major bug. If the opponent blocks the first hit (4P), they *cannot* crouch guard the following 1P by using Down+Guard (unless the opponent delays their 1P input). Basically, the second hit becomes unblockable if you try to do Down+Guard to block it. However, the opponent CAN block the following 1P by holding Down/Back (or Down).
Note that you also cannot Sidestep or Hold the 1P in this situation.
---4P,2K = same issue as the above. Note that the 2K follow-up gives a +10 frame advantage on hit and is 3 points of damage stronger than the 1P follow-up, so it‘s much more dangerous on hit.
---4P,K = a similar issue: if the opponent blocks the first hit (4P), they *cannot* crouch under the following K by using Down+Guard. On top of that, if the opponent attempts to crouch under it by holding either Down/Back (or Down), the following K actually HITS (even though it‘s a High attack). Yes, it hits you when you try to crouch under it. Note that 4P,K gives Jacky +2 frame advantage on block and leaves Jacky back-turned.
-----SUMMARY OF THE ABOVE: so the 4P (on block) mix-up against Jacky is: if you think Jacky is going to do 4P,2K and you attempt to hold Down/Back (or Down) to crouch guard the second part, and instead he does 4P,K, then the following K will hit you. Now alternatively, if you just stand there and block high against Jacky, then you're left open to being hit by the 4P,2K or if they do 4P,K instead and you block the following K then you're now at -2 frame disadvantage against Jacky.
This is pretty dumb and should be fixed so that you can crouch guard or crouch under the 4P follow-ups normally after blocking the 4P.
-the P,P,4P,K string (credit goes to Kurt for his input on this):
---P,P,4P,K = the last two hits of this string have the same "4P,K" issue listed above. If the opponent blocks the 3rd hit of the string (the 4P), then they *cannot* use Down+Guard to duck under the 4th and final hit (the K).
However, this was actually how this string functioned in Virtua Fighter 5: Final Showdown, so it makes sense to function this way in DoA5:U. However, the two oddball things about it in DoA5:U are:
1.) Similar to the issue with the "4P,K" two-hit string listed above, after blocking the 3rd hit (4P), if the opponent attempts to crouch under it by holding either Down/Back (or Down), the following K actually HITS. This should be fixed; the opponent should not get hit for trying to crouch under this.
2.) Here's an annoying issue: if the opponent blocks the first two hits of the string (P,P) and attempts to use Down+Guard to crouch under the 3rd hit (4P), the 3rd hit will actually HIT the opponent even though it‘s a High attack. This should be fixed.
Note that the opponent CAN use Down/Back (or Down) to crouch under the 3rd hit (4P) after blocking the first two (P,P). Another thing the opponent can do to go underneath the 3rd hit is to quickly do an attack that goes under Highs in the early start-up frames (such as a 2P).
-things related to Pak Sao:
---certain throws that change entirely when done on Counter or Hi-Counter (such as Tina’s T, her While Standing 64T, or Hayabusa’s 46T) do not change at all when done on Jacky when he is in a neutral position, although he is in Hi-Counter status due to Pak Sao.
---in some situations where the opponent throws Jacky, Jacky will receive Hi-Counter damage when it doesn’t make sense, most likely due to Pak Sao putting Jacky in a Hi-Counter state whenever he is considered to be in a neutral position.
Below are four examples of this...
1.) Have Rachel do her 66T Offensive Hold on Jacky, and once behind him have her immediately do her 6T throw. Rachel will do a back throw and Jacky will receive Hi-Counter damage even if he holds the Guard button. Note that you can’t even crouch to avoid Rachel’s 6T in this situation.
2.) Have Mila or Hitomi do their respective 6T throws (which leaves them at a large frame advantage) on Jacky. After the throw, delay slightly and then do another 6T so that you grab Jacky almost immediately after the previous 6T. If you time it perfectly, Jacky will receive Hi-Counter damage even if he holds the Guard button. This seems easier to do with Mila.
3.) As Hayabusa, block Jacky’s 1P+K,P,K (which puts Jacky at -7). Immediately after blocking it, do Hayabusa’s 6T throw (which is a 6-frame throw). This is a guaranteed punish no matter what Jacky does, but for whatever reason, Jacky receives Hi-Counter damage *unless* he holds the Guard button.
4.) Have La Mariposa/Lisa do her P+K attack against Jacky on block. This will guard break and put Jacky at -5. Immediately after Mariposa does P+K, have her do her T throw (which is a 4-frame throw). If you time it perfectly, Jacky will receive Hi-Counter damage even if he holds the Guard button (credit goes to Ain Lin for pointing out this occurrence).
-Tag Battle related:
---Ground Attack Tag = Jacky’s “Ground Attack Tag” appears to be buggy and unfinished (it has some weird 8H+K-looking animation). You can even do odd Tag juggles with it. To see what it looks like, play Tag Battle and have Jacky as your partner. Knock the opponent off of their feet and then input 8H+P+K to have Jacky come in with a Ground Attack. Observe the weirdness. *****FIXED IN VER.1.03*****
---default Tag Throw = when Jacky’s partner does a default Tag Throw to him, Jacky's throw will do 55 points of damage on Normal, Counter *AND* Hi-Counter. He can never get the additional damage bonus of a Counter or Hi-Counter default Tag Throw from his partner.
Note that other characters in DoA5:U also have this same issue when their partners do a default Tag Throw to them (namely Akira, Alpha, Brad, Christie, Eliot, Hayate, Hitomi, Kokoro, Mariposa, Momiji and Rig).
-Tracking related:
---the second hit of Jacky’s 4P,K tracks, but the 4th hit of Jacky’s P,P,4P,K does *not*. This should be fixed so that they both track.
---the 3rd hit of Jacky’s P,P,K string tracks, but the 3rd hit of 6P,P,K (and the 5th hit of P,P,6P,P,K) does *not*. This should be fixed so that they both track, which is also how they functioned in Virtua Fighter 5: Final Showdown.
However, for the sake of balance, this could affect the tracking on the 3rd hits of Jacky’s 6P,P,P and 6P,P,2K (and the 5th hits of their respective P,P,6P versions), which were only half-circular in VF5:FS.
-Lightning Kicks (2H+K,K,K,K,K) related:
---when Jacky hits someone against the wall with Lightning Kicks, his “special animation” after the 5th hit makes him unable to guard, and in some situations the opponent has enough time (after being hit into the wall) to recover from the ground and hit him for free. My suggestion is: this move, when a wall hit occurs, should have no special animation for Jacky so that he can guard and avoid guaranteed damage. This would be similar to how Jann Lee’s 236K and his 46K do not do his usual special animations afterwards when the opponent is knocked into a wall.
MINOR ISSUES and SUGGESTIONS FOR IMPROVEMENT:
-Pak Sao = is currently 0 on hit, but it should be better than that. For comparison, in VF5: Final Showdown it was +10 on hit.
-H+K,K = the 2nd hit of this should Trip Stun from tip-range, similar to what Sarah‘s 3H+K currently does at tip-range in DoA5:U. For comparison, in VF5:FS the second hit of Jacky’s K+G,K would actually knock down the opponent at ANY range and still do full damage, as opposed to DoA5:U where it only does 50% of it's normal damage at tip-range and doesn't knock down at all.
-8H+K = a few changes, because as of now it's pretty useless:
---it is currently -1 on block, but it should be better than that. For comparison, in VF5:FS it was 0 on block at closer ranges and +1 on block from further ranges.
---make it completely invulnerable to lows once he's airborne. Currently, many low attacks will still hit Jacky when he is well off of the ground.
---make it a Middle attack, not a High which it currently is. In VF5:FS, it was a Mid.
---and finally, if it becomes a Mid attack, ensure that the attack-box on 8H+K can reliably hit opponents that are doing a Low Wake-Up Kick. (I was originally going to suggest this last change for 8K, but I feel with the decent start-up, good range, and great safety that 8K already has, the buff should go to 8H+K to make it more useful.)
-Slide Shuffle H+K = it is currently -1 on block, but it should be better than that. For comparison, in VF5:FS it was 0 on block.
-Fire Darts (both the "Slide Shuffle~Ducking" version and the "While Running" version) = is currently -2 on block, but it should be better than that. For comparison, in VF5:FS it was +6 on block.
---(with back to foe) 2P or (with back to foe) 2K = one of these two moves should have Tracking ability. For comparison, in VF5:FS they were both half-circular moves (and they each covered a different side). I would recommend the 2K simply because of the circular animation.
---(when facing a wall) 3P+K = the range on this is horrible compared to how it was in VF5:FS. It should travel much further. Also, like in VF5:FS, it should have Tracking.
-a list of Jacky's Throws that should have the "Ground Hazard" ability (ex. shocking the opponent on the electric floor in the "Lab" stage; busting through the floor grate in the "Fuel" stage, etc.) = 46T, 66T (Wall version only) and his Throw to foe's back.
-a list of Jacky's Throws and Holds that should have the ability to knock the opponent off of ledges = 46T and High Kick Hold.
-"Special K.O." effect = Jacky currently has no moves that cause a "Special K.O." effect (the slow-motion effect with a unique camera angle) when used as the final hit to K.O. the opponent. Some examples of characters and moves that can do this are: Hitomi's 236P, Hayabusa's Izuna Drop, and Akira's 466P+K.
---suggestions for which of Jacky's moves should have this effect = 3P,P,P (final hit only), 6K, 66K, 7K, 46H+K, Slide Shuffle P, Fire Darts (both the While Running version and the Slide Shuffle~Ducking version) and High Kick Hold.
Note that the moves suggested above are what would cause the "Super Replay" effect in Virtua Fighter 5 and VF5: Final Showdown when they were used as the final hit to K.O. the opponent. (Jacky's High Kick Hold is basically the old Virtua Fighter 5 version of Pak Sao, which had the Super Replay effect.)
Questions? Comments?
I don't use Twitter, so if someone hasn't sent the major issues to Team Ninja already, they should.
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Zekiel
New Member
@WINBACK Nice job you noticed the same things most jacky players see. But add one more thing. BTK or turn kick goes into Slide shuffle. TN needs to change the move from a knockdown to a critical stun. In VF5FS you can combo from BTK~SS with SSP on CH. This would make his 44p on CH(+4) more useful for BT combo set ups.
Also switch Jacky's SS command 4P+K and make Long stride be 44P+K. In VF5FS Jacky's SS is a one input move not 2. (4P+K+G). The reason why i say this is because using his sabaki is extremely difficult when guarding. It takes to long and instead of pulling off a sabaki i eat a CH. Lame
Also switch Jacky's SS command 4P+K and make Long stride be 44P+K. In VF5FS Jacky's SS is a one input move not 2. (4P+K+G). The reason why i say this is because using his sabaki is extremely difficult when guarding. It takes to long and instead of pulling off a sabaki i eat a CH. Lame
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WINBACK The PP6PK series in VF doesn't work the same way as 6P series, you can not crouch under the high when jacky does PP6PK in VF unlike the 6P series, and it pretty much makes sense, since the recovery on the 6p of PP series is huge, and that you can not go for 2K and 2P mix up.I also add that + 2 on block is not that great since jacky doesn't have fast mid or fast low when he is backturned, he can only jab you, once the guy knows he has to go for high crush or fast low attacks, there is not much you can do to maintain pressure.
I agree that they should buff his anti low attacks, Wake up kicks is really annoying to deal with him for the reasons you said, and even that 8 K is crap, is does go above lows but doesn't hit crouched opponents, and it is suposed to be a middle attack for god sake.
Also they shoud buff 1P+KP,P, the last P in VFFS doesn't Knock down, it pushes back on normal hit and on counter hit you can combo out of it, it would be pretty fair for a move that is minus 16 on block and that it stuns on counter hit. There is also a big problem with his 46 K+G, there is nothing you can follow up when it hits because the recovery is too long. I also have the same problem with 44P+K K, when it hits on counter hit, it's very hard to follow up with a move. Also there is no use of using 4 when you use P+KK, PPK, 3KPK, in VF, you can follow up with P and beat any fast mids or jabs, in this game any P or 6P will interrupt you.
I agree that they should buff his anti low attacks, Wake up kicks is really annoying to deal with him for the reasons you said, and even that 8 K is crap, is does go above lows but doesn't hit crouched opponents, and it is suposed to be a middle attack for god sake.
Also they shoud buff 1P+KP,P, the last P in VFFS doesn't Knock down, it pushes back on normal hit and on counter hit you can combo out of it, it would be pretty fair for a move that is minus 16 on block and that it stuns on counter hit. There is also a big problem with his 46 K+G, there is nothing you can follow up when it hits because the recovery is too long. I also have the same problem with 44P+K K, when it hits on counter hit, it's very hard to follow up with a move. Also there is no use of using 4 when you use P+KK, PPK, 3KPK, in VF, you can follow up with P and beat any fast mids or jabs, in this game any P or 6P will interrupt you.
Kurt
New Member
-P,P,4P,K string is fine, its the same from VF5, if you block the 4P, the K is not duckable
-Lightning Kicks are fine, those Kicks are not meant for poking or Combo Finishers
My suggestions:
-Frame Adjusting, Jacky seems to be rushed/poorly converted from VF, Akira/Sarah/Pai
is +1 on Hit, why not Jackys, Beat Knuckle - on Hit etc.
-Overall Damage buff, some moves like or deal pathetic damage, other moves like BT or send the opponent miles away, with no chance of OKI, but damage is very low.
-Pak Sao, Jacky should have +Advantage
-Slide Shuffle Command should be changed, is way too complicated
- for the love of god, give him those "Swoooosh" Soundeffects back
-"Northern Light Bomb" low kick Hold, WTF, damage is low, AND attack knocks Jacky down too
-Buff Fire Darts, they seem to have no priority at all, its a violent jumping kick after all, but gets interrupted all day by all sort of attacks, AND - on Block too
Do something with those useless Moves:
-BT
-Beat Knuckle, negative on hit, follow ups are both high,
-66K, spins the opponent, but easily slow escapable, pushes too far away, so no pressure
Jacky pretty much has the same problem from VF5, Standing Guard beats all of Jackys options, Low Guard beats all of Jackys BT options. His lows are weak, nothing new, but now he additionaly got a low damage output, crappy range for whiff punishing and completely absent WakeUp.
-Lightning Kicks are fine, those Kicks are not meant for poking or Combo Finishers
My suggestions:
-Frame Adjusting, Jacky seems to be rushed/poorly converted from VF, Akira/Sarah/Pai
is +1 on Hit, why not Jackys, Beat Knuckle - on Hit etc.-Overall Damage buff, some moves like
or deal pathetic damage, other moves like BT or send the opponent miles away, with no chance of OKI, but damage is very low.-Pak Sao, Jacky should have +Advantage
-Slide Shuffle Command should be changed,
is way too complicated- for the love of god, give him those "Swoooosh" Soundeffects back
-"Northern Light Bomb" low kick Hold, WTF, damage is low, AND attack knocks Jacky down too
-Buff Fire Darts, they seem to have no priority at all, its a violent jumping kick after all, but gets interrupted all day by all sort of attacks, AND - on Block too
Do something with those useless Moves:
-BT
-Beat Knuckle, negative on hit, follow ups are both high,
-66K, spins the opponent, but easily slow escapable, pushes too far away, so no pressure
Jacky pretty much has the same problem from VF5, Standing Guard beats all of Jackys options, Low Guard beats all of Jackys BT options. His lows are weak, nothing new, but now he additionaly got a low damage output, crappy range for whiff punishing and completely absent WakeUp.
WINBACK
Member
Ver.1.03 patch is out.
http://teamninja-studio.com/doa5/ultimate/us/information/info_20131015.html
Mentioned in the change log is a bug that involved Jacky in Free Training Mode.
Also, Jacky has a new page in his Command List for "Back-Facing Strikes". However it still doesn't mention his jump-off-the-wall moves, which I posted on page 5 of this thread.
The only unlisted change I've found so far is that Jacky's Ground Attack Tag is now fixed; it's no longer goofy as hell. I noted that in my post above.
http://teamninja-studio.com/doa5/ultimate/us/information/info_20131015.html
Mentioned in the change log is a bug that involved Jacky in Free Training Mode.
Also, Jacky has a new page in his Command List for "Back-Facing Strikes". However it still doesn't mention his jump-off-the-wall moves, which I posted on page 5 of this thread.
The only unlisted change I've found so far is that Jacky's Ground Attack Tag is now fixed; it's no longer goofy as hell. I noted that in my post above.
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Found a cool reset with Jacky yesterday. Basically, on threshold lvl 2 or 3, you do the simple bnb ( Launch, two ground bounces ) and then on the 2nd gb your gonna do . What this is gonna do is leave you at +11 when your opponent techs, and if they don't tech, they're getting force teched. Now, if they don't tech, and get up at the right time, they can evade the force tech, but they can't get up too slow or too fast, or else they're getting bopped by the force tech ()
For those who don't know the bnb's for jacky based on what im talking about: Threshold lvl 2: or , , ,,
Lvl 3: Launch like before,,,,. At the end of both of these combos, you can do the reset. If you do the wihout the sidestep cancel, you can get a guaranteed force tech if they don't tech.
. What this is gonna do is leave you at +11 when your opponent techs, and if they don't tech, they're getting force teched. Now, if they don't tech, and get up at the right time, they can evade the force tech, but they can't get up too slow or too fast, or else they're getting bopped by the force tech () For those who don't know the bnb's for jacky based on what im talking about: Threshold lvl 2:
or , , ,, Lvl 3: Launch like before,
,,,. At the end of both of these combos, you can do the reset. If you do the wihout the sidestep cancel, you can get a guaranteed force tech if they don't tech.
Nuke-Nin
Well-Known Member
I liked your post and even read it, we fought today and im like "He saw that amazing post in the jacky thread too?!" LOl i didn't know it was YOU!Found a cool reset with Jacky yesterday. Basically, on threshold lvl 2 or 3, you do the simple bnb ( Launch, two ground bounces ) and then on the 2nd gb your gonna do
For those who don't know the bnb's for jacky based on what im talking about: Threshold lvl 2:
Lvl 3: Launch like before,
lol yea its the same person.
Ok fellas/ladies, found a cool guaranteed reset with Jacky near the wall. If you do into BT'd , you get a guaranteed low followup if they slow-escape.. if they don't, it'll combo. Same properties on both situations. The opponent can counter after the but they have 1/3 of a chance to get it right. If you do his BT'd after you can get a guaranteed wall splat which will also combo if they don't slow-escape. I've tried this setup multiple times on myself, the cpu and a fellow friend of mine (Shade Swifteye) in a Online Dojo. It was never evaded. I believe its because leaves the opponent BT'd with no time to turn around and block. This setup is not hard to do at all really.. but you still have to be careful because walls can get a bit weird in this game. But its definitely worth using in a match.
into BT'd , you get a guaranteed low followup if they slow-escape.. if they don't, it'll combo. Same properties on both situations. The opponent can counter after the but they have 1/3 of a chance to get it right. If you do his BT'd after you can get a guaranteed wall splat which will also combo if they don't slow-escape. I've tried this setup multiple times on myself, the cpu and a fellow friend of mine (Shade Swifteye) in a Online Dojo. It was never evaded. I believe its because leaves the opponent BT'd with no time to turn around and block. This setup is not hard to do at all really.. but you still have to be careful because walls can get a bit weird in this game. But its definitely worth using in a match.
WINBACK
Member
1.04 change log is out.
http://freestepdodge.com/threads/dead-or-alive-5-ultimate-arcade-ver-1-04-change-log.4013/
" General Changes
Jacky
http://freestepdodge.com/threads/dead-or-alive-5-ultimate-arcade-ver-1-04-change-log.4013/
" General Changes
- Improved the input feel of 33T command for certain characters.
- Improved the input feel for certain moves with changing recovery.
- Certain moves that could not be done from a crouching state can now be done.
- For Criticals from from back-turn, fixed issue where after turning around, Holds could not be performed from a standing state.
- Backdraft danger zone are now easier to use in combos.
- After connecting with certain strike from back-turn that force knockdown, opponent is downed closer.
Fixed issue where the frame advantage of certain low attacks on normal hit had a difference in foot position.
Jacky
- 3K: Command reception adjusted.
- Crouching walk, back-turn walk speed adjusted.
- 2P: Recovery when the move does not hit reduced by 2F.
- 8P+KP: Recovery when the move does not hit reduced by 3F.
- Slide Shuffle P: start-up reduced by 2F.
- 6P: Guard advantage changed from -5 to -7F, Normal hit advantage changed from 0 to -6F.
- 4P: Guard advanatage changed from -1 to -3.
- 4P2K: start-up changed to 21F.
- 1P+K: Damage increased from 16 to 18.
- 1P+KP: Damage increased from 13 to 16.
- 1P+KPP: Damage increased from 20 to 23.
- 1P+KPK: Damage increased from 23 to 26.
- 1P+KK: Damage increase from 22 to 24.
- 7K: Damage increased from 45 to 50.
- 2_3P: Damage reduced from 20 to 19.
- 6K: Damage increased from 20 to 21.
- Mid P Hold: Damage increased from 38 to 40.
- While in neutral, being caught by an OH (Offensive Hold) now causes a Counter Hit instead of a Hi Counter Hit. (Adjusted due to Jacky entering
- Pakusao while in front-facing neutral, which has Hold properties)
- 1F after returning to netural, Pakusao reception begins.
- When hit during Side Slide Shuffle, fixed bug that cause the attack to hit behind.
WINBACK
Member
-3K...so was I not the only person here who would occasionally get '2K' whenever they tried to do this move in a clinch? Because I feel like that's what the change log is addressing. I sometimes had a problem inputting '33T' when I would play other characters, but never had these problems in the older games.
-not sure what to make of his Crouching Walk speed getting fixed.
-2P and 8P+K,P will be better on whiff. That's nice and all, but did we really need this over a lot of other stuff they could've addressed?
-6K is now stronger by 1 point. Again, not sure where that came from, but okay.
-Slide Shuffle P will be i13 now. That's nice.
-no longer getting hit from behind during Side Slide Shuffle is good too.
-1P+K series and 7K got damage boosts, so that'll add a few more points to combo damage and stun game. I don't really think a lot of people use 7K raw.
-about Pak Sao...taking only "Counter" damage from Offensive Holds while in neutral is a plus; but I still hate the whole Hi-Counter status thing in general. Pak Sao isn't even good enough to justify such a dumb mechanic, especially because of those occurrences where you still take Hi-Counter damage even when holding Guard (see post #123 of this thread to see what I mean, under the "things related to Pak Sao" section).
However, I'm hoping that the change that says "1F after returning to netural, Pakusao reception begins" will fix those occurrences. I'll just stay positive.
-looks like 6P,P; 4P,2P; and 4P,2K block-pressure got raped; I guess we had this coming. It makes him more fair, but taking a big hit in the cheapness department is definitely gonna bring Jacky down a few pegs compared to other characters.
-23P is now weaker by 1 point. Did they do this so it would lose to 20-point moves on clash or something? I'm not sure if this is a big deal; I don't even use this outside of combos.
Other than 64T and (wall) 46T, I feel like Jacky's Throws and Holds suck ass. I was hoping for a slight damage buff in those areas (much like what Ein got) but making his MP Hold stronger by 2 points is better than nothin'.
-not sure what to make of his Crouching Walk speed getting fixed.
-2P and 8P+K,P will be better on whiff. That's nice and all, but did we really need this over a lot of other stuff they could've addressed?
-6K is now stronger by 1 point. Again, not sure where that came from, but okay.
-Slide Shuffle P will be i13 now. That's nice.
-no longer getting hit from behind during Side Slide Shuffle is good too.
-1P+K series and 7K got damage boosts, so that'll add a few more points to combo damage and stun game. I don't really think a lot of people use 7K raw.
-about Pak Sao...taking only "Counter" damage from Offensive Holds while in neutral is a plus; but I still hate the whole Hi-Counter status thing in general. Pak Sao isn't even good enough to justify such a dumb mechanic, especially because of those occurrences where you still take Hi-Counter damage even when holding Guard (see post #123 of this thread to see what I mean, under the "things related to Pak Sao" section).
However, I'm hoping that the change that says "1F after returning to netural, Pakusao reception begins" will fix those occurrences. I'll just stay positive.
-looks like 6P,P; 4P,2P; and 4P,2K block-pressure got raped; I guess we had this coming. It makes him more fair, but taking a big hit in the cheapness department is definitely gonna bring Jacky down a few pegs compared to other characters.
-23P is now weaker by 1 point. Did they do this so it would lose to 20-point moves on clash or something? I'm not sure if this is a big deal; I don't even use this outside of combos.
Other than 64T and (wall) 46T, I feel like Jacky's Throws and Holds suck ass. I was hoping for a slight damage buff in those areas (much like what Ein got) but making his MP Hold stronger by 2 points is better than nothin'.
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Jin Masters
Member
the nerfed crouching walk speed, back-turned is to remove the glitch...
ie. perform 44p, then while back turned do 141414141414141414 and see how far and fast you move back
ie. perform 44p, then while back turned do 141414141414141414 and see how far and fast you move back
His 1P+K series is a nerf bud, not a buff. On the DOA5U build on Xbox those strings do 30+. This is a buff to a nerf basically. And i use 7K after i do his power launcher and 4 FSK's into 2 4H+K's. It does like 150-160 on normal hit, this is a great buff for him especially near walls as well, it does quite a bit of damage near walls. And i don't know if you know this... but Hold 2_3P is a high crush and on counter hit you can do FSK into 4H+K twice into 1P+KPP
KidArk
Active Member
Sounds like the 360 version is bugged over here on ps3 all those strings do exactly how much they say it does therefore it's a buff to me and destruction bomb