The Official Dead or Alive 5 Tier List with Discussion thread
- Thread starter Matt Ponton
- Start date
Murakame
Active Member
This sounds like Gen Fu has the advantage at close range because he can shut down Jann Lee's offense with parries while maintaining offensive pressure whereas Jann Lee really only has throws as an alternative to strikes in any attempt to open Gen Fu up IMO.
Lobo
Active Member
I'd say its dead even. Gen Fu beats Jann up close (he beats everyone really, except for maybe Leifang). His mids are a tad faster, and he has really good crushes that can stop Jann's pokes. He can also parry at disadvantage, to put the pressure back on. And we all know that all Gen needs is one hit to set up his sit-down stun nonsense.
However, I think Jann is one of the few chars that can slow down Gen's up-close game. Jann's mid-punch hold is Gen Fu's worst nightmare, as it completely changes the advantage to Jann's favor.
Jann also has better spacing, so a good Jann can just turtle outside of Gen Fu's optimal range, bait an unsafe move or whiff, and punish with a dragon gunner.
So I can't see it being but a 5-5 matchup (maybe 5.1-4.9 in Gen's favor)
However, I think Jann is one of the few chars that can slow down Gen's up-close game. Jann's mid-punch hold is Gen Fu's worst nightmare, as it completely changes the advantage to Jann's favor.
Jann also has better spacing, so a good Jann can just turtle outside of Gen Fu's optimal range, bait an unsafe move or whiff, and punish with a dragon gunner.
So I can't see it being but a 5-5 matchup (maybe 5.1-4.9 in Gen's favor)
HiguraShiki
Active Member
Gen Fu is like a strike oriented Bass. His air grab eliminates wakeup kicks.
Jefffcore
Well-Known Member
Actually Jann's mids are faster; only thing Gen Fu has on Jann is his 11i high kick.
I went through his move list to see if I was missing something and the only sit down I found was 3pp. It doesn't give him a guaranteed CB, and it ends a string that's insanely easy to see. Gen Fu's also got a feint stun and a Limbo, same as Jann. Jann definitely plays the stun game better.
Jann has an offensive hold, better spacing, and more damage on Gen, where Gen Fu can crush and parry.
Gen Fu doesn't have any mix up's in his strings and they're stupid easy to stop. Just sayin'.
I'd give it to Jann. Not by a huge margin, but Jann doesn't have to guess as much.
Omegan Eckhart
Well-Known Member
Thinking of Gen Fu seeing as he has a grab that launches couldn't he set up pseudo force tech set ups similar to Helena? I can't imagine it would be as effective but would it be possible?
JAG THE GEMINI
Active Member
Gen Fu was always a High/top character... It´s about even between Jann lee and Genf Fu in DOA5
P1naatt1ke1tt0
Active Member
How do you escape counter hit 3pp 33p 3p+k? The CB is pretty much guaranteed after second p of 3pp connects. And 3pp ducks highs as well.
HiguraShiki
Active Member
Gen Fu can be pretty bs though. For an old man, he has some of the fastest and hard to see attacks in the game.
Lobo
Active Member
Not necessarily. If the first punch 3PP hits on CH (which it does most of the time because it crushes highs), then you have just one shot to hold the second P (again somewhat hard to do if you were pressing something to get CH in the first place).
Once that second P hits, the CB is all but guaranteed. Ransuu showed me that it is possible to slow escape, but its insanely hard, and the CPU cant even do it with stagger set to fastest. I have yet to have a single person escape the CB after CH 3PP.
If they get wise and start holding the second P, then you can just delay the second P since most of Gen's strings can be delayed forever. Or, you can go straight for launch with 8P or H+K or a hi-counter 236T. Or, if you're in open stance, do 9K and now you have another guaranteed CB.
Gen has just as many options for his stun game. The fact that most people think he's all mid punches just helps him get away with more BS like his open stance 9K.
Jefffcore
Well-Known Member
You're right, Raansu must not have input it fast enough when he recorded. 3pp is the easiest thing to hold on reaction though. It shouldn't matter if you delay it for 2 reasons: first, he only has 1 follow up after it ;second, he gives you ample time to see and react to it. He move his arm back more when you input the second punch, it's kinada slow.
I couldn't get anything from 9K
I couldn't get anything from 9K
Lobo
Active Member
If you hit 9K in open stance, then you're opponent is left BT close enough for 6P+K to hit. When 6P+K hits a BT opponent, it causes a limbo stun.
Try this combo, and you'll see how good 9K is.
(open stance) 9K, 6P+K, 236P, 33P, 3P+K (CB) All of that, including the CB, is guaranteed if 9K hits open.
Try this combo, and you'll see how good 9K is.
(open stance) 9K, 6P+K, 236P, 33P, 3P+K (CB) All of that, including the CB, is guaranteed if 9K hits open.
HiguraShiki
Active Member
It isn't too easy. Plus most Gen Fu players tend to just throw 3P then grab loop you if you try holding the 2nd P.
Jefffcore
Well-Known Member
Ohhhh ok
That's because you're guessing, you're not waiting till you see it. It is easy.
P1naatt1ke1tt0
Active Member
Open stance 9K - 6P+K - 236P - 33P - hold 3P launch is the guaranteed setup. But maybe we should end this offtopic discussion before Mr. Wah deletes the thread again.
Jefffcore
Well-Known Member
It's not technically off topic.
9K - 6P+K isn't guaranteed though; you can struggle then turn around and block or hold. It's a crazy set up if you do get it, but if you don't you're unsafe.
In comparison, Jann can guarantee 105 damage on CH/closed stance with his limbo. As far as I know.
Jann can do 154/155 (depends how long you charge 33p) with H+K, 6K, H+K, CB. If you hold he has the 50/50 with the DG that puts you back in critical. DG with 2 more guesses will get him 154/155 again or with 1 more guess 105(?) . With Gen Fu's set up he's also guessing twice (if the other player doesn't react to the 3pp) and taking 147(?) on CH. He has 236T or 214T (I couldn't get any more than 90 on HCT with 236T).
Both are difficult to get though. Gen Fu is easy to hold, and Jann has to be right up close with H+K (which is tricky against Gen)
9K - 6P+K isn't guaranteed though; you can struggle then turn around and block or hold. It's a crazy set up if you do get it, but if you don't you're unsafe.
In comparison, Jann can guarantee 105 damage on CH/closed stance with his limbo. As far as I know.
Jann can do 154/155 (depends how long you charge 33p) with H+K, 6K, H+K, CB. If you hold he has the 50/50 with the DG that puts you back in critical. DG with 2 more guesses will get him 154/155 again or with 1 more guess 105(?) . With Gen Fu's set up he's also guessing twice (if the other player doesn't react to the 3pp) and taking 147(?) on CH. He has 236T or 214T (I couldn't get any more than 90 on HCT with 236T).
Both are difficult to get though. Gen Fu is easy to hold, and Jann has to be right up close with H+K (which is tricky against Gen)
RoboJoe
Well-Known Member
The 6p+k and the 3p+k are not guaranteed, if you hit 33p go for a launch right away, forget about cb.