Tougeki Combo Exhibition!
- Thread starter PhoenixVFIRE
- Start date
Rikuto
P-P-P-P-P-P-POWER!
He said that there are more safe attacks. That alone makes me happy.
Thank you Shimbori-san.
I assume it has to do with damage needed to pop the threshold, but that can't be right... more damage was required than all of that.
Thank you Shimbori-san.
I assume it has to do with damage needed to pop the threshold, but that can't be right... more damage was required than all of that.
qoodname
Active Member
Ive seen that aswell but for some reason if youre looking at 0:38 her usual teleport parry input is there aswell if im not mistaken.
I'm really glad they upped critical threshold. This makes earning a burst a lot more challenging and reduces the repeatability. Which probably explains why they resorted to 3 different heights to launches now. I'm pretty cool with this.
In fact I like all the things mentioned. Its seems like they tore a few pages off of the VF book, which is awesome! (more reason to do a full blown crossover ... Oh pls let it be the next project after DOA5)
Also .. that Leifang/Jannlee stage .. OMG its beautiful !
As for the snow stage, Welcome back to critical stun hell, where you get a sit down but the opponent slides a bit further back screwing your offense over and every jab stuns... lol .. I can't wait to play in it
And STILL we haven't seen a big chunk of the cast....
Helena, Eliot, Brad, GenFu, Pai, Mila, LEON (or lack of >__> )
I sure hope they increase the announcements in the next few weeks.
Some of those combos are pretty delicious.
In fact I like all the things mentioned. Its seems like they tore a few pages off of the VF book, which is awesome! (more reason to do a full blown crossover ... Oh pls let it be the next project after DOA5)
Also .. that Leifang/Jannlee stage .. OMG its beautiful !
As for the snow stage, Welcome back to critical stun hell, where you get a sit down but the opponent slides a bit further back screwing your offense over and every jab stuns... lol .. I can't wait to play in it
And STILL we haven't seen a big chunk of the cast....
Helena, Eliot, Brad, GenFu, Pai, Mila, LEON (or lack of >__>
) I sure hope they increase the announcements in the next few weeks.
Some of those combos are pretty delicious.
Doug Nguyen
Well-Known Member
Ohh yeah didnt notice that. Maybe she has a expert hold parry now to or worse they made high kicks and low kicks there own input. What does Sp mean next to the move log.
Kronin
Well-Known Member
I really liked the combo video (Rig has really amazed me), and I thanks also you guys in the thread for the explanation about the technical details
I wanted just say that the video seems to give the impression that the South Pole stage is an infinite multi-level, but for now it's hard to say. And I love also that of Lei and Jann that seems to be an old temple, a stage not squared and visually really beautiful.
I wanted just say that the video seems to give the impression that the South Pole stage is an infinite multi-level, but for now it's hard to say. And I love also that of Lei and Jann that seems to be an old temple, a stage not squared and visually really beautiful.
qoodname
Active Member
You seem to understand what ''We also changed the critical threshold from 24, 30, 36 to 28, 35, 42.'' means.
Could you explain it to me cos i have no idea what hes talking about.
I have no idea what that means aswell. There is actually quite alot stuff next to the movelist. There is a PB and CB (prolly Powerblow and Critical Burst) but there is a OH at Janlees grab too. Plus there sometimes is a lock above the movelist. Damn i thought a was catching up on the game terms but i have no clue what all this stuff means lol.
DriftSlave
Active Member
im not completely sure but the number value represents each level for launcher height. the increase meaning more damage needed to get the effect, so maximum height level on a launcher you need to do 42 or more damage in stun to obtain that launch height?
i maybe completely off...but i tried to put two and two together when he said that their are 3 different height levels on launches now. Certain characters still Critical Burst really easy...so I don't think it's changed much...your still playing a guessing game before the CB(but leaps and bounds more manageable), but now the damage after the CB is good enough to train opponents to guess on the CB after they SE the sitdown/limbo stun...Mixups are going to be actual Mixups now...well I hope at least.
i maybe completely off...but i tried to put two and two together when he said that their are 3 different height levels on launches now. Certain characters still Critical Burst really easy...so I don't think it's changed much...your still playing a guessing game before the CB(but leaps and bounds more manageable), but now the damage after the CB is good enough to train opponents to guess on the CB after they SE the sitdown/limbo stun...Mixups are going to be actual Mixups now...well I hope at least.
Doug Nguyen
Well-Known Member
Dont the numbers seem a bit small. Ive never seen a critical threshold at that low of damage though.
Ok lets see...
basicly in DOA theres something called critical threshold ... this is the limit to the amount of damage you can deal when the opponent is stunned until the opponent is knocked down, or reset. and basicly you cant follow up after threshold as you lose combo count (with the exception of some minor cases).
now certain moves in DOA5 can trigger "critical burst" which is the only situation that goes against this rule. and when you pull it off at the last hit before reaching threshold, you go beyond the threshold into this special type of stun .. that stun (the critical burst stun) lets you do whatever you like after as the opponent cannot hold or slow escape for a really long time .. (this can also guarantee a powerblow)
what all those numbers mean basicly is that in order to be able to reach a critical burst state you need to dish out an extra move in stun so you can go past the critical threshold and trigger burst. This makes reaching the guaranteed situation of critical burst slightly tougher to earn.
before, if you got a high counter move u just needed like one more hit and then you got a chance to burst ... Now, with this change to the threshold limit, you probably need another extra hit in there somewhere.
This is what I pointed out in the Jan Lee vs Lisa vid. He hit lisa with a high counter blow, added 2 hits in her stun , THEN went for burst. so lisa acctually had 3 chances to punish him but she didn't. and as punishment for that she got bursted and JannLee got his guaranteed damage combo after that. This in my opinion is extremely fair.
It also means that in the old case of bayman in the e3 build doing counter hit sitdown stun straight into critical burst that he will probably need to add in a little extra poke just to break the threshold barrier.
I hope this explains it better
DriftSlave
Active Member
damage number values in DOA are not the highest in the world....not every game has TVC 2.5billion damage figures...
but i believe thats the damage required in the stun threshold...not overall damage, if you see it that way...it makes more sense. because say 40 damage is not much...about as much as a normal generic throw?
but i believe thats the damage required in the stun threshold...not overall damage, if you see it that way...it makes more sense. because say 40 damage is not much...about as much as a normal generic throw?
PhoenixVFIRE
Well-Known Member
It's not the threshold being that low, it's the damage for different juggle heights within the critical threshold. 28 damage or below(either neutral launches or within the stun threshold) is the smallest launch height. 35-41 damage within the critical threshold is medium launch height. Lastly, 42 damage and above is the max height launch.
The critical threshold has a base amount of damage you can inflict on an opponent before the opponent just falls to the ground and you get nothing.
qoodname
Active Member
That did exlain it way better! I still dont understand it 100% but i understood atleast what its all about! Thank you!Ok lets see...
basicly in DOA theres something called critical threshold ... this is the limit to the amount of damage you can deal when the opponent is stunned until the opponent is knocked down, or reset. and basicly you cant follow up after threshold as you lose combo count (with the exception of some minor cases).
now certain moves in DOA5 can trigger "critical burst" which is the only situation that goes against this rule. and when you pull it off at the last hit before reaching threshold, you go beyond the threshold into this special type of stun .. that stun (the critical burst stun) lets you do whatever you like after as the opponent cannot hold or slow escape for a really long time .. (this can also guarantee a powerblow)
what all those numbers mean basicly is that in order to be able to reach a critical burst state you need to dish out an extra move in stun so you can go past the critical threshold and trigger burst. This makes reaching the guaranteed situation of critical burst slightly tougher to earn.
before, if you got a high counter move u just needed like one more hit and then you got a chance to burst ... Now, with this change to the threshold limit, you probably need another extra hit in there somewhere.
This is what I pointed out in the Jan Lee vs Lisa vid. He hit lisa with a high counter blow, added 2 hits in her stun , THEN went for burst. so lisa acctually had 3 chances to punish him but she didn't. and as punishment for that she got bursted and JannLee got his guaranteed damage combo after that. This in my opinion is extremely fair.
It also means that in the old case of bayman in the e3 build doing counter hit sitdown stun straight into critical burst that he will probably need to add in a little extra poke just to break the threshold barrier.
I hope this explains it better
well heres an easier way to look at it ... Imagine this is what happens to the opponent after he gets hit:
starter stun > stun extension > critical threshold > reset (u lose combo count and the opponent falls on the floor )
In that same senario, if you add the move that does burst at the threshold point instead of a regular move, it looks something like this:
starter stun > stun extension > critical burst beyond threshold > potential for a guaranteed combo
basicly what they did with the update now is this:
Starter stun > stun extension > stun extension > critical burst beyond threshold > potential for a guaranteed combo ..
(meaning u need to add in an extra hit to get the ability to burst)
makes more sense ?
qoodname
Active Member
Ok now i understood everything! Thanks that you took your time to answer all my noobish questionswell heres an easier way to look at it ... Imagine this is what happens to the opponent after he gets hit:
starter stun > stun extension > critical threshold > reset (u lose combo count and the opponent falls on the floor )
In that same senario, if you add the move that does burst at the threshold point instead of a regular move, it looks something like this:
starter stun > stun extension > critical burst beyond threshold > potential for a guaranteed combo
basicly what they did with the update now is this:
Starter stun > stun extension > stun extension > critical burst beyond threshold > potential for a guaranteed combo ..
(meaning u need to add in an extra hit to get the ability to burst)
makes more sense ?
Doug Nguyen
Well-Known Member
In that video it showed all of Kasumis expert counters in the list. Is she missing a expert counter for her middle punch?
And ohh ok i thought those were thresholds and not launchers, but i got it now. Do you know the damage threshold limit by any chance? And what determines how much damage output is in a threshold? Wait i just realized Emperor cow explained it as the critical threshold increasing, adding more attacks within the threshold. So do those numbers mean the launcher or threshold limit?
And ohh ok i thought those were thresholds and not launchers, but i got it now. Do you know the damage threshold limit by any chance? And what determines how much damage output is in a threshold? Wait i just realized Emperor cow explained it as the critical threshold increasing, adding more attacks within the threshold. So do those numbers mean the launcher or threshold limit?
Raansu
Well-Known Member
No, -4 just means you cant move for 4 frames meaning on the 5th frame you can move and beat out the 5 frame throw because it doesn't technically activate until the 6th frame.
Frame data can be a bit complicated to understand. To make it simple, when you are looking at frame data just look at the start up and the recovery on block. Frame data on doa4 actually shows frame advantage as -1 because you are subtracting one frame from the attack and disadvantage as positive numbers because you are adding frames to the attack. So basically if the attack says -1 then you are at frame advantage and it is a safe attack. If an attack says 5 on the doa4 frame data that is also a safe attack even though its at disadvantage on block but you recover 1 frame faster than it takes for a 5 frame throw to reach its active frames.
I hope this makes sense. I'm really terrible at explaining things.
Of course you would be...
Rikuto
P-P-P-P-P-P-POWER!
Ok lets see...
basicly in DOA theres something called critical threshold ... this is the limit to the amount of damage you can deal when the opponent is stunned until the opponent is knocked down, or reset. and basicly you cant follow up after threshold as you lose combo count (with the exception of some minor cases).
now certain moves in DOA5 can trigger "critical burst" which is the only situation that goes against this rule. and when you pull it off at the last hit before reaching threshold, you go beyond the threshold into this special type of stun .. that stun (the critical burst stun) lets you do whatever you like after as the opponent cannot hold or slow escape for a really long time .. (this can also guarantee a powerblow)
what all those numbers mean basicly is that in order to be able to reach a critical burst state you need to dish out an extra move in stun so you can go past the critical threshold and trigger burst. This makes reaching the guaranteed situation of critical burst slightly tougher to earn.
before, if you got a high counter move u just needed like one more hit and then you got a chance to burst ... Now, with this change to the threshold limit, you probably need another extra hit in there somewhere.
This is what I pointed out in the Jan Lee vs Lisa vid. He hit lisa with a high counter blow, added 2 hits in her stun , THEN went for burst. so lisa acctually had 3 chances to punish him but she didn't. and as punishment for that she got bursted and JannLee got his guaranteed damage combo after that. This in my opinion is extremely fair.
It also means that in the old case of bayman in the e3 build doing counter hit sitdown stun straight into critical burst that he will probably need to add in a little extra poke just to break the threshold barrier.
I hope this explains it better
See, I automatically assumed the same thing when he said that.
But here is where we fall off that horse.... if we assume the number "30" is what is required to pop the threshold on CH, we already far ahead of that with a simple 3p, 3k, 7p. Changing it to 35 I don't believe makes it any different... it's still ahead of that.
So that cannot be the case unless the damage on strikes themselves have been nerfed...
Hmm, adding them up seems a bit too high as well. If I recall theshold was somewhere around 60 -70 in older DOAs, am I right ?
24 + 30 + 36 = 90 (old?)
28 + 35 + 42 = 105 (new?)
This kinda seems to make more sense ... but both numbers seem a bit too high ...
Unless they upped the damage for everything so our old perception of damage numbers no longer applies ...
I wonder ...
EDIT: wait wait I think I get it now ...
0-28 = minimal launch
28-63 = mid height launch
63-105 = threshold height
anything beond that either reset or burst ??? Maybe?? I dunno...