Tournament system of choice for DOA5?

[MasterHavik]

Don't forget those converters either.

 

[DrDogg]

To be honest with you, I don't believe you. I'm serious. I mean I must be too focus on trying to win, y'know?

Seriously? Please tell me you're going to be showing up for a real DOA5 tournament (a major) at some point. You're welcome to your opinions, but we're stating facts and quoting seasoned and knowledgeable competitive players, and you're acting like they're random scrubs making excuses for losing. You clearly lack an understanding of competitive play.

Now, to show you the proof of PS3 lag input:

More videos can be found here, as well as a direct PS3 vs. 360 lag comparison chart: http://ps360.ldblog.jp/archives/51702282.html

The issue is primarily found in Capcom fighting games. Namco games don't really have this issue and I don't expect DOA to have this issue either. I also think the PS3 should be the tournament standard for DOA5, although we do still need to wait for the final retail release to be sure there are no clear issues with the PS3 version.

Don't forget those converters either.

The converters are not the same as using no converter. Even the lagless ones are still not quite the same. I own multiple converters and would much rather play without them.

 

[CyberEvil]

Just saw that post...thanks Doc.

Fucking wow.

 

[MasterHavik]

Seriously? Please tell me you're going to be showing up for a real DOA5 tournament (a major) at some point. Your welcome to your opinions, but we're stating facts and quoting seasoned and knowledgeable competitive players, and you're acting like they're random scrubs making excuses for losing. You clearly lack an understanding of competitive play.

Now, to show you the proof of PS3 lag input:

More videos can be found here, as well as a direct PS3 vs. 360 lag comparison chart: http://ps360.ldblog.jp/archives/51702282.html

The issue is primarily found in Capcom fighting games. Namco games don't really have this issue and I don't expect DOA to have this issue either. I also think the PS3 should be the tournament standard for DOA5, although we do still need to wait for the final retail release to be sure there are no clear issues with the PS3 version.



The converters are not the same as using no converter. Even the lagless ones are still not quite the same. I own multiple converters and would much rather play without them.

Uh... i was responding to someone else post about controllers. Why did you have to response to that I wonder?


And dogg....don't tell me what i do or not know...that's kind of dickwaving. Also you kind of shot yourself in the foot twice your "cool" post. and btw...i will be at DOA majors. First off if, you go back to evo this year...Ultradavid during the uvmc3 stream. He said," It's been no ps forever guys. You guys should know." This was response to people complaining about the game being played on ps3. The same also went for a guy that bitch and moan he couldn't use a DS3 for marvel. I'm sorry that is bitching and moaning about getting bodied. You guys are not superstars in sports, you're not going to get your way bitching and whining for your way.(More on this later.)

Okay onto the next part of your post.

"The issue is primarily found in Capcom fighting games. Namco games don't really have this issue and I don't expect DOA to have this issue either. I also think the PS3 should be the tournament standard for DOA5, although we do still need to wait for the final retail release to be sure there are no clear issues with the PS3 version"

Hold it! This is only happening Capcom games....and you just said that this problem isn't from in Namco games, and claim it shouldn't be a problem with DOA. Last time I check were created by TN. But wait there's more... you go on to post a video talking about there is really lag between the ps3 and 360 version of marvel. but still want the ps3 to be the tournament for DOa 5? No comment....


"Seriously? Please tell me you're going to be showing up for a real DOA5 tournament (a major) at some point. Your welcome to your opinions, but we're stating facts and quoting seasoned and knowledgeable competitive players, and you're acting like they're random scrubs making excuses for losing. You clearly lack an understanding of competitive play."

Just want to bring up the last part here. These same knowledge and seasoned players are acting like the 2010-2011 Lakers in the WCF against Dallas. I mean you guys think your vanilla Kobe Bryants or something? I think you can see where I'm going here with that comparison. And basically you me stupid or don't understand any of competitive play for not feed into bs arguments about input lag. Hello if I recall high level play is about getting the win. Using your knowledge of the character and skills to get the victory. Where does it stay in the competitive play rule book that I must bitch and moan for a certain system to play my game on. I mean if you're logic and reason was true, then professional teams all over the world would request to play all their games at home and never trip on the road. So to close my friend, I do know competitive play. Just because it doesn't fit your norm or model doesn't mean I don't know shit. I'm sorry that I'm more concern about winning than what system I play on. I mean there can be differences and everything, but just like how ever professional athlete has to get us to play on the road and traveling all over the world. You're not always going to get your calls, way, or whatever. So my main argument here isn't if there is a difference on the system or not. I mean you can have super debates about what system to play on.It's about winning and being the better player. But I still respect you at the end of the day even though I found your post to be dickwaving, rude, and etlist to all hell. But at the next DOA major, I will greet you with respect and shake your hand. So don't worry about my traveling plans. I'll be there friend.

 

[Skilletor]

Okay onto the next part of your post.

"The issue is primarily found in Capcom fighting games. Namco games don't really have this issue and I don't expect DOA to have this issue either. I also think the PS3 should be the tournament standard for DOA5, although we do still need to wait for the final retail release to be sure there are no clear issues with the PS3 version"

Hold it! This is only happening Capcom games....and you just said that this problem isn't from in Namco games, and claim it shouldn't be a problem with DOA. Last time I check were created by TN. But wait there's more... you go on to post a video talking about there is really lag between the ps3 and 360 version of marvel. but still want the ps3 to be the tournament for DOa 5? No comment....

I really don't understand what you're saying.

 

[Awesmic]

I really don't understand what you're saying.

From what I gather, he's accusing DrDogg of saying DOA5 will have the same problems with input lag differences on both systems just because Capcom's fighters (notably Marvel) had the same problem, and is also accusing him of being a PS3 fanboy because he's not too fond of the Xbox 360.

Other than that, I admire his effort for standing up to him.

 

[Matt Ponton]

From what I gather, he's accusing DrDogg of saying DOA5 will have the same problems with input lag differences on both systems just because Capcom's fighters (notably Marvel) had the same problem, and is also accusing him of being a PS3 fanboy because he's not too fond of the Xbox 360.

I don't see that at all. What I could interpret out of it was that he's complaining about people complaining about lag and input delay. That the players should just deal with it and play the game regardless of choosing a system over the other because one has a bit more delay and performance issues than the other.

Then I *think* he was saying that Dr. Dogg seems to imply that because the lag is only an issue with Capcom and hasn't been seen in Namco's games that DOA5 should be safe as well. However, his complaint is that Dr Dogg is confusing DOA5 for being developed by Namco, I think?

I don't know, I didn't want to pick apart the rant.

 

[CyberEvil]

SNIP

You responded to my post about the issues with PS3 versions of some Capcom fighters with "I don't believe you," and Doc blew you up for it because you were being completely nonsensical. He wasn't responding to your one-off post about converters. You should feel pretty foolish in 3...2...1...

EDIT: Now that I've read a few more posts, I'm glad that I'm not alone in being pretty confused with your post. Also, what the hell are you talking about when you bring up "vanilla Kobe Bryant?" Either you're talking about him before some kind of major change, which would be the fighting game parlance version, or you're calling all of us white. Not sure what your point was there and if it was the latter...LOL.

 

[Awesmic]

When he mentioned "vanilla", I believe he meant to use that in gaming terms. In the case of the Kobe Bryant comparison, his performance in his earlier years.

 

[DrDogg]

Uh... i was responding to someone else post about controllers. Why did you have to response to that I wonder?

This is a public forum. Am I not allowed to add my $0.02 when a converter is mentioned? If not, you should've conducted that conversation as a PM.

And dogg....don't tell me what i do or not know...that's kind of dickwaving.

I didn't have to tell you what you do or do not know, you told me. You said you do not believe there is input lag on the PS3. I simply linked you to factual evidence that your statement was incorrect.

Also you kind of shot yourself in the foot twice your "cool" post. and btw...i will be at DOA majors. First off if, you go back to evo this year...Ultradavid during the uvmc3 stream. He said," It's been no ps forever guys. You guys should know." This was response to people complaining about the game being played on ps3. The same also went for a guy that bitch and moan he couldn't use a DS3 for marvel. I'm sorry that is bitching and moaning about getting bodied. You guys are not superstars in sports, you're not going to get your way bitching and whining for your way.

I agree that the players should've been prepared to play on the PS3. Unfortunately, this isn't a perfect world, and not everyone has the money to make the trip out to Vegas, cover the hotel and tournament entry costs, AND buy a PS3 and whatever games for that system. It would actually make more sense for Evo to use the superior console, but I understand they're sponsored by Sony, so their hands are tied.

The simple fact of the matter is that the PS3 version lags. It should not be used for tournaments. That said, if a tournament is using the PS3 version, players are allowed to complain about the lag issues. It doesn't mean they're making an excuse for losing like you claimed. It just means they're upset that lag has caused them to play below their standards. I would question any competitive player if they didn't have an issue with the PS3 lag.

It's nothing like complaining about not playing on your home court. No one is complaining they can't participate in Evo while sitting on their couch at home. Again, you're entitled to your opinion, but you're acting as if these players are random online scrubs, and that's simply not the case.

Hold it! This is only happening Capcom games....and you just said that this problem isn't from in Namco games, and claim it shouldn't be a problem with DOA. Last time I check were created by TN. But wait there's more... you go on to post a video talking about there is really lag between the ps3 and 360 version of marvel. but still want the ps3 to be the tournament for DOa 5? No comment....

Okay, this made no sense to me. If I understand, you're trying to say I'm contradicting myself... I think?

PS3 lag is pretty much limited to Capcom games and we probably won't have to worry about it with DOA. Since I don't believe it will be an issue with DOA, why would I have a problem wanting the PS3 as the tournament console of choice?

Maybe you misread what I said, because after reading your response multiple times, it still makes no sense at all.

And basically you me stupid or don't understand any of competitive play for not feed into bs arguments about input lag.

Poor grammar aside, how is the input lag argument BS? I just provided you with proof that the PS3 lags.

Hello if I recall high level play is about getting the win. Using your knowledge of the character and skills to get the victory.

Your knowledge of the character and skills are not at their fullest when input lag is added to the equation. It's more about your ability to adapt to dropped combos and other issues caused by the input lag.

Where does it stay in the competitive play rule book that I must bitch and moan for a certain system to play my game on. I mean if you're logic and reason was true, then professional teams all over the world would request to play all their games at home and never trip on the road.

Comparing input lag to playing an away game is a poor comparison. A better comparison would be if NBA players used a 10' rim during the regular season, but were expected to play on a 12' rim in the playoffs.

You also act as though professional athletes never complain about anything. They complain all the time about random stuff. And they're getting paid a TON of money in the process.

So my main argument here isn't if there is a difference on the system or not. I mean you can have super debates about what system to play on.It's about winning and being the better player.

If that was your main argument then you probably shouldn't have claimed that PS3 input lag is a lie.

Also, I don't think being the better player in a handicapped environment is a good win.

But I still respect you at the end of the day even though I found your post to be dickwaving, rude, and etlist to all hell. But at the next DOA major, I will greet you with respect and shake your hand. So don't worry about my traveling plans. I'll be there friend.

How can you respect me and want to shake my hand when you just spent about 1000 words insulting me? Seems a bit contradictory to me.

From what I gather, he's accusing DrDogg of saying DOA5 will have the same problems with input lag differences on both systems just because Capcom's fighters (notably Marvel) had the same problem, and is also accusing him of being a PS3 fanboy because he's not too fond of the Xbox 360.

Other than that, I admire his effort for standing up to him.

I specifically stated I do not believe DOA5 will have the same issues. And I don't see how I'm a PS3 fanboy. I own both consoles, and have since launch day. My only issues with the 360 are that I'm on my 5th one and the controller is terrible for any game that requires a d-pad.

 

[Rikuto]

Back in my day dick waving was considered a respectable sport and the only trophy you needed was the one you walked in with.

 

[UnD34D]

Maybe I'm not reading the video right, but 5 frames of lag is a lot of fucking lag for just being on a different system. I'll give it to Marvel, its not an input heavy game, but even then 5 frames is a lot. Havik, I have no idea what your argument is, it seems like you're just angry.

 

[DrDogg]

However, his complaint is that Dr Dogg is confusing DOA5 for being developed by Namco, I think?

Having read it for the 8th time, I think you're right. Although I don't see how he came to that conclusion. Just because I mention Namco games and DOA5 in the same sentence doesn't mean I'm implying Namco developed the game. I've mentioned Tecmo and Team Ninja in my posts enough that even he should know that's reaching a bit. I guess not...

Maybe I'm not reading the video right, but 5 frames of lag is a lot of fucking lag for just being on a different system. I'll give it to Marvel, its not an input heavy game, but even then 5 frames is a lot. Havik, I have no idea what your argument is, it seems like you're just angry.

The input lag is 5 frames in total given the test they were doing, but only one frame more on the PS3 compared to the Xbox.

http://ps360.ldblog.jp/archives/51702282.html

Look at the table about halfway down the page for a direct PS3/360 comparison.

 

[Awesmic]

I don't see that at all. What I could interpret out of it was that he's complaining about people complaining about lag and input delay. That the players should just deal with it and play the game regardless of choosing a system over the other because one has a bit more delay and performance issues than the other.

Then I *think* he was saying that Dr. Dogg seems to imply that because the lag is only an issue with Capcom and hasn't been seen in Namco's games that DOA5 should be safe as well. However, his complaint is that Dr Dogg is confusing DOA5 for being developed by Namco, I think?

I don't know, I didn't want to pick apart the rant.

Late-as-hell reply, but I overlooked this and DrDogg's response...

To both, sounds fair enough.

 

[UnD34D]

I have both systems too, I just prefer a lot of the features of the Xbox. My PS3 is mostly a Blu Ray player, though I do pick up the exclusives from time to time. Huge Uncharted fan, here.

If you want a good test, try my Heihachi bread and butter combo: (optional jump in attack) 6+LP > MP > HP xx 623+LP > HP xx 623+HK. You can tack on another hit to the final SRK by hitting another attack button but the string itself should be easy to land. The problem on the PS3 is that the HP inputs seem to come out too late more often than not and on the 360 I don't have the problem.

Back to our original convo, I just tested your Hei BnB, and I don't know for sure, but on the second HP, after the l.DP, it felt like some lag, but I didn't have any trouble with the first one, I did the BnB about 50 times in a row, and the second HP didn't feel like it was coming out right, compared with his first one and just doing moves after his EWGF. I also did my Hugo BnB a couple times and it kind of felt laggy trying to do his cr.MP after his hand slap.

 

[CyberEvil]

That's basically what I thought you'd feel. Now, it's entirely possible that it was introduced after a patch or whatever and it was originally fine, but it's noticeably more difficult to time links and even just normal strings on the PS3 version. Did you notice the slowdown on the character select screen, too? It's really weird and I may just be more sensitive to it because I primarily play on the 360 version.

Side note, I'm pretty excited for Monday/Tuesday because I get the DLC characters for free from participating in SFxT at Evo. Lars was a ton of fun to play and I can't wait to run my Lars and Heihachi team.

 

[UnD34D]

That's basically what I thought you'd feel. Now, it's entirely possible that it was introduced after a patch or whatever and it was originally fine, but it's noticeably more difficult to time links and even just normal strings on the PS3 version. Did you notice the slowdown on the character select screen, too? It's really weird and I may just be more sensitive to it because I primarily play on the 360 version.

Side note, I'm pretty excited for Monday/Tuesday because I get the DLC characters for free from participating in SFxT at Evo. Lars was a ton of fun to play and I can't wait to run my Lars and Heihachi team.

I'm on the CS screen right now and to be honest I don't notice anything, I doubt I'm going to buy the DLC because no one here plays SFxT, American or Japanese. I was waiting for the DLC to come out to run Cody/Guy as a team or Bryan/Jack-6 (both my SF4 and my Tekken team) but I'm so displeased with the game I doubt I'm going to.

 

[Rikuto]

Maybe I'm not reading the video right, but 5 frames of lag is a lot of fucking lag for just being on a different system. I'll give it to Marvel, its not an input heavy game, but even then 5 frames is a lot. Havik, I have no idea what your argument is, it seems like you're just angry.

Sounds like you'd get along.

Not that I'm disagreeing or anything, I'm an angry man myself a decent % of the time.

If I ever ran out of things to be angry about, I imagine I would have to start making things up.

 

[UnD34D]

Sounds like you'd get along.

Not that I'm disagreeing or anything, I'm an angry man myself a decent % of the time.

If I ever ran out of things to be angry about, I imagine I would have to start making things up.

Hate fuels me, but at least when I argue I have a valid point :/

 

[virtuaPAI]

In all honesty, I just want to have a good set of players to test my skills against, no matter the system!