Offical Helena Gameplay Discussion Thread

KwonJigglypuff

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Anyone notice how much range Helena can cover with BKO Dash > P+K?

Yes it's a nice fencing tool and the only purpose I have found for it. I think the reach is around 2.5m if my memory is correct.

I also like how they developed her Bokuho stance with BKO_8P+K and the three moves connected to 22.

Do you players feel they should add something else ?
 
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Omegan Eckhart

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Yes it's a nice fencing tool and the only purpose I have found for it. I think the reach is around 2.5m if my memory is correct.

I also like how they developed her Bokuho stance with BKO_8P+K and the three moves connected to 22.

Do you players feel they should add something else ?
Whilst her move set feels pretty complete, it might be cool if Helena could buffer something other than a mid punch from BKO 22, maybe 22 F+K or 22 6K?
 

Akumasama

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Do you players feel they should add something else ?
I won't say what I'd dream to get (or rather get back!) because it's not gonna happen at this point :p


Some things, probably very unpopular opinion and I'll be the only one thinkin this but hey, I'm ready to whistand everyone's hate! >:p

1) Swap 9P,K,P to 3P,K,P, put what's the current string starting with 3+P back to 9+P like it's been for the past 4 games.
2) remove 3,3P or change the buffer sensitivity of the command, I lost count of the amount of times I want to do 3+P and 3,3+P comes out. So frustrating ><
3) Give Helena a back turned low throw. Been dreaming of this since DoA2 yo!
4) 1 frame faster "crouch" status when you enter Bokuho, and/or 1 more frame on crouch status when you leave Bokuho. Feel 1 frame would be enough to make things feel more even.


Not sure what else Helena could use. A decent offensive hold? Doesn't have to be OP, just decent!
Some more moves that are safe on block? Aside from the guard crushes I think the only safe on block move Helena has is 236+PK and it's "just" 2 frames.
I'm sure she's not the only character in this situation but still she's got no frame traps, realistically no safe on guard moves, no good offensive holds, from back stance she's got no low throw and only 2 (3!) tracking moves, from Bokuho she's got only 2 (??) tracking moves.

I still love playing as my beloved Helena and I don't think she's that shitty of a char, but she surely could use something else than the current tools. Sometimes against some specific characters it really feels like she's playing with some disadvantage.
I don't think I've ever felt this way, this much, in DoA5.
Talking about LR, on Vanilla Helena was probably a bit OP with her forced techs :p
 
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KwonJigglypuff

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I won't say what I'd dream to get (or rather get back!) because it's not gonna happen at this point :p


Some things, probably very unpopular opinion and I'll be the only one thinkin this but hey, I'm ready to whistand everyone's hate! >:p

1) Swap 9P,K,P to 3P,K,P, put what's the current string starting with 3+P back to 9+P like it's been for the past 4 games.
2) remove 3,3P or change the buffer sensitivity of the command, I lost count of the amount of times I want to do 3+P and 3,3+P comes out. So frustrating ><
3) Give Helena a back turned low throw. Been dreaming of this since DoA2 yo!
4) 1 frame faster "crouch" status on Bokuho, and/or 1 more frame on crouch status when you leave Bokuho. Feel 1 frame would be enough to make things feel more even.


Not sure what else Helena could use. A decent offensive hold? Doesn't have to be OP, just decent!
Some more moves that are safe on block? Aside from the guard crushes I think the only safe on block move Helena has is 236+PK and it's "just" 2 frames.
I'm sure she's not the only character in this situation but still she's got no frame traps, realistically no safe on guard moves, no good offensive holds, from back stance she's got no low throw and only 2 (3!) tracking moves, from Bokuho she's got only 2 (??) tracking moves.

I still love playing as my beloved Helena and I don't think she's that shitty of a char, but she surely could use something else than the current tools. Sometimes against some specific characters it really feels like she's playing with some disadvantage.
I don't think I've ever felt this way, this much, in DoA5.
Talking about LR, on Vanilla Helena was probably a bit OP with her forced techs :p
1. I'm now used to the new imputs and I think they make more sense now in terms of animations.

2. I agree, it happens to me too, and this new move looks ugly anyway... maybe add a follow-up ?



3. I feel like this would work well for a BT low throw!



4. Wouldn't mind it of course hehe.

As for me, this is mostly cosmetic but I still would like :

- a BKO low throw similar to this :


- a BKO parry for lows :


- a follow-up like Atsuda after PP :


- a BT throw (for BT opponents) :


- a kick option from BKO_22 (chargeable) :


- a follow-up to her useless 66K+H :


- a rebound after BKO_22_P+K :


- a big stun from BT :


- an infinite windmill from BKO :


- and a reverence taunt from BKO ! :)

* most gifs are from usagiZ <3
 
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Akumasama

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Man some of your suggestions are so coooool! <3 I especially love the animations you posted.
And yeah I forgot the 66H+K follow up, they really need to do something about it.

Also the idea of low parry from Bokuho is so cool, would add so much mind games and strategy, wouldn't it?
Might be a bit too strong, but if it's a zero damage parry, zero advantage, with strict timing, maybe it could be balanced out.


And emphasis on my point number 4. It might not seem much, it's "just" 1 frame after all, but it would be a massive difference.
It's really silly to sometimes see Helena already crouched but the game doesn't feel her in crouched status, and you get caught by a throw regardless.
Likewise when you leave Bokuho, sometimes you still look crouched but you get throwed regardless because you're already in "standing" status for the game.
1 frame entering and 1 frame leaving would go miles into making BKO a bit more streamlined.
 
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Akumasama

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So I have something that happens quite regularly to me when I'm playing Helena and never happened when I'm playin other characters (granted I've hardly played anything that's not Helena so far, lol)

At the beginning of the round if I start with a Fatal Rush, it ends after the second hit leaving Helena back turned. Is it normal? What is causing this?
 

KwonJigglypuff

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So I have something that happens quite regularly to me when I'm playing Helena and never happened when I'm playin other characters (granted I've hardly played anything that's not Helena so far, lol)

At the beginning of the round if I start with a Fatal Rush, it ends after the second hit leaving Helena back turned. Is it normal? What is causing this?
Doesn't happen to me. Weird.
 

Akumasama

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Happens like over 50% of the time. Sometimes during the match but it's more rare, if it happens as first hit on the round it's very very frequent.
I thought it was something about the range, like the opponent is to far from you when Helena finishes the second hit of Fatal Rush and so the chain interrupts, but I've tried to reproduce it in the practice mode to no avail.

It's so common, I'm really wondering why it happens only to me then D:
 

Omegan Eckhart

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Is it me or did TN remove the high crush properties from P+K entirely? Not sure if 4P ever high crushed but it doesn't appear to duck at all, same as P+K.


Also, I discovered today (I assume others figured this out already) that doing a low T is faster than low blocking. This is useful when ducking jumping OH's from the likes of Tina, Lisa, Marie, Busa. Those 3 extra frames can be useful, especially online.
 
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Akumasama

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New patch coming! Balancement! Oh Joy!

Btw anybody living in europe and willing to train against my Helena? Could really use some criticism in what to improve in my style.
 

Akumasama

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o.o not sure why it should matter O_O
I'm on a 100/1000 FTTH optic fiber cable connection. All my devices are directly connected to my router with a Cat6e ethernet cable.
 

Tulkas

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o.o not sure why it should matter O_O
I'm on a 100/1000 FTTH optic fiber cable connection. All my devices are directly connected to my router with a Cat6e ethernet cable.
I have had several issues playing against WiFi fighters, even when they are 5 bars connections... Basically, no issues at all with 5 bars over cable. :)
 
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