ShinMaruku
Well-Known Member
That will depend on a few things. Weightclass will be something to consider in timing your bounds.
DOA5U "Prepare" - Ayane General Gameplay Discussion
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True, but that's to be expected anyway.
Female Tengu
Active Member
Is that new bound state present in Tag-Mode only? Cauz in the video, I really don't see any efficient use for that state in solo mode, at least not for Ayane and that specific move. Because, like synce said, that would be a big and really unnecessary nerf.
bingsoo
Well-Known Member
If you're referring to 3H+K getting changed to the bound state, it wouldn't be an "unnecessary" nerf even if the bound didn't guarantee anything.
3H+K as it is in DOA 5 is fucking OP. What other single move in this game has range, tracks, is neutral on block, guarantees 70+ damage, transitions into back turn stance, all the while being a mid kick? Changing the sitdown stun into a bound state is not an unnecessary nerf.
That being said, it is still way too early to even speculate about the bound state since we don't know anything about it. If it guarantees juggle damage, 3H+K isn't even that big of a nerf.
Sure, I love that move, and honestly, this game needs more moves like that for the rest of the cast for competitiveness' sake, but I'm not going to start pretending like I don't know TN's tendencies with their approach to fighting game balance, which is not aimed towards guaranteed damage.
3H+K as it is in DOA 5 is fucking OP. What other single move in this game has range, tracks, is neutral on block, guarantees 70+ damage, transitions into back turn stance, all the while being a mid kick? Changing the sitdown stun into a bound state is not an unnecessary nerf.
That being said, it is still way too early to even speculate about the bound state since we don't know anything about it. If it guarantees juggle damage, 3H+K isn't even that big of a nerf.
Sure, I love that move, and honestly, this game needs more moves like that for the rest of the cast for competitiveness' sake, but I'm not going to start pretending like I don't know TN's tendencies with their approach to fighting game balance, which is not aimed towards guaranteed damage.
Yeah, it's exactly as Bingsoo said, no information has been given about bounds in DOA5U yet. So I haven't assumed anything yet. Plus as of right now, 3H+K is one of best single range pokes in the game from what Bingsoo already stated. And although I love it's current state, I don't mind the hit confirm being changed. 3H+K is still one of Ayane's best range tools regardless.
Female Tengu
Active Member
True, Hajin. I have no doubts that it will remain one of Ayanes best ranged tools. Still, I don't know...looking at the past, TN sometimes really is a weird bunch of people when it comes to balancing. Anyways, you are right, maybe I was just jumping at conclusions. Let's see what the final build will bring us (and Ayane, lol).
Really? If that's true, then that's an easy adjustment.
ShinMaruku
Well-Known Member
Hmm that will be something to look for. I just hope I can get some play testing.
A few notable changes gathered by Gill Hustle at Summer Jam 7:
- Ayane's back spin notation is no longer 11/33. The notation is now 1P+K (this is the input of her Power Blow in DOA5 currently).
My take on this change specifically: I welcome it. Why? Because Ayane has access to regular KBD movement (Korean Back Dash) now. This just gave a character with already great mobility, MORE mobility. I find the notation change to her back spins a smart decision by Tecmo. There are moments where I want to low hold something on reaction and I end up getting an 11 input instead.
Not only this, but doing other things while implementing some spacing/footsies/whiff punishment, such as running up then back spinning becomes much easier because the input is instant now instead of stopping your footing then inputting an 11 input. Her Integrated Movement along with KBD will be ridiculous, I am looking forward to making such an easy adjustment and taking more advantage of her already solid movement ability.
- Her Powerblow is now 7P+K: It was 1P+K in DOA5, so the change is not a big deal.
- 64T > 4P+K still works like a charm: Because of this, I believe the advantage 64T grants is still there. Hopefully that sticks. But if it doesn't, then Ayane still has 214T, 236T and 66T. All of which are just as good for damage and positioning (except for 66T since it doesn't position Ayane in her comfort zone).
- 4P+K has the new juggle airstate (constantly spinning in the air) with an average launch height: I believe most of the juggles were already using from 4P+K are still viable. But we'll obviously have to do some testing to make sure.
- BT PPPP no longer guard breaks and it is negative on block: The +5 currently was "cute" because it didn't exactly guarantee anything (at all) and it just forces a button press. But that's exactly what made the string good on block, so it is unfortunate it's negative now. By how much, I do not know. That is something we'll have to find out.
- 4P has some funny business going on: I'm not sure if it's true or not, but some say 4P no longer launches (or relaunches) on hit. Not sure if that includes counter hit status or not. It doesn't exactly make sense to me for 4P not to launch. More info is needed on this one.
- H+K has the new juggle airstate like 4P+K does.
- 66KK4 still exists: Not sure if the +1 on block for this and BT PP6KK4 is still there or not. No one confirmed it yet.
- 3H+K has the bound state: We already knew about it's bound state, but I really think something can be followed up after hit confirming this. This will need to be explored more.
I honestly don't see much of anything so far as a nerf. Just some changes.
- Ayane's back spin notation is no longer 11/33. The notation is now 1P+K (this is the input of her Power Blow in DOA5 currently).
My take on this change specifically: I welcome it. Why? Because Ayane has access to regular KBD movement (Korean Back Dash) now. This just gave a character with already great mobility, MORE mobility. I find the notation change to her back spins a smart decision by Tecmo. There are moments where I want to low hold something on reaction and I end up getting an 11 input instead.
Not only this, but doing other things while implementing some spacing/footsies/whiff punishment, such as running up then back spinning becomes much easier because the input is instant now instead of stopping your footing then inputting an 11 input. Her Integrated Movement along with KBD will be ridiculous, I am looking forward to making such an easy adjustment and taking more advantage of her already solid movement ability.
- Her Powerblow is now 7P+K: It was 1P+K in DOA5, so the change is not a big deal.
- 64T > 4P+K still works like a charm: Because of this, I believe the advantage 64T grants is still there. Hopefully that sticks. But if it doesn't, then Ayane still has 214T, 236T and 66T. All of which are just as good for damage and positioning (except for 66T since it doesn't position Ayane in her comfort zone).
- 4P+K has the new juggle airstate (constantly spinning in the air) with an average launch height: I believe most of the juggles were already using from 4P+K are still viable. But we'll obviously have to do some testing to make sure.
- BT PPPP no longer guard breaks and it is negative on block: The +5 currently was "cute" because it didn't exactly guarantee anything (at all) and it just forces a button press. But that's exactly what made the string good on block, so it is unfortunate it's negative now. By how much, I do not know. That is something we'll have to find out.
- 4P has some funny business going on: I'm not sure if it's true or not, but some say 4P no longer launches (or relaunches) on hit. Not sure if that includes counter hit status or not. It doesn't exactly make sense to me for 4P not to launch. More info is needed on this one.
- H+K has the new juggle airstate like 4P+K does.
- 66KK4 still exists: Not sure if the +1 on block for this and BT PP6KK4 is still there or not. No one confirmed it yet.
- 3H+K has the bound state: We already knew about it's bound state, but I really think something can be followed up after hit confirming this. This will need to be explored more.
I honestly don't see much of anything so far as a nerf. Just some changes.
I seen it where Gill tried to do BT 4P or 4P (I don't remember where he was back turned or not) where it would launch but the BT PP4PP7K follow up wouldn't connect. It did do like a couple of flips though & I saw him launch with one of them & connected with the string but I can't remember which 1 it was that "didn't". But 4P launched off of counter & not on NH I believe.
But it could've been that he was trying to get the feel of her changes too.
Female Tengu
Active Member
Thx for the update. I watched the FSD stream yesterday and saw Ayane in action as well.
I really hope 4P at least relaunches. The high crush ability may be the main reason for using it, but 4P always was a nice little damage bonus for her best juggles.
The bounding state also looks quite odd but also useful on the other side. I guess you could connect her 6[6]H+K to it and it shoudl hit since Ayanes rolling is pretty fast. And this also leads to another question. Can 6[6]H+K relaunch from bounding state? (would be interesting in areas with a ceiling)
I really hope 4P at least relaunches. The high crush ability may be the main reason for using it, but 4P always was a nice little damage bonus for her best juggles.
The bounding state also looks quite odd but also useful on the other side. I guess you could connect her 6[6]H+K to it and it shoudl hit since Ayanes rolling is pretty fast. And this also leads to another question. Can 6[6]H+K relaunch from bounding state? (would be interesting in areas with a ceiling)
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It's possible. That would be sick if it did. My 1st instinct when I seen 3H+K was 66 BT 4K & rolling BT H+K. 66 BT 4K because of BT 4K's long reach, rolling BT H+K because of the 3H+K's animation with them rolling after they get hit with them in the bound state.
Well keep in mind that Ayane was fighting a heavy weight (Leon), BT PP4PP7K actually doesn't connect on heavy weights at low launch heights. Unless there were more gameplay that I missed. But if the standard BnB juggle no longer hit confirms (I'm not going to assume anything yet), then 4P~K will have to be used at lower launch heights.
phoenix1985gr
Active Member
4p still launches on counter hit
Gill Hustle
Well-Known Member
I just went by your posts on facebook that you made & took a wild guess lmfao!
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Gill Hustle
Well-Known Member
Any of the upper tier players would let you get away with BT
maybe once or twice, then start countering.Now that she can back dash like EVERYONE else, she can get away clean without shenanigans AND still have easy access to her vanilla play.
I'll find an appropriate use for BT PPPP.
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