Lulu
Well-Known Member
We can't discuss the hold system without looking at it, now can we?
Look at this mess.
Bloody Hell !!!
Thats how holds used to be ?
LoL.... I wouldn't be caught dead playing those previous games.
Selectable hold (3-point and 4-point)
- Thread starter d3v
- Start date
Bloody Hell !!!
Thats how holds used to be ?
LoL.... I wouldn't be caught dead playing those previous games.
Raansu
Well-Known Member
Bloody Hell !!!
Thats how holds used to be ?
LoL.... I wouldn't be caught dead playing those previous games.
In DoA1 the hold was basically just a parry. I never played ++, but I assume it was more like the holds we know now, just with the advanced inputs.
XxNoriakixX
Well-Known Member
It should stay as a 4 way system or,if they really want to dumb it down even more, a 3 way hold system for everyone instead of being able to pick one of them
Raansu
Well-Known Member
I don't know if I'd be even willing to play the game if we went back to 3 point holds unless the stun system reverted back to how it was in DoA3. Granted, Dimensions is not DoA5, but it still had the same stun system that 4 and 5 use and.....ugh no. That was nightmare inducing.
WAZAAAAA
Well-Known Member
where do you even find all these beautiful pictures wtfWe can't discuss the hold system without looking at it, now can we?
Look at this mess.
The whole reason for 3-point, 4-point, and 6-point holds in the first place was because it was the only option to prevent spamming without introducing a "counter meter". Well have a meter now in 6 so... yeah. Maybe let's try that for a change?
I'm definitely of the opinion that 2-point (or maybe even 1-point?) is the way to go with each counter sacrificing meter. Especially because the meter now seems pointless. You're just building up so you can do this fancy animation that doesn't really matter. Who cares? I didn't go for PBs or slope throws either... "Break Blow" doesn't really add anything significant to the game. But refreshing how counters work and making them more accessible? Now that's a fucking game changer. I actually have a reason to care about meter management.
Meter has the potential to be the most refreshing thing to ever happen to DOA since multi-tiered stages.
ryu_highabusa
Well-Known Member
Some wonderful person made a chart of all the holds on the Japanese DOA wikipedia page, I was just gonna take a screenshot but I was struggling to read it cause of my ADHD so I added the color and English in Photoshop to make it a little more legible. Plus I think it really helps to illustrate the point of the differences across the series. So anyone feel free to reuse this for other purposes. I haven't seen anything equivalent on an English language site.
d3v
Well-Known Member
Mmm... 6 point holds.We can't discuss the hold system without looking at it, now can we?
Look at this mess.
The whole reason for 3-point, 4-point, and 6-point holds in the first place was because it was the only option to prevent spamming without introducing a "counter meter". Well have a meter now in 6 so... yeah. Maybe let's try that for a change?
I'm definitely of the opinion that 2-point (or maybe even 1-point?) is the way to go with each counter sacrificing meter. Especially because the meter now seems pointless. You're just building up so you can do this fancy animation that doesn't really matter. Who cares? I didn't go for PBs or slope throws either...
"Break Blow" doesn't really add anything significant to the game. But refreshing how counters work and making them more accessible at the same time? Now that's a fucking game changer. I actually have a reason to care about meter management.
Meter has the potential to be the most refreshing thing to ever happen to DOA since multi-tiered stages. You can even have the meter go gray or something to indicate certain un-holdable situations, eliminating yet another problem.
That said, you still have to consider that Break Hold consumes a whole damn meter - not just part of it mind you. From a meter that also powers Break Blows, meaning that using it to Break Hold removes a lot of potential damage, and even advantage at neutral, from the table.
d3v
Well-Known Member
Which is part of the point of that - to force/bait out a Break Hold from your opponent.
Lulu
Well-Known Member
They could use the
or the S Button.... which I'm hoping this forum will have an Image for one day. If we someone could track down whoever made them.I personally just want them to stick with 4 way, 6 way is just way too complex and it would take away defensive holds on paper unless they removed them, and I don't want that. As a defensive minded Kasumi player, I need her her teleport parries to be in and not be taken away since that hurts her defensivelyThey could use the
With 2H and 8H? Honestly though, if multi-hit-level holds/parries/sabakis were removed entirely, I would be a happy camper.
It's a bit more complicated than that.
In DOA1 you had the universal 2-point system:
and For Grapplers (Tina, Bayman, & Raidou), both hit levels would do about 10points of damage.
For Holders (Gen Fu & Leifang), both hit levels would parry.
For everyone else,
would do about 10 points of damage, and would parry.Additionally, some, or most (I forget), had a specific mid kick hold at
which would best be explained as what became the mid kick defensive hold move.In DOA++, you had this same system in neutral with the added addition of being able to perform what is now known as the mid punch and mid kick defensive holds:
for mid punch, and for mid kick.However, in critical stun (First time the series introduced it), the system changed to a 6-point system as shown in the graphic above. The other difference is that the high and low points didn't have defensive hold animations like the mid, and instead would just be the neutral-state
and effects (parries).
ryu_highabusa
Well-Known Member
I made something a week ago when the game was announced.They could use the
Like, this is what a counter without meter should do.It's a bit more complicated than that.
In DOA1 you had the universal 2-point system:
For Grapplers (Tina, Bayman, & Raidou), both hit levels would do about 10points of damage.
For Holders (Gen Fu & Leifang), both hit levels would parry.
For everyone else,
NightAntilli
Well-Known Member
3-point sucks. Mid holds are too powerful with that system. It basically changes the game to a 50/50 chance (either mid or low, since highs whiff on low holds). 4-points is a good balance between not making things too complicated for the defender and giving the one on the offense the advantage.
The holds cannot be seen on their own though. The whole game around them influences how effective they are. A 6-point system would be the best really, but then you have to rework the whole stun game to avoid first hit = win.
The holds cannot be seen on their own though. The whole game around them influences how effective they are. A 6-point system would be the best really, but then you have to rework the whole stun game to avoid first hit = win.
Lulu
Well-Known Member
Thats so clean and smooth... I LOVE IT !!!
Jotamide
Well-Known Member
As a complete newcomer to the series, this chart is awesome. Puts in perspective the evolution of Holds over the years. It should be somewhere on the wiki for future reference IMO.We can't discuss the hold system without looking at it, now can we?
Look at this mess.
The whole reason for 3-point, 4-point, and 6-point holds in the first place was because it was the only option to prevent spamming without introducing a "counter meter". Well have a meter now in 6 so... yeah. Maybe let's try that for a change?
I'm definitely of the opinion that 2-point (or maybe even 1-point?) is the way to go with each counter sacrificing meter. Especially because the meter now seems pointless. You're just building up so you can do this fancy animation that doesn't really matter. Who cares? I didn't go for PBs or slope throws either...
"Break Blow" doesn't really add anything significant to the game. But refreshing how counters work and making them more accessible at the same time? Now that's a fucking game changer. I actually have a reason to care about meter management.
Meter has the potential to be the most refreshing thing to ever happen to DOA since multi-tiered stages. You can even have the meter go gray or something to indicate certain un-holdable situations, eliminating yet another problem.