Damn Cyber... no need to go in lol
What's with all the people here joining VFDC?
- Thread starter MAtteoJHDY
- Start date
Damn Cyber... no need to go in lol
But it was kinda cool to see Cyber come in and McMahon that guy.
werewolfgold
Well-Known Member
Awww, I missed the party? Damn it...
I remember this one game where I actually launched myself off the stage trying to knock the other guy off. It was very sad.
werewolfgold
Well-Known Member
I've only ever done that in Soulcalibur.
Blazeincarnated
Well-Known Member
Epic dumbass....
im not gonna read 6 pages .. but ... I think I get the idea ...
Having experience in both games I will try and elaborate ...
In VF:
- you have states where mid string you are negative on HIT ... meaning the opponent gets a chance to block, duck, sidestep, or even crush....
- you DO in-fact have long ass stun situations that give the opponent no chance to even stagger out of the followup, guaranteeing damage.
- after juggling, there are states that refloat, there are flops, there are bounces... (some techable some not) .. all contributing to the extended single hit damage.
- damage scaling is almost non exsistant excpept after exceeding agood amount of damage and even then is negligible in most cases
- you have "ringouts" in some stages ... which in many states its a 1 hit kill or even .. a stupid juggle that would "drag you all the way to the wall guaranteeing the kill.. having it with a half fence doesnt make this scenario any more justifiable.
- walls ... when played right = a shitstorm of damage ... (50% damage or more depending on character and counter hit)
now lets reflect this to the system you so call flawed in DOA ...
please note, I am not saying any one game is better ... but I'm just proving a point
- the stun system exists... how you choose to play it depends on your style (at high level) ..you can either know your frame data and put the opponent in a state where they cannot stagger escape limiting their defensive options to merely holding.. you can put the opponent in the opponent in situations where they cannot do anything.. or limit the mixup to merely stun > launch for guaranteed damage..
when looking at this with a VF mind this is very similar to what goes on in the 1st and 2nd points in VF
- yes there are powerblows and powerlaunchers ... but these are situational .. if you are too ignorant to see a move that requires over 30 frames to land then yes .. you deserve being smacked with a dry PB or PL .. but in most scenarios, in order to land it the player must reach a state where they can guarantee it ... which means the opponent must guess or defend incorrectly for at least 2-3 times (depending on the character) before a CB is landed in order to make the powerblow guaranteed ...
- when looking at how insane the damage is ... it can be argued that the damage achieved is no where near what you get from a wall in VF for one thing ... then theres the instant death in ringouts ...
instant death stage combos in DOA are NOT guaranteed in 99.99999999% of the cases and what you see all over youtube are just for show and of very little value. kinda like how in VF people would repeat a string which can be techrolled over and over to demonstrate a loop which would not be of any practicality in an actual match ..
- damage scaling in DOA is a bit similar to VF in a sense that it doesnt get affected by the opponents remaining health like say SF ... but it plays a bigger role in balancing out the damage than in VF due to the stage and guaranteed damage states it puts you in ..
in both games you require 3 mixups on average to land your kill .. so regardless of how either system works .. the net result of the match layout is pretty much the same ...
whether you like being stunned for a long time or not is one way to look at it ... another way is .. would you like a mid combo comeback mechanic (this is arguably similar to being -ve and punishable on hit in VF)? or turn it all into a shit storm and go into long stun + guaranteed damage all the way... (like say Tekken) ?
yes DOA and VF are VERY similar ... more so than what people think ..
evasion... is also very strong in DOA as it is in VF and is still a valid option in the neutral game .. infact in the last iteration of DOA sidestepping was adopted from VF... not just that .. the offensive SS from older VFs (pre VF5FS) was implemented ..
in order to balance out the system and make it a true Triangle system .. Sarah , Jacky and Akira got low throws in DOA .. (looking at the VF triangle system .. replacing hold with block... you will notice that these characters have no answer to a crouching block... which could be argued as a system flaw.. but lets not got there )
again .. both games are great and are very similar .. but you need a different mindset for both.
Having experience in both games I will try and elaborate ...
In VF:
- you have states where mid string you are negative on HIT ... meaning the opponent gets a chance to block, duck, sidestep, or even crush....
- you DO in-fact have long ass stun situations that give the opponent no chance to even stagger out of the followup, guaranteeing damage.
- after juggling, there are states that refloat, there are flops, there are bounces... (some techable some not) .. all contributing to the extended single hit damage.
- damage scaling is almost non exsistant excpept after exceeding agood amount of damage and even then is negligible in most cases
- you have "ringouts" in some stages ... which in many states its a 1 hit kill or even .. a stupid juggle that would "drag you all the way to the wall guaranteeing the kill.. having it with a half fence doesnt make this scenario any more justifiable.
- walls ... when played right = a shitstorm of damage ... (50% damage or more depending on character and counter hit)
now lets reflect this to the system you so call flawed in DOA ...
please note, I am not saying any one game is better ... but I'm just proving a point
- the stun system exists... how you choose to play it depends on your style (at high level) ..you can either know your frame data and put the opponent in a state where they cannot stagger escape limiting their defensive options to merely holding.. you can put the opponent in the opponent in situations where they cannot do anything.. or limit the mixup to merely stun > launch for guaranteed damage..
when looking at this with a VF mind this is very similar to what goes on in the 1st and 2nd points in VF
- yes there are powerblows and powerlaunchers ... but these are situational .. if you are too ignorant to see a move that requires over 30 frames to land then yes .. you deserve being smacked with a dry PB or PL .. but in most scenarios, in order to land it the player must reach a state where they can guarantee it ... which means the opponent must guess or defend incorrectly for at least 2-3 times (depending on the character) before a CB is landed in order to make the powerblow guaranteed ...
- when looking at how insane the damage is ... it can be argued that the damage achieved is no where near what you get from a wall in VF for one thing ... then theres the instant death in ringouts ...
instant death stage combos in DOA are NOT guaranteed in 99.99999999% of the cases and what you see all over youtube are just for show and of very little value. kinda like how in VF people would repeat a string which can be techrolled over and over to demonstrate a loop which would not be of any practicality in an actual match ..
- damage scaling in DOA is a bit similar to VF in a sense that it doesnt get affected by the opponents remaining health like say SF ... but it plays a bigger role in balancing out the damage than in VF due to the stage and guaranteed damage states it puts you in ..
in both games you require 3 mixups on average to land your kill .. so regardless of how either system works .. the net result of the match layout is pretty much the same ...
whether you like being stunned for a long time or not is one way to look at it ... another way is .. would you like a mid combo comeback mechanic (this is arguably similar to being -ve and punishable on hit in VF)? or turn it all into a shit storm and go into long stun + guaranteed damage all the way... (like say Tekken) ?
yes DOA and VF are VERY similar ... more so than what people think ..
evasion... is also very strong in DOA as it is in VF and is still a valid option in the neutral game .. infact in the last iteration of DOA sidestepping was adopted from VF... not just that .. the offensive SS from older VFs (pre VF5FS) was implemented ..
in order to balance out the system and make it a true Triangle system .. Sarah , Jacky and Akira got low throws in DOA .. (looking at the VF triangle system .. replacing hold with block... you will notice that these characters have no answer to a crouching block... which could be argued as a system flaw.. but lets not got there )
again .. both games are great and are very similar .. but you need a different mindset for both.
Now lets look at the similarities :
- Triangle system
- 3 button layout
- 3 hitlevels
- Crushes
- Sidesteps
- in both games juggles are the most efficient methods of guaranteed damage
- in both games the stage is dangerous
- both have tools to extend and refloat during juggles
- both have guaranteed situations in the ground game
- health is relatively lower than other fighting games ( and so is the timer)
I see far more similarities than differences if you ask me ..
- Triangle system
- 3 button layout
- 3 hitlevels
- Crushes
- Sidesteps
- in both games juggles are the most efficient methods of guaranteed damage
- in both games the stage is dangerous
- both have tools to extend and refloat during juggles
- both have guaranteed situations in the ground game
- health is relatively lower than other fighting games ( and so is the timer)
I see far more similarities than differences if you ask me ..
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Personally, I would love to have a VF x DOA happen.
Hold_Junkie93
Well-Known Member
I would say, I've used my VF experience to learn DoA. And even, Vice-Versa. I've never owned an XB, and only played 2. So, I've played more VFs than DoA, but didn't really take it seriously until VF5. Unfortunately, I don't have my VF main in DoA. (Eileen), the games go hand in hand, but only in a 3D aspect, and control scheme. I'd say, I like how they handled the VFers in DoA. Aside from certain cancels and move removals (Different systems though, so, not complaining) They are more fancy in DoA, (Akira is kind of the same but Pai cannot perform alot of basic variations of combos but that forces you to play better) VF & DoA teaming up was a great idea for 2 companies that aren't popular/or given enough credit as other FGs. As of recently, the 2 series, are something fans can be proud of more so than other time in history. VF is attracting new comers, now. DoA is no longer soley, a fan-serviced, hold driven, masher (Excuse the term). DoA has gotten more technical.
Hold_Junkie93
Well-Known Member
I know I'm late to the party but I want to bump this and say, anyone who is remotely interested in VF would not disrespect DoA over here. They'd be playing FS.ed Now, I prefer VF over DoA but that is simply because I found a home with the community there more and play it more. Now, I love them equally as games, just on a technical aspect VF is more my cup of tea. Fact is a lot of tekken players say DoA is harder in meta, which it definitely is. The stun system plays a huge role in it. Funny that is last suggestion was to remove stun escape. Which is funny because that is more akin to VF and me and vF players much prefer another defensive option as holds are risky. DoA6 wants people to get blown up For causals. This guy ain't a real VF player in the slightest. Someone ain't beating his ass enough .
UpSideDownGRUNT
Well-Known Member
Only 5 years late