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And, bluntly, other characters can do it better. Bayman's not great at force techs but there's at least one specific 90+ damage unholdable set up for a force tech for him and most of the others will net him 50 or so from one guess and +20 advantage. Tina's got straight force tech setups as well...

Shoudn't the 33kk setup work here too? Not that I mind using 9k but it is a high launcher.

Well, you're screwed either way if the low hold and you attempt to throw, and you're also screwed if you attempt to throw and they do nothing. Most of Mila's lead-in stuns (with the exception of 7k) aren't going to give you enough frame advantage to safely throw or to 3f+k without being blocked...

So, dumb question: are we talking about online throw punishment (in which case, it's pretty fucked, yeah) or actual offline frame punishment (which can easily net you 60-80 points and/or launches or considerable advantage depending on character)? While you realistically have to get down into the...

Does Bayman still get the frames if he lets the throw go, or do they actively have to break the throw to guarantee advantage? Not that most people won't try to break, I'm just curious if it makes a difference.

Yeah, the force tech is definitely key to her game. If you'd prefer to give up less damage the 1p 6f+k is 13 damage and still gives you +9 so it's not even that down on damage as compared to the usual ground throw. The only time I think ground throw might be more worthwhile is after a...

Disagreed. 9k is the only option if you're looking for a launch that will get you p+k after an initial stun and getting to p+k and mount as fast as possible is Mila's ideal situation outside of force tech situations. Whiffing a throw can be very dangerous as well, whereas 9k should be relatively...

Interesting. I suspect this will get patched out but it does make a 7p possibly a more effective option from stun. It means you can basically get a mid/low mixup between p+k and takedown cancel into 2p to set up a +11 reset. Theoretically you should be able to go p+k, p+k after 7p and possibly...

Not that this guy doesn't suck, but there's some kind of jihad going on here, damn. This is like four different character forums he's showed up in. Also, maybe he's just stupidly laggy?

This force tech is nifty as fuck; if Zack's got any serious juice I think it's going to come from here. It looks like this should work off a generic launch if timed properly; it's a dumb example but I've got it to work from 9k 3ppp, say, if you very slightly delay the last kick in pp2kkk. The...

Ok, so a bit more on 3k/4k after kk: Input is basically 663k, dash then put the kick in almost immediately. You can pause to hit confirm, if you continue the combo go ahead and launch with 33k or use 6f+k to knockdown. Advantage is +21 against a fastest stagger escape I think, so 33p doesn't...

Hope that went well! Anyway, so I thought I'd post on a couple of alternative extensions for completeness and mixups. I do think generally going 3p/9k after initial stun is the best option. However, 4k does tend to counterhit a lot and it's worth knowing the best way to follow up afterwards...

My understanding this was only from the BKO throw unless she can get into BKO quickly enough from other launchers? This works from normal stance and should work on everybody (need to test on Bass to be sure). Also, the frames appear to be much better whether they tech or not. The true force tech...

It just kind of sucks because heavy disadvantage is exactly where to use an OH, but the opponent can be pretty braindead and put in their biggest throw to counter if they expect it. Whereas if they had to worry about the 3 frames between 6f+p and 66f+p they might have to guess something quicker...

So it won't hit them on the ground? What I'm thinking it's it's timed to catch them as they land like after 33p4p sort of. If it doesn't work not a big deal. Just a thought.

People also really, really need to keep in mind online is not offline. If it's a problem online there's a good chance it's actually relatively easy to counter offline, and unfortunately you can't balance around online.* I'm not sure newer players get the distinction. I know the vets get it...

1p+k is i think +17 on fastest escape, but that means 3p and 9k both should still work for the combos above. So for these combos it's definitely a great opener. If you have a bit of space use the takedown cancel version, it's better on block. Abuse 4k as well. When you say leading in with 3p...

No, you're reading it right. My thought is that if you start it while they're in the air an active frame should hit when they hit the ground but it might still be techable though. Just wondered if that had been played with at all.

Yep. But the 8p stun from turnaround or limbo is longer, I'm not certain but I think CB might be guaranteed. I'll test and see for sure. If it works from limbo I think it should work from 3k assuming the stun threshold is sufficient.

So since the other force tech thread kind of died: I think this is threadworthy as it's important enough for general strategy discussion. Basically, it looks like several characters have setups from juggles where advantage can be guaranteed, since either the attack used to end the juggle will...