System Bad habit or good strategy?: “Respect” in fighting games

[Lulu]

I literally just read the title and decided to reply. Respect in any form of competition is a touchy subject, but (for me) here's the bottom line:

If you don't have respect in any game for your opponent you will eventually fall flat on your face. Point blank period. Taking a risk and respecting your opponent are two totally different things. Now, mind you, respect goes out of the window when the skill gap is very visible. On an equal playing field, you must respect your opponent.

We're still having trouble on what having respect means exactly.....

 

[WAZAAAAA]

Secondly....yeah that second paragraph is the self absorbed disrespectful attitude that we are talking about. The whole "I don't care how other people feel so long as I get a win and they can fuck off if they don't like it" is the wrong mentality to have for a multiplayer game, because people WILL fuck off and stop playing. We want people to be playing the game, not be pushed away by an elitist attitude.

I'm not trying to attack you personally but you're setting yourself up as a perfect example of what I'm talking about.

That's not even how I act, when I notice that the opponent lacks of the basic knowledge of the game mechanics, I ask him if he wants to learn them or not. At the same time, I fully understand the people who don't do it, they're not necessarily elitists for deciding to not spoonfeed others lol.


@Argentus @Awesmic @Kohlrak
Winning is objectively speaking the purpose of a match, while the possible outcomes are actually win/lose/draw, stop denying the obvious lol. And yes, winning's winning especially applies to fighting games, the rest is scrub talk.
Now, what you consider "fun" is all subjective and you're free to find anything fun or boring. Personally, the outcome of a match is irrelevant to me, it's the game itself that is fun. Even when I get roflshitstomped in spectacular ways. Even when I get lmaorekt with one single move over and over again (WAKE UP TORIYAH always gets me and that shit puts me a smile every time). Otherwise I wouldn't play this game lol
This guy gets it and is a perfect example for what I'm trying to say, "your fun" isn't the same as other people's fun:

Now let me tell you my "friends" version of having fun and let me see if everyones on the same page.

I enjoying beating my opponents and spamming the same move until my opponent realize how to counter it, i love taunting players because i find it funny of Honoka's Animation is. I want to kick you on the ground because i find it Fun and hilarious to do, sending hate mail after i beat you one time in rank match because i want to see you get angry and troll. This is everyone's way of having fun i have no doubt in my mind that everyone in here loves this and i don't care if i win or lose, getting you upset is Fun.

So what is your version of having fun? comment below

I'm not exactly into this stuff, but hey, that looks a lot of fun!

 

[Lulu]

That's not even how I act, when I notice that the opponent lacks of the basic knowledge of the game mechanics, I ask him if he wants to learn them or not. At the same time, I fully understand the people who don't do it, they're not necessarily elitists for deciding to not spoonfeed others lol.


@Argentus @Awesmic @Kohlrak
Winning is objectively speaking the purpose of a match, while the possible outcomes are actually win/lose/draw, stop denying the obvious lol. And yes, winning's winning especially applies to fighting games, the rest is scrub talk.
Now, what you consider "fun" is all subjective and you're free to find anything fun or boring. Personally, the outcome of a match is irrelevant to me, it's the game itself that is fun. Even when I get roflshitstomped in spectacular ways. Even when I get lmaorekt with one single move over and over again (WAKE UP TORIYAH always gets me and that shit puts me a smile every time). Otherwise I wouldn't play this game lol
This guy gets it and is a perfect example for what I'm trying to say, "your fun" isn't the same as other people's fun:
I'm not exactly into this stuff, but hey, that looks a lot of fun!

Are you sure ?
Being a douche can be very tempting.... you think back to a time when you use to be a scrun but instead of it triggering empathy it taps into your ego to be the Leet player you worked so hard to be..... its tempting..... hell even I'm guilty of it and I suck ass at Fighting Games..... I may hate my brother for kicking my ass in MK2 to but I'm sure someone out there resents me for doing the same thing to them..... ya know.... if I was actually capable of doing that..... I'm not that good........ yet.

 

[Awesmic]

@Argentus @Awesmic @Kohlrak
Winning is objectively speaking the purpose of a match, while the possible outcomes are actually win/lose/draw, stop denying the obvious lol. And yes, winning's winning especially applies to fighting games, the rest is scrub talk.
Now, what you consider "fun" is all subjective and you're free to find anything fun or boring. Personally, the outcome of a match is irrelevant to me, it's the game itself that is fun. Even when I get roflshitstomped in spectacular ways. Even when I get lmaorekt with one single move over and over again (WAKE UP TORIYAH always gets me and that shit puts me a smile every time). Otherwise I wouldn't play this game lol

You implied that I - of all people - am a scrub, yet I said earlier that I still believe in playing to win.

Before I get offended and start chewing you out, know this. I do not make self-imposed rules on what's allowed and not allowed in an actual match. I do not call tactics I can't overcome broken or cheap. And I sure as hell don't judge other players by the way they play, but you can damn sure bet they won't have my company based on how they act. I know the difference between what's allowed in the game and what's allowed on a personal level, and when that line is crossed with personal attacks like death threats and the like, I don't give a damn how skilled you are. That's wrong any day of the week.

That being said, I hope I made myself clear.

 

[Darkslay]

I literally just read the title and decided to reply. Respect in any form of competition is a touchy subject, but (for me) here's the bottom line:

If you don't have respect in any game for your opponent you will eventually fall flat on your face. Point blank period. Taking a risk and respecting your opponent are two totally different things. Now, mind you, respect goes out of the window when the skill gap is very visible. On an equal playing field, you must respect your opponent.

Now respect could also be applied to how exactly you deal with that skill gap.

You implied that I - of all people - am a scrub, yet I said earlier that I still believe in playing to win.

Before I get offended and start chewing you out, know this. I do not make self-imposed rules on what's allowed and not allowed in an actual match. I do not call tactics I can't overcome broken or cheap. And I sure as hell don't judge other players by the way they play, but you can damn sure bet they won't have my company based on how they act. I know the difference between what's allowed in the game and what's allowed on a personal level, and when that line is crossed with personal attacks like death threats and the like, I don't give a damn how skilled you are. That's wrong any day of the week.

That being said, I hope I made myself clear.

Classy, as to be expected from you. Well said sir.

 

[WAZAAAAA]

You implied that I - of all people - am a scrub, yet I said earlier that I still believe in playing to win.

Before I get offended and start chewing you out, know this. I do not make self-imposed rules on what's allowed and not allowed in an actual match. I do not call tactics I can't overcome broken or cheap. And I sure as hell don't judge other players by the way they play, but you can damn sure bet they won't have my company based on how they act. I know the difference between what's allowed in the game and what's allowed on a personal level, and when that line is crossed with personal attacks like death threats and the like, I don't give a damn how skilled you are. That's wrong any day of the week.

That being said, I hope I made myself clear.

Personal attacks? Death threats? What do these have to do with anything? They don't have anything to do with DOA or this thread specifically, the OP is discussing "disrespectful" INGAME stuff.
Maybe I misunderstood your post:

It's not so much about losing never being fun as opposed to this stigmatic belief that winning (and how you achieve the victory) is everything.

By saying "how you achieve the victory" there it looked like you are the kind of player that uses "self-imposed rules on what's allowed and not allowed in an actual match". But maybe I misunderstood, you were referring to... death threats instead?

 

[Awesmic]

Personal attacks? Death threats? What do these have to do with anything? They don't have anything to do with DOA or this thread specifically, the OP is discussing "disrespectful" INGAME stuff.
Maybe I misunderstood your post:
By saying "how you achieve the victory" there it looked like you are the kind of player that uses "self-imposed rules on what's allowed and not allowed in an actual match". But maybe I misunderstood, you were referring to... death threats instead?

I was observing their way of thinking, not myself.

 

[Bushido]

We're still having trouble on what having respect means exactly.....

....What?

 

[Argentus]

I literally just read the title and decided to reply. Respect in any form of competition is a touchy subject, but (for me) here's the bottom line:

If you don't have respect in any game for your opponent you will eventually fall flat on your face. Point blank period. Taking a risk and respecting your opponent are two totally different things. Now, mind you, respect goes out of the window when the skill gap is very visible. On an equal playing field, you must respect your opponent.

Id argue that respect can be even more important with a skill gap.


As in the "play to win" mindset doesn't hold much weight is so outclassed you can win without even looking at the TV.

You don't see an Olympic swimmer in the kiddy pool yaknow?

 

[Bushido]

Id argue that respect can be even more important with a skill gap.


As in the "play to win" mindset doesn't hold much weight is so outclassed you can win without even looking at the TV.

You don't see an Olympic swimmer in the kiddy pool yaknow?

There are different expressions of respect. Such as the respect for your father is different from the respect of an athlete. Here, from my understanding, it's about having respect for your opponent as a force of opposition. If the skill gap is huge, then a person should have enough respect for them as a player to help out. If this doesn't make sense...sorry.

 

[Lulu]

....What?

I mean the specifics of what constitutes respectful behavior.

 

[Bushido]

I mean the specifics of what constitutes respectful behavior.

It's....not that difficult

 

[Lulu]

I think it is.... considering how different people are.

 

[Bushido]

If we're looking from that angle, then this thread would be useless, since everyone is different. From that perspective, it's impossible to come up with a consensus on what "respect" truly is in competition.

 

[Brute]

If we're looking from that angle, then this thread would be useless

 

[Lulu]

Indeed.... on the plus side we can come up with a list of things that are disrespectful..... I think that's easier.

 

[Bushido]

Seems like the same thing to me.

 

[Kohlrak]

If you mean being part of the solution, then yeah. The problem is that the current community's perception of me is split down the middle, so it's hard to stay positive sometimes, try as I might these days. But I'm doing something about that in my own way.

Sometimes you have to continue on even without approval. Sometimes you have to stand alone. Sometimes you find out that "the majority" is silent. Sometimes you have to continue on even when they aren't. This is character, and it's hard.

That's not even how I act, when I notice that the opponent lacks of the basic knowledge of the game mechanics, I ask him if he wants to learn them or not. At the same time, I fully understand the people who don't do it, they're not necessarily elitists for deciding to not spoonfeed others lol.

Perhaps not, but tehy're making it harder on themselves to have a good game if they keep taking from the system without putting it back in.

@Argentus @Awesmic @Kohlrak
Winning is objectively speaking the purpose of a match, while the possible outcomes are actually win/lose/draw, stop denying the obvious lol. And yes, winning's winning especially applies to fighting games, the rest is scrub talk.

You asked us what the benefit is of playing the game. We don't benefit from winning for the most part. We only benefit from playing. How many people chase after people for the chase, not the relationship? Games are the same way. If it wasn't about the chase, then it's tetris 1d time.

Now, what you consider "fun" is all subjective and you're free to find anything fun or boring. Personally, the outcome of a match is irrelevant to me, it's the game itself that is fun. Even when I get roflshitstomped in spectacular ways. Even when I get lmaorekt with one single move over and over again (WAKE UP TORIYAH always gets me and that shit puts me a smile every time). Otherwise I wouldn't play this game lol
This guy gets it and is a perfect example for what I'm trying to say, "your fun" isn't the same as other people's fun:
I'm not exactly into this stuff, but hey, that looks a lot of fun!

And i don't feel like cutting this piece of paper with a pair of scissors; i'd rather use a knife instead. The person oMaster Legendo mentioned was a troll, and normally you kick such people out of your community for being counter-productive (and, they usually don't mind). If i were to have fun finding 12 year olds and purposely using skimpy outfits and start talking dirty to the kids, should we approve of this as well (obvious child exploitation aside)? Some people just want to see the world burn, so should we cater to them at all or call them out? I don't see the point in bringing this guy up, because the fun you claim he exclusively holds is the kind that should be condemned if we want to have a positive community. What "different kinds of fun" should we actually cater to and support and which ones should we condemn? If we want to simply accept everything without an argument or issue, nothing is going to change.

Personal attacks? Death threats? What do these have to do with anything? They don't have anything to do with DOA or this thread specifically, the OP is discussing "disrespectful" INGAME stuff.

It carries.

It's....not that difficult

Start reading backwards.

Oddly enough, it would seem we've gotten to the point that we're too politically correct to call assholes assholes, simply because they enjoy being assholes. You enjoy playing the game by being an asshole? Fine, you're an asshole, so be ready when people treat you like one. If the community accept you, then the community should be willing to accept the consequences of accepting assholes. (Which isn't always bad, but this is a video game, not programming or something else where we can expect actual maturity.)

 

[oMASTER LEGENDo]

That's not even how I act, when I notice that the opponent lacks of the basic knowledge of the game mechanics, I ask him if he wants to learn them or not. At the same time, I fully understand the people who don't do it, they're not necessarily elitists for deciding to not spoonfeed others lol.


@Argentus @Awesmic @Kohlrak
Winning is objectively speaking the purpose of a match, while the possible outcomes are actually win/lose/draw, stop denying the obvious lol. And yes, winning's winning especially applies to fighting games, the rest is scrub talk.
Now, what you consider "fun" is all subjective and you're free to find anything fun or boring. Personally, the outcome of a match is irrelevant to me, it's the game itself that is fun. Even when I get roflshitstomped in spectacular ways. Even when I get lmaorekt with one single move over and over again (WAKE UP TORIYAH always gets me and that shit puts me a smile every time). Otherwise I wouldn't play this game lol
This guy gets it and is a perfect example for what I'm trying to say, "your fun" isn't the same as other people's fun:
I'm not exactly into this stuff, but hey, that looks a lot of fun!

You read the book too awesome if everyone on this site had a chance to look at the information http://www.sirlin.net/ptw everyone new to the FGC would understand instead of explaining the same thing 24/7 Lol.

 

[Lulu]

You read the book too awesome if everyone on this site had a chance to look at the information http://www.sirlin.net/ptw everyone new to the FGC would understand instead of explaining the same thing 24/7 Lol.

I haven't read the book.... I read the articles on his website...... appearently the last rule of playing to win is that going all out all the time is not always a good idea.... if you can help it... sometimes its better to experiment, you might discover something that can help you win even more.

This is something Seth Killian left out while he was trash talking noobs and telling everybody to "git gud" in his Domination 101 Articles.