System Free Step Dash Cancel Bug

illninofan

Well-Known Member
There's tech and then there's this.

I can't wait to try it out. How would one even go about finding something like this?

EDIT: Noob question, but what EXACTLY is an unholdable?
 

AlexXsWx

Active Member
How would one even go about finding something like this?
After seeing the original gif with Christie I just spammed that situation for long time until it happened again. Each time it was giving a little more information, until I recreated it with a macros. Then it was about cleaning up the macros
what EXACTLY is an unholdable?
After you techroll you become vulnerable to incoming attacks 1 frame before you can potentially hold (because of the idle frame). You can only block such attacks. Attempting to hold or to sidestep will result in you taking the hit. That is called unholdable aka unsidesteppable
 

illninofan

Well-Known Member
After seeing the original gif with Christie I just spammed that situation for long time until it happened again. Each time it was giving a little more information, until I recreated it with a macros. Then it was about cleaning up the macros

Sounds like a case of serendipity in the first instance, meaning the original did it by luck, and then you happened to come along and recreate it through experimentation/trial and error, and refined it with tools so that it can be (more) easily and consistently replicated.

Is that right?

After you techroll you become vulnerable to incoming attacks 1 frame before you can potentially hold (because of the idle frame). You can only block such attacks. Attempting to hold or to sidestep will result in you taking the hit. That is called unholdable aka unsidesteppable

Thanks! That clears some things up.
 

AlexXsWx

Active Member
Sounds like a case of serendipity in the first instance, meaning the original did it by luck, and then you happened to come along and recreate it through experimentation/trial and error, and refined it with tools so that it can be (more) easily and consistently replicated
Yep, that's right
 

GarryJaune

Well-Known Member
We know it does as of the e3 build because it was verified that the e3 build had unholdables. The system that allows for unholdables also is what allows for this bug.
damn I heard that bug is hardly fixed,hope it won't effect DOA6‘s releasing
 

Matt Ponton

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How would one even go about finding something like this?

There's been times in the past people have tried looking into this bug since it was first seen in DOA4. @AlexXsWx did some good work with this. Back in Jan 2016, @UncleKitchener and I were trying to replicate the Bass OH glitch you can see earlier in this thread to no avail. When @WAZAAAAA started making tools for the PC version he joined in helping to find it.


We then had @iHajinShinobi help out as he was able to get it a few times with Ayane. This was all back in 2016, spanning the entire year doing research.


It's funny looking back at those videos because now that we know what to look for to do the FSDC thanks to Alex, you can see it happening there. However, at the time we had no clue 2 years ago what we were looking for and Wazaa couldn't even replicate it yet.

So props to Alex.
 

WAZAAAAA

Well-Known Member
and Wazaa couldn't even replicate it yet.
to be fair even now I have yet to do it by hand
1.0
 

Matt Ponton

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It would be more interesting to see something like Tina's 8K or Lisa's 66K (If that's even possible) on block.

Tina's 8K wouldn't be possible because it doesn't have a Followup Interval for the string. Lisa's 66K could be possible. In most cases it's easy to figure out what would be the changes should you FSDC a move.

For example, Lisa's :6::6::K: is a GB of -6. Its first frame of the Followup Interval is on Frame 33. The move itself is 23(3)57, with a total frame count of 83 (23+3+57).

Given that, take the total frame count (87) and subtract the first frame of the interval (33) to get 54. So the move will lose 54 frames of animation, making her :6::6::K: be a GB of 48 (-6 + 54).
to be fair even now I haven't done it once by hand
1.0

I think the only ones I've seen do it by hand so far are @DestructionBomb , @MASTER , and XCalibur BladeZ.
 

NewWestFan

Well-Known Member
Premium Donor
For example, Lisa's :6::6::K: is a GB of -6. Its first frame of the Followup Interval is on Frame 33. The move itself is 23(3)57, with a total frame count of 83 (23+3+57).

Given that, take the total frame count (87) and subtract the first frame of the interval (33) to get 54. So the move will lose 54 frames of animation, making her :6::6::K: be a GB of 48 (-6 + 54).
That would be immense for her if it could be reliably done.
 

KasumiLover

xX_APO_Prince_Xx
Premium Donor
Tina's 8K wouldn't be possible because it doesn't have a Followup Interval for the string. Lisa's 66K could be possible. In most cases it's easy to figure out what would be the changes should you FSDC a move.

For example, Lisa's :6::6::K: is a GB of -6. Its first frame of the Followup Interval is on Frame 33. The move itself is 23(3)57, with a total frame count of 83 (23+3+57).

Given that, take the total frame count (87) and subtract the first frame of the interval (33) to get 54. So the move will lose 54 frames of animation, making her :6::6::K: be a GB of 48 (-6 + 54).


I think the only ones I've seen do it by hand so far are @DestructionBomb , @MASTER , and XCalibur BladeZ.
By follow up interval you mean the ability to do a follow up right? And do no delay strings like Naotora's 8KK count in that spectrum since you have to immediately press the follow up for it to be a combo since it can be delayed?
 

Matt Ponton

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By follow up interval you mean the ability to do a follow up right?
CY6hur.jpg


It's which frames in the move performed accept input for the next attack in the string. There are some moves that have followup intervals though that don't have string followups (like Hayabusa's :2::H+K:), but those are most likely a bug in themselves - left over from DOAD or DOA4 previous strings removed.

So in the above example, the :P::P: string will register if it registers you pressing :P: between frames 16 and 29 of the :P: move animation. If you press it after frame 29 then it won't extend the string.
 

KasumiLover

xX_APO_Prince_Xx
Premium Donor
CY6hur.jpg


It's which frames in the move performed accept input for the next attack in the string. There are some moves that have followup intervals though that don't have string followups (like Hayabusa's :2::H+K:), but those are most likely a bug in themselves - left over from DOAD or DOA4 previous strings removed.

So in the above example, the :P::P: string will register if it registers you pressing :P: between frames 16 and 29 of the :P: move animation. If you press it after frame 29 then it won't extend the string.
Ok! I'll shoot for those string intervals! That's probably why the Naotora one I tried didn't work xD
 

Fantailler

Well-Known Member
This bug is crazy... I managed to replicate it by hand and it opens up a lot of possibilities...

Why adding meter when cancel/fadc is already an ingame feature :rolleyes:

Legit tool like sf2 ? If releasing a button was also considered an input it would be easier to perform it.

When i see that,i almost want it in DOA6 using half a meter...instead of fatal rush.

Anyway gg guys !
 

Camel with 2 thumbs

Well-Known Member
This bug is crazy... I managed to replicate it by hand and it opens up a lot of possibilities...

Why adding meter when cancel/fadc is already an ingame feature :rolleyes:

Legit tool like sf2 ? If releasing a button was also considered an input it would be easier to perform it.

When i see that,i almost want it in DOA6 using half a meter...instead of fatal rush.

Anyway gg guys !

This is totally meterless FADC'ing lol

I wonder if this will be like SF4 infinites, never got patched out so they're still there but because "infinites are hard" you didn't really see them in competitive play, only time will tell
 
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